rappelling

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luckylogger

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whats the best way to rappell out of a tree? i normally put my rope around the tree, tie a bolend with a long tail to my belt, then tie a tautline hitch with the tail to the rope coming from my rope bag.
ive used this system for years. if you rapell fairly slow the rope doesn,t heat up. any better ideas?:monkey:
 
i use a friction saver...then have a split tail...but if its a log way...i have a figure 8 clipped on...they are easy to use and rappell right down
 
For a long rappel a figure eight is your best bet. Some say that that should be backed with a friction hitch or a prussik chord as a back up. I prefer a Blake's hitch to a tautline for a short descent. It doesn't tighten up like a tautline.
 
I used to teach rock climbing adn rappelling to scouts and youth organizations about 20 years ago. We originally used "brake bars" on non-locking caribiners as the braking device. We changed over to figure eights when they became commonly available. When I moved over to tree climbing, I kept using the 8. I ALWAYS back it up with a friction knot of some sort, usually a Blake's Hitch. We never used backups like that on the rocks, but it sure makes good sense to have a second safety. I've never known anyone to zip to the ground after a failure when using both the 8 and a hitch. I violated my own safety rules once when working in a small tree. When rappelling down, I thought it was too short of a ride to bother adding the 8 to the setup. As I was backing down quickly, using just the Blake's Hitch and gaffs, I sank a gaff too deep into the tree to easily pull it out. But... the hitch continued to slip. I turned horizontal and the gaff puled out and I hit the ground flat on my back. Thankfully, it was a VERY short drop and I wasn't hurt. But it taught me to NEVER deviate from smart practice.
 
I did a very long rappel, on an 8 once, w/o backup and I got a wee bit scared around 1/2 way through and still ~90ft to go.

If you do it with regularity, then an ID from Petzl would be a good tool.

When coming off a spar I will often use my pull rope to descend (bad climber, bad!) with a Munter. There is a lot of rope on rope friction, and you can see the fibers coming off
 
As a mountaineer I generally use my belay device for raps, currently a black diamond ATC pro. I always back up my raps with either a mechanical device like a Petzl shunt or a tension knot like an autoblock. The climbing community has gotten away from figure 8 because repeated use under weight (raps) cause the ropes to baddy kink.

Rapping off the end of the line is a too common occurance in the climbing world. Just last week a well respected climber went off the end of his line in the Dacks.

Stay safe.
 
Chinooker said:
As a mountaineer I generally use my belay device for raps, currently a black diamond ATC pro.
I need to call you on that. What is an ATC pro?

In trees, most of the time is spent controlling friction so you can position yourself precisely for cuts and/or rigging maneuvers, and schlepp tools around up there. Much of the time aloft is also not spent loading the device, but in passing rope back through it to advance it along with you (slack tending).


1/2 inch is 12.7mm, often referred to as 13 mm line.

13 mm does not lend itself to CURRENT devices because very few in the world outside tree climbers uses 1/2 inch line. Everyone uses 11mm, so devices are built and sized to 11 mm and historically have been that way.
That excludes most of us.

Also, since we have historically (almost religiously) used the friction hitch for our friction control, makers of friction devices have seen no profit motive in making friction pieces for the treeguy community.

Of the two notable 'Treeguy' devices, the Unicender and the Lockjack, those are both modeled to accomodate our 2:1 ascent/descent system. Neither does SRT, so you're limited. Neither goes 1:1 ascent or descent.

So we, as a population and as an industry, and now I'm generally speaking, we have just stuck with the friction hitch and a 2:1 system and tying lots of knots.

We are climbing in the dark ages. I don't know how else to say it. We climb in a unique sphere, mostly cut off from all other climbing disciplines.
Entry requirement into the tree climbing industry, learn to use a friction hitch and climb 2:1. :help:
 
I hope I don't sound insulting. It's not meant to be. It's just a general observation over the last dozen years in the industry and half decade on the climbing forum sites.

Tree Climbers make climbing harder than what it is, which can be hard to begin with.
 
hey tm can you explain what you mean by tree climbers make climbing harder...
i don't know any diff then trees..

also is it acceptable..to use rock climbing descenders? i personally don't like the 8 but a petzel descender is nice to use once and awhile.
 
also is it acceptable..to use rock climbing descenders? i personally don't like the 8 but a petzel descender is nice to use once and awhile.

It is OK to use any device that is;
  • load rated
  • rated for your rope diameter
  • man rated (ie it is rated for human suspention)
  • and you understand how it works
 
I wanna hear about the Huey Chopper.



00chris85 said:
hey tm can you explain what you mean by tree climbers make climbing harder...
i don't know any diff then trees..

All I mean is the difference between 2:1 and 1:1 systems, and precision friction control over struggling against it.


That's all, in a nutshell.


John Paul got it all right, except didn't mention what the rated device should be capable of.


There are hundreds of rated devices, a mere handful that do 13 mm rope, a fraction of those that would go from 11 mm to 13 mm, fewer yet of those that are made specifically for the Arborist Industry and finally, a fraction of those devices that will do all of the above, plus allow you to descend 2:1 doubled, 1:1 doubled and 1:1 SRT, in that tiny pool of devices...., wait, I think the pool is empty.
 
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