points to electronic ignition

[Stihlwrench]

I'm trying to convert a 011av from points & condenser to electronic ignition. The bottom of the electronic flywheel won't fit down over the points housing so I'm using the old flywheel. Here's the rub: the keyway slots on the old wheel and the new wheel are about 2 or 3 degrees apart, so I can't time the engine with the key in... I can't seem to time it with the key out either!! This is why I'm posting this. Is there a foumula I can use or is it just tedious trial & error? Thanks.

 

[RaisedByWolves]

I cant speak for stihls but many saws require the new flywheel that goes with the electronic coil for the new ignition to work.

 

[Stihlwrench]

Well I asked one of the Stihl techs at Blue Mountain that very thing and he said it really shouldn't matter. The saw hits with the timing just slightly advanced but I can't get it running...I think I'm missing something here and I know there's someone on here that has done this.

 

[PES+]

Are you using the Stihl chip? If so which one?
If it is a two lead chip try reversing the leads and time without key

 

[Lakeside53]

You probably have something else wrong... a few degrees either way it will still "run", but not optimally. Does it fire if you put mix gas down the carb? If that's what you eman but "hit" then start looking at your carb and reed block assembly. Do a quick seacch on AS - there are posts on the older reed issues.

Reversing the leads on a typical module changes the ignition about 10-12 degrees (depends on the magnet spacing and flywheel), far more than the optimized 2-3 (your number) stihl might have figured out with the replacement flywheel, but try anything...


Try taking a die grinder to the case and knock back the raised casting that's interfering with your electronic flywheel. Don't grind the flywheel...

 

[Stihlwrench]

Are you using the Stihl chip? If so which one?
If it is a two lead chip try reversing the leads and time without key

I'm TRYING to time it w/o the key(without much luck). I'll try reversing the leads... Keep watching this thread if you don't mind, I'll report progress. Thanks.

 

[Stihlwrench]

You probably have something else wrong... a few degrees either way it will still "run", but not optimally. Does it fire if you put mix gas down the carb? If that's what you eman but "hit" then start looking at your carb and reed block assembly. Do a quick seacch on AS - there are posts on the older reed issues.

Reversing the leads on a typical module changes the ignition about 10-12 degrees (depends on the magnet spacing and flywheel), far more then the optimized 2-3 (your number) stihl might have figured out with the replacement flywheel, but try anything...


Try taking a die grinder to the case and knock back the raised casting that's interfering with your electronic flywheel. Don't grind the flywheel...

I already kitted the carb and checked the reed block...I don't feel like it's a fuel issue. I'm gonna try reversing the leads like y'all suggested but what I'm looking for is where I can set the magnets with the piston at TDC. The saw is trying to run but I can't seem to find the sweet spot. Here's a clue: The magnets on the old flywheel and the new flywheel are spaced the same but I wonder if they're of different strengths... I appreciate the support.

 

[sugarbush]

I already kitted the carb and checked the reed block...I don't feel like it's a fuel issue. I'm gonna try reversing the leads like y'all suggested but what I'm looking for is where I can set the magnets with the piston at TDC. The saw is trying to run but I can't seem to find the sweet spot. Here's a clue: The magnets on the old flywheel and the new flywheel are spaced the same but I wonder if they're of different strengths... I appreciate the support.

try it with original flywheel and key in place. if your useing a nova module try reversing your wires as others has suggested. should run.

 

[PES+]

So you are using the two lead chip. OK.....do you have the coil from an 011 that used the small single wire chip under the flywheel? Or do you have a coil from the points? I have seen a few of these points coils failing just recently

As someone said use your original flywheel with the key with a coil that has 2 leads make sure you remove the coil wire that runs to the points so that it does not complicate life. I have seen chips installed and the installer has left the points lead on the coil and just added the chip to it...that makes for some interesting symptoms.

I will not ask how someone calculated that switching the chip leads changes timing 10 to 12 degrees but I think he may be thinking that swapping the leads makes the igntion fire after the magnets pass the core instead of before and that is not how it works....it is the reversal of polarity that is achieved...the coil core still charges at the same time with either polarity an ignition with out a seperate trigger winding always fires in the same spot dictated by the coil/magnet relationship

It would be best to check your points coil with a coil tester or try another coil if this doesn't get you running....Also check all your leads as I worked on one 011 last week that had a loose connection on the chip as it is tight quarters under the 011 starter housing

 

[Lakeside53]

Yes, the coil always charges the same, but when you trigger can be a wide window.... the 10-12 degrees is a theory based on the measurements of the 031 flywheels, coils and their issues with conversion.

I'm pretty sure the 011 coil only has one wire to the points/off-on.... (plus the HT).

I'm with the other posters - put you key back in, check your spark, and see what's happping. You need to mark TDC on the flywheel (anywhere). You can use a piston stop to find TDC. Make an index pointing at the flywheel, rotate left, make a mark, rotate right, make a mark - TDC is exactly half way between those two marks. The less it protrudes to the piston the closer the marks will be togther.

Just spin the flywheel counter clockwise (spark plug not installed but grounded to the cylinder fins) with a fast battery powered drill (1000 rpm is ok) and use a timing light to see what happening.


There is one more thing to check that's got me now and then - the HT lead runs in a convoluted manner and passed/in the cylinder fins - make sure it's not shorting or breaking down with each spark fire. I had a heck of a job getting one to run right, and it was dark by the time I tried it for the "last time".. sparks everwhere...

 

[RiverRat2]

There is one more thing to check that's got me now and then - the HT lead runs in a convoluted manner and passed/in the cylinder fins - make sure it's not shorting or breaking down with each spark fire. I had a heck of a job getting one to run right, and it was dark by the time I tried it for the "last time".. sparks everwhere...

Found it in the dark did we????? BTDT on and old Magneto fired Harley Flathead 80 thing was driving me crazy untill I worked on it long enough to get dark one evening,,,,looked like an lightning storm,,,, thing would run, spit, pop, and backfire,,, sounded rather ill,,,,, till I changed out the dryrotted wire