Norway Maple SGA Root Girdling – Can this be saved?

[tedantle]

This is tree is approximately 15 years old. I have lived here for 10 years. Noticed thinning crown this year. After a little dirt removal I have found the roots are girdled. Should I have it "air spaded" and repaired or is it too old... too far gone?

Thank you,

Ted

 

[ATH]

That is pretty rough! Lots of root to be cut out. I'd probably try, with relatively low expectations. If I were being hired to do that, I'd explain those low expectations and let the client decide if they want to try. those are tough to quote because it is tough to know what is down there until you start digging and cutting. I'd probably quote $250 to start with the option to go to $400 depending on how long it takes.

 

[Jed1124]

Like ATH said that’s a biggun!

Norway Maples are pretty tough. I’d try cutting it out and see what happens. I would be surprised if it can be saved but if your doing it yourself why not?
I don’t see any reason to have it airspaded, you already have most of the girdling exposes.
Just keep cutting until you hit the buttress roots. You want to get the roots off the trunk of the tree. Roots that are girdled over roots will fuse.

 

[tedantle]

Like ATH said that’s a biggun!

Norway Maples are pretty tough. I’d try cutting it out and see what happens. I would be surprised if it can be saved but if your doing it yourself why not?
I don’t see any reason to have it airspaded, you already have most of the girdling exposes.
Just keep cutting until you hit the buttress roots. You want to get the roots off the trunk of the tree. Roots that are girdled over roots will fuse.

Thank you ATH and Jed1124. I'm basically a civilian. My concern is girdling fused to the buttress roots or the "base of the tree above the flare". I really want to keep it a few more years. Jed1124, I appreciate your optimism regarding Norway's being pretty tough.

 

[tedantle]

Thank you ATH and Jed1124. I'm basically a civilian. My concern is girdling fused to the buttress roots or the "base of the tree above the flare". I really want to keep it a few more years. Jed1124, I appreciate your optimism regarding Norway's being pretty tough.

Like ATH said that’s a biggun!

Norway Maples are pretty tough. I’d try cutting it out and see what happens. I would be surprised if it can be saved but if your doing it yourself why not?
I don’t see any reason to have it airspaded, you already have most of the girdling exposes.
Just keep cutting until you hit the buttress roots. You want to get the roots off the trunk of the tree. Roots that are girdled over roots will fuse.

You really think this could be a "do it yourself'r"? I do have a hand held sazall -sp. ;-)

 

[andy]

Timing will be crucial.
Enough long days remaining that it's still flowing sap to heal but, not so early in summer that heat is still an issue.

 

[ATH]

You really think this could be a "do it yourself'r"? I do have a hand held sazall -sp. ;-)

It isn't rocket science... Experience certainly helps do things much more efficiently. There are always questionable roots to. On a tree that bad, I'd probably only take off roots contacting the trunk now, planning to do others that will be future problems in a couple of years to avoid too much impact at once.

Just don't get into the bark of the trunk. Get a set of cheap chisels too. I haven't tried yet, but I think an oscillating multi-tool will be good to use for SGRs. A sawzall is a great tool using pruning blades. I've started throwing those away a little quicker. They are about $3 each. When it gets dull, I used to be too cheap to throw it away. I've come to realize that if I can save 15-20 minutes on a $300 job by spending an extra $9 on blades it is a pretty good ROI!

 

[Raintree]

I like your optimism guys. That Norway is severely girdled 360 degrees with the whole upper canopy in decline. I'd just leave it alone she may start to graft, even so she'll never be a specimen. Start the replacement tree near by. Any cutting on those large choking roots you'll see wilting in the lower limbs.

 

[tedantle]

Timing will be crucial.
Enough long days remaining that it's still flowing sap to heal but, not so early in summer that heat is still an issue.

I really appreciate the optimism. I'm leaning towards a "hail Mary pass".

 

[tedantle]

I like your optimism guys. That Norway is severely girdled 360 degrees with the whole upper canopy in decline. I'd just leave it alone she may start to graft, even so she'll never be a specimen. Start the replacement tree near by. Any cutting on those large choking roots you'll see wilting in the lower limbs.

Raintree: I'm very slowly removing more material from the base. Yes, it appears 360 degree's. But! At one point there appears to be an opening. For this tree to have this much foliage, with this amount of girdling, seems like this baby has heart.

 

[tedantle]

It isn't rocket science... Experience certainly helps do things much more efficiently. There are always questionable roots to. On a tree that bad, I'd probably only take off roots contacting the trunk now, planning to do others that will be future problems in a couple of years to avoid too much impact at once.

Just don't get into the bark of the trunk. Get a set of cheap chisels too. I haven't tried yet, but I think an oscillating multi-tool will be good to use for SGRs. A sawzall is a great tool using pruning blades. I've started throwing those away a little quicker. They are about $3 each. When it gets dull, I used to be too cheap to throw it away. I've come to realize that if I can save 15-20 minutes on a $300 job by spending an extra $9 on blades it is a pretty good ROI!

Regarding removing from bark and the chisel, is there a video? I paranoid about damaging the root flare (bark) right when it's needed most.

 

[Raintree]

It's my experience once the girdling root has molded to the stem of the tree. Successful extraction is drastically reduced. Potential injury to the tree warrants no action.

 

[tedantle]

It's my experience once the girdling root has molded to the stem of the tree. Successful extraction is drastically reduced. Potential injury to the tree warrants no action.

Ouch

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[ATH]

there is probably a video somewhere. I'v thought about making one...but I'm usually too busy working to mess with that. I hear there is money in Youtubing stuff, but I just don't have the time/ambition to spend doing that. You just need to slow down when you get to the end of the root. I'd rather leave a few shavings (disconnected from tissue on either side) than dig too deep.

 

[tedantle]

there is probably a video somewhere. I'v thought about making one...but I'm usually too busy working to mess with that. I hear there is money in Youtubing stuff, but I just don't have the time/ambition to spend doing that. You just need to slow down when you get to the end of the root. I'd rather leave a few shavings (disconnected from tissue on either side) than dig too deep.

Do you like the, 1/3 remove, 1/3 partial, 1/3 do nothing... technique?

1/3 of tree, fully remove girdle

1/3 partial girdle removal

1/3 do nothing

Re-assess in a couple of years.

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[ATH]

Like I said, I don't like its chances...however for it to have a chance, I think you gotta get any roots that are constricting the trunk outta there. Leave as many as you can that are not contacting the trunk yet.

I'm not sure what "partial girdle removal" means...it is either putting pressure on the trunk or it is not.

 

[tedantle]

Like I said, I don't like its chances...however for it to have a chance, I think you gotta get any roots that are constricting the trunk outta there. Leave as many as you can that are not contacting the trunk yet.

I'm not sure what "partial girdle removal" means...it is either putting pressure on the trunk or it is not.

ATH: Thank you.

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[andy]

I really appreciate the optimism. I'm leaning towards a "hail Mary pass".

I hear you.
Thing is, A Hail Mary needs to be thrown with time closing in on the game clock running.
Thrown mid game..... you may just be throwing the ball away

 

[tedantle]

Revised photos: Possibly to help with approach discussion.

 

[tedantle]

I hear you.
Thing is, A Hail Mary needs to be thrown with time closing in on the game clock running.
Thrown mid game..... you may just be throwing the ball away

Thank you Andy, hard to end a bad relationship. ;-)

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