Ropes and Limb Wallking

[birddog]

I have been climbing for 3-4 years now and up until now, most of my removals were cut and chunk. I recently had to have the septic system replaced and there was a huge white oak 48" up to 10', then 5 feeders 24"-30" with lots of technical rigging(limbs over house and wires).

Figured I would save some money since I do removals and figured it would be a great training aide. Also had a great groundman that has been around trees(on the ground) for 30-40 yrs.

Everthing went smooth, but this was my first time limb walking. I had my life line centered high in the tree as well as another tied off over or just beyond the work area. With all in place, I still was nervous depending on my lines. I'll climb all day, use my life line here and there, but for some reason it was a little uncomfortable.


OK, I'll stop babbling. I know it is a little nerve racking at first, but do some of you guys get nervous out there and if not how long does it take to become truly reliant on your ropes? Understanding that for each of you its going to be different. Just looking for some discussion.

 

[MasterBlaster]

The more ya do it, the easier it gets.




(Like THAT was any help!)

 

[Tom Dunlap]

There are many steps to climb in order to be a top climber. You spent the first part of your career on one of the lower steps. You are just starting to get up onto the next one. The step from climbing vertical to moving horizontal is a big one. You'll learn to appreciate a lot of new techniques and probably find yourself buying some more gear now. That's a good thing! Spending time in the three dimensional parts of the arboreal world is what seperates us from pole and tower climbers.

Besides the physical climbing aspect, the lateral world will be a mental work out. The more you can look at the tree and plan a route, the easier your day will be. Conserve energy and try not to duplicate steps. Even if it takes a little longer, in the long run, saving steps pays off.

Welcome to the third dimension!

Tom

 

[murphy4trees]

Big John and I deadwooded a big red oak yesterday... I had to take care of the truck so he started before me and did most of the work, plus I asked him to give me the easy side...
Anyhow I got out on a limb and didn't feel comfortable making it any farther... It would have been no problem if I had a redirect... (I won't make that mistake again any time soon).. So I asked him about me predicament and he suggested I should have thought about it before I went out there.... meaning I should have come through a higher crotch... Even with going through that crotch it was a lot farther out from my TIP than I usually get... I said something about it and John replied that I needed to climb with a little more confidence.... Good advice....

 

[ORclimber]

Birddog, you don't do any pruning? IMO that's how you get comfortable limbwalking, gotta ditch the hooks.

 

[NeTree]

Welcome! Yes, I have had the same issues... trust in the equipment. You get over it, and get used to it, no sweat.

 

[jblimbwalker]

My problem used to be a lower than ideal TIP. Once I started taking the extra minute to tie in higher I saw a big difference in my ability to get around in the tree. Redirects are a great tool to keep on the saddle, especially when working on a large spread tree with no adequate (high enough) TIP. Also, when walking out, always think, "What would happen if I took a swing from this point?" Then use lanyard, or redirect accordingly.

 

[birddog]

I haven't done any pruning yet, accept for from the ground(still learning to trust my knots, ropes & hitchs). I started as a groundman for guy who used a 50 year old saddle, spurs with wire ties holding them together and clothes line for rigging(maybe a little bigger). Figured I would move on for safety reasons as you can see. I recently started get further involved with the profession and am studying for the Arborist test here in December. I guess I'm taking baby steps and not over stepping my bounds. Never really had anyone teach me much except straight removals on straight stick.
This forum has taught me so much in ref to techniques and equipments. The Tree Climbers Companion has been one of the greatest tools purchased.

 

[Greg]

One of those peices of extra gear is a big shot. You can hit better TIP's and also pre-string some re-directs that you know you'll need.
Greg

 

[rahtreelimbs]

Originally posted by murphy4trees
I said something about it and John replied that I needed to climb with a little more confidence.... Good advice....

I come on this site and wear the truth on my sleeve! This is something that alludes me too many times. I guess confidence is something that comes from experience!

 

[NebClimber]

For what it is worth, I've been climbing only a few months. I basically asked the same questions you probably have in mind. The worst situation seems to be climbing on a lateral limb when your tie-in point is 20 feet away and at the same height as you. Still happens to me quite a bit. I leafed through a supply magazine and bought a "buckstrap" or "lanyard" or "flipline" that I now throw around the limb I am climbing. Then if I fall, I will only fall a few feet. Problem is, I can only really tie in with the buckstrap when I get to the end of the limb. With all the little watersprouts and other branches in the way, I haven't figured out how to climb all the way to the end with the buckstrap looped around the limb the whole time.

As to getting to trust your rope, I guess just practice "slow and low" like the climber's companion says. Ironically, until you get used to it, the rope and harness will pull you out of the tree more than anything else. This is just from personal experience. I started out just free climbing everything, but new my luck wouln't hold. Then I bought rope and harness, and it seemed like everytime I wanted to move to a better position the rope was tugging me the wrong way. It tugged me out of the tree a few times, but it held.

Take all this with a grain of salt. I suspect I have - hands down - the least experience and the most unrelated background when it comes to tree climbing.

 

[Ax-man]

I find it a little hard to believe that you have been climbing for 3 to 4 yrs without doing any limb walking.

As others have stated the nervousness does diminish in time with experience. But it is always going to share your saddle and is a good thing because it keeps your mind on what your doing.

Limb walking without spurs is a learned skill. It requires not only balance and know how with a climb line, but also the ability to get hand holds on small branches, using your feet and toes to progress forward stepping on small knobs,deadwood stubs,suckers what ever happens to be there that can be of use.

Aids that are helpful as mentioned are redirects, be creative with your flipline, don't be afraid to use the other end of your line to give you a leg up on angled leaders or to give you an extra point of balance when walking a small limb that angles downward. ( double - crotching ) I find going out on a limb not so much a challenge as fair leading back is trickery and harder to do.

When limb walking always be mindful that limbs can and do break under a climbers weight, especially after the half way point. Learn to recognize tree defects that can cause limb breakage and have a plan to protect yourself , should it happen. Dead tree parts should never be trusted, they may look dried out and stout but in cases are brittle and decayed, I kick deadwood out of my way, but this isn't a 100% it won't break under your weight.

Forgot one thing, a good pair of sturdy boots with a good grip on the sole for traction is most helpful when limb walking.

Good Luck and work save, I hope this has been a little helpful.

 

[Reed]

Axe-man said: Forgot one thing, a good pair of sturdy boots with a good grip on the sole for traction is most helpful when limb walking. Good grip. Yeah.

Looking far and wide for what I used in San Antonio years ago - sponge soles - can't find a single pair. Can't and won't use calks, Vibrams are too firm.

When the climb requires lot's of horizontals I pull my double-soled moose-hide mocassins out from under the back seat of my office. They wrap around limb topsides like a suction cup on an octopus. Got to change back on the ground however - they have no milage ability and wouldn't like to tip them with the 020.

 

[Guy Meilleur]

Good advice so far: #2, High TIP, #3, lose the spikes, #4 get some gear. IMO the first tool to get if you want to move around in a tree is a good telescoping polesaw.

It will set your rope 14' away from you without you having to flip. It will reach cuts 14' away. Saddle ropes and polesaw is all you need; I've climbed 38 years and don't use prussiks blakes ascenders bigshots or any of that stuff. Not that it's no good, I'm just too old/dumb to learn. :blush:

#1 is confidence, feeling like you are one with the tree. 'Very corny but very true; when you feel it move and move with it you're dancing and the tree's your partner.

Take up two ropes at all times so redirecting is habit. Leaning back on two ropes is a whole lot comfier than on one. Do I still get nervous? For sure, that's part of the fun, and those glandular secretions keep you young. Do I get scared? Seldom, like when eqpts not right like frayed rope

Sorry your big oak had to go down because of a septic system; that's really the s*&%s. Removals are a bummer; you'll never climb them again.

 

[ramanujan]

One of the best ways to learn a lot is to go to a jamboree. I've learned a great deal by watching and climbing with the fellows at competitions. You'll see lots of tricks and things that may not often have a place on the job site but you'll also see just how well some fellows can climb, and the techniques that allow them to.

 

[Ax-man]

Guy, I'm not going to quote you word for word.

But as you stated confidence is #1 for tree climbing. One has to be confident in ability, the equipment and being one with the tree. If you don't have that you just can't do it. It's some thing that just can't be taught, you either have it or you don't there is no half way in this line of work.

I've tried to teach some people along the way. Some may get a step or two up on spurs and can go no farther. Some may get up 25 ft. in a tree and then freeze, their done that's it for them. Others just can't learn to trust the rope or the friction hitch. Some can climb along the main stem using limbs, but can't move horizontal, no trust in the saddle or rope. I always get the same question, you make it look easy, how do you do it? My answer is always the same " Trust the Equipment and Trust in Your Self that is all you will ever need, except maybe a saw"

I was exposed to tree climbing by sheer accident. But the first time I sat in that 4D ring butt squishing saddle, hanging off that manila rope ( synthetic lines weren't around yet ) I knew what I wanted to do and have been doing it ever since.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Practice, practice, practice.

Many of the really good climbers out there don't just climb on the job, they actually do it recreationally and go out in the bcak yard or park and try out ideas so they don't have to waste time OJT.

talk to those guys who do jamborees and they will say they spend a few hours a week playing with throwballs in the park.

 

[ORclimber]

Originally posted by NebClimber
, I haven't figured out how to climb all the way to the end with the buckstrap looped around the limb the whole time.

You could add a second flip line.

 

[Tree Machine]

Limbwalking

Boiling it down to the least common denominator, there are just two components to tree climbing - body parts, and gear.

I feel a couple critical pieces of gear are those that involve my body parts directly, namely climbing boots and gloves. I use the rubberized, cotton Wonder Gloves because they give me the confidence to grip with better ability than with hands alone, and protects them from all the abrasion and friction that's inevitable in our work. As far as the climbing boots, these are even more important as they are the only piece of gear that you use continuously, from the moment you leave the house until the time you finish your day and therefore should not be considered lightly. I think the ultimate tree climbing boot has yet to be developed and I'll not go any further with the boot thing, as a really good climbing boot thread is going on.

As far as the horizontal dimension, I find redirecting with slings to be central. If I have to do some cuts way out in no-man's land, I often limbwalk out on a higher-up limb, set my redirect there, then rappell down a bit to the limb in question. That way your T.I.P. is more 'above you' rather than along side of you. You DO have to go back up there after the critical cuts are made to remove the redirect, but usually that distance is minor, just one or two limbs up, and you may be able to use that temporary T.I.P. for other work in that part of the crown.

This is just one of many, many techniques you'll get here. It all comes from your head, though. Use Guy Mueller's 'One with the tree' reference. It's not corny. It's just how it is when you climb at the professional level and beyond. Stop occasionally to focus - I mean FOCUS- on your balance. View the next several moves in advance of doing them. Concentrate your entire world to the moment you're in, and treat the upcoming issue as a problem to be solved, one step at a time. You're in the crucible, man. This is the zone that seperates you from the rest of the world. Personally, it's my favorite place to be, but protect yourself. Be careful. The adrenaline surges will stop after time and you'll kinda miss them. -TM-

 

[Ax-man]

As Tree Machine stated redirects are central to horizontal movement. No disagreement on this.

Just want to add that it is not always necessary to use a manufactured redirect. On many occasions I have used minor or secondary natural crotches on higher limbs to serve as a redirect.

To get my out line out I would get some slack and flip the line out. Another way is when on the higher limb to leave a small limb or branch to serve as a redirect, complete the pruning on the lower limb, then cut the redirect limb with pole saw, after getting your line out of the way of course.

These are just little tricks you learn along the way to becoming a productive, pro tree climber.

There is more than one way to skin a cat or in this case beat a tree. There is so much that can be learned, but you won't find it in books.