Really disgusted with Kohler....
- Thread starter avalancher
- Start date
Help Support Arborist Forum:
gtstang462002
ArboristSite Operative
Did you get his direct number and extension. So that when in 2 weeks the stuff he claimed to ship out hasn't shown up yet you can call him directly and ask where it is?
My only question to them would be why is would the timing being off only affect one cylinder?
Barnie
ArboristSite Operative
Cant you just swap the engine for a better make like a Honda or something
avalancher
Arboristsite Raconteur
Believe it or not, the parts showed up yesterday. A new head, gasket kit with head bolts, and the offset flywheel key.
After removing the flywheel cover, we discovered that sure enough it had just a regular key in the flywheel, not an offset one as it should.
I swapped the valves into the new head, installed the new offset key and new head, and ran it last night for about 3 hours. So far everything seems to work just fine. It also for the first time quite the lopping that it has always done at idle. Dealer before said it was common for this engine to do that, now it doesnt. Purrs just fine on idle.
I asked hank the same question about affecting just one cylinder, and his answer seemed reasonable.
He theorized that when the first gasket went, it warped the head enough to make it the weak link. Although the head was within tolerence, it was still the weak link.
I will be keeping my fingers crossed on this one, but it looks like Hank hit the nail right on the head.
Last edited:
avalancher
Arboristsite Raconteur
I am sure that I could, but when you consider the cost of these engines, I would be far better off buying a new tractor. The engine alone is in the neighborhood of 2K, I only paid a little over 3K for the whole thing.
I dont know what a Honda would run in this horsepower, but I sure it would be in the same neighborhood as the Kohler.
gtstang462002
ArboristSite Operative
The only way to know for sure if that cures is it to take it out and flog on her a little... She holds she is strong, she blows she is gone.
jags
ArboristSite Guru
Avalancher - I sure hope your recent parts swap fix your problem for the long term......but, if you find that you blow another head gasket, I have a suggestion.
From long ago, I had this problem with a single lung Kohler. The fix was: cutting about an 1/8" to 3/16" (or grinding) off of the head bolts. The bolts were not the defective part, but the holes were. The bolts bottomed out, just shy of where they should be. It was enough that the head "seemed" tight, and you could torque the bolts, but it simply didn't put the pressure on the head. Shortening the bolts by a small amount fixed the problem. Just an idea.
From long ago, I had this problem with a single lung Kohler. The fix was: cutting about an 1/8" to 3/16" (or grinding) off of the head bolts. The bolts were not the defective part, but the holes were. The bolts bottomed out, just shy of where they should be. It was enough that the head "seemed" tight, and you could torque the bolts, but it simply didn't put the pressure on the head. Shortening the bolts by a small amount fixed the problem. Just an idea.
avalancher
Arboristsite Raconteur
That is an excellent idea, I wonder why Kohler tech support never thought of that? I know that there is no doubt in my mind that they were torqued to specs this last time, but like you said its not a bolt problem but a hole problem. I will definetly measure those holes next time and if there is any doubt I will shorten those bolts up a bit.
Thanks for the advise, that was not something that even occured to me before.
You learn something new every day!
Junkfxr
ArboristSite Operative
I was looking at Husqvarna's website the other day and noticed that they don't offer Kohler engines in their garden tractors any more, hmmmm. Just a suggestion if this latest fix doesn't work, have you considered looking at an older used Deere 300 or 400 series garden tractor? The gas powered ones used Onans. The only parts that I've had to replace are the voltage regulator, fuel pump, and starter. Not bad for 23 years of abuse. There are still quite a few 318's in really good shape out there for reasonable prices. Our 1985 318 has fluid filled bar tires and a cat. 0 3 point hitch. It mows the yard, plows the garden, pushes snow, spreads gravel, drags logs, hauls firewood, etc. They have real frames under them and several companies are making a copy of the front end loader that Deere used to make for them.
avalancher
Arboristsite Raconteur
At this point I havent really considered a different tractor for this application. Aside from the head gasket problem I have really liked this tractor, and it has always done the small and medium jobs that I have asked of it. The plan for the future is for a medium sized compact tractor that I can still load on my trailer, having to weigh less than 7000lbs. This I plan on using for the heavier jobs like skidding wood out of the woods, heavy plowing, gravel spreading etc. I have found that this Husky tractor has been ideal for what I have needed to do around here. The compact size allows me to wind around through all our flower beds with a small trailer, haul a small trailer with one rick from behind the shop up to the house, etc.
Tractor prices around here are steep, but with the economy taking a nose dive I have noticed a real drop in prices, and I figure that this winter will be a great time to snap up a good deal on a tractor. Our Mahindra dealer has had some real good incentives lately, and that is the direction that I am looking at right now, a small 4wd model.
Jkebxjunke
*Politically Incorrect*
Kubota has 42 months 0% right now...
Jkebxjunke
*Politically Incorrect*
thats what the card in the mail said and what my dealer has posted...
also you can look here
http://www.kubota.com/f/finance/promorates.cfm
looks like 36 months with $0 down and 42 with 15% down... worth looking in to
also you can look here
http://www.kubota.com/f/finance/promorates.cfm
looks like 36 months with $0 down and 42 with 15% down... worth looking in to
cabinman
ArboristSite Guru
flat washers
A thick washer or 2 thin ones will acomplish the same, good thought,...make sure the head is gettin torqued, It could be just that simple,... Eric
A thick washer or 2 thin ones will acomplish the same, good thought,...make sure the head is gettin torqued, It could be just that simple,... Eric
Junkfxr
ArboristSite Operative
Massey Ferguson has 60 months at 0%.
avalancher
Arboristsite Raconteur
For some reason the head gasket kit came with head bolts and head studs. With the studs is said to use the enclosed washers and nuts, but warned in large letters NOT to use washers of any kind with the bolts. Studs were to be used only with engines that originally used studs, and warned not to use studs when the original application used bolts, and visa versa.
Junkfxr
ArboristSite Operative
That's odd. Studs with nuts have far better clamping ability, are a lot stronger and don't wear the threads in the block as bad.
avalancher
Arboristsite Raconteur
Your right, and i think that the studs were used on the models after mine was built after Kohler discovered that they had a problem.
the biggest design flaw of these heads is the large amount of the head that is not clamped well. It really needs a fifth head bolt, it only has four bolts centered around the cylinder well, and nothing to clamp down where the head fits over the well where the push rods come up through the head. That is where all of the leaks came from, that large lip over the push rod galley that is almost three inches from the nearest head bolt.
Take a look at the pic
woodchuck361
ArboristSite Guru
Is there enough meat there to make a 5th bolt hole? you could use a smaller dia. bolt if the room is limited but it looked like there might be room. That would help hold your gasket down for sure.
Lloyd H
ArboristSite Operative
long head bolts
You might try buying a bottoming tap in the appropriate size and finish tapping the bolt holes. That way you don't lose any of the thread strength. As you stated check for length, good way is run bolt into block and measure under head then measure head thickness. Head design does look suspect with push rod gallery way out of bolt circle. Sad to say Kohler ain't bullet proof, then neither is Honda or etc etc etc.
You might try buying a bottoming tap in the appropriate size and finish tapping the bolt holes. That way you don't lose any of the thread strength. As you stated check for length, good way is run bolt into block and measure under head then measure head thickness. Head design does look suspect with push rod gallery way out of bolt circle. Sad to say Kohler ain't bullet proof, then neither is Honda or etc etc etc.
