Ropes: stiffness and flexability

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Ny finest

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My climber climbs with a 3 strand an a TL.He wants to upgrade to a 12 or 16 strand but wants a rope that is still somewhat stiff.He used my NE Hivee blue and thought it was OK but was looking for something stiffer.Please help me upgrade him from the stone age
Thanks
 
Walls super braid is very stiff, and while it is a rigging line, it is an acceptable climbing line as well.

However, the bowline in this line is very weak (the rope looses alot of strength) so I use a figure 8.


I use Arbormaster Blue Streak, it works well for me.
 
He might like ArborPlex for the same reason I hate it... it's stiff as a mofo.
 
Baileys is running a sale on Arbor Plex right now.

I dont like Super Braid any more due to its lack of retained strength from tying a bowline. 12 strand Saftey Pro Is stronger than Super Braid when tied in a bowline.
 
Lumberjack said:
I dont like Super Braid any more due to its lack of retained strength from tying a bowline.

So, you've had it break using a bowline?

I've been roping whoppers using SB and a bowline, no problemo.

And I prefer the stiffer lay for my bullrope, and my lanyard.
 
Unless he is climbing up the rope itself, i think the real value of the line is in the elasticity. Certainly in this application a measured amount of elasticity is mandatory, the length of the line the best place to get it. The rule of thumb i was brought up on was that a man falling 6' and caught by side D's will rip his spleen out; so lanyards were made to 6' and brought around a device, so you would only fall 3'.

Also, buying a higher tensile of line of the same materials and braid is not always wise, for as the SWL of the line goes up, the elasticity goes down. This gives more shock to the human cargo, or other load, and the support too. For the line links both support and load. The effect especially true on shorter distances of line used in system.

Exception being if that length of line serves another support leg to load (like climber's DdRT and rigger's DWT), then tensile is doubled; and at a static stand the support is loaded less. But on the dynamics of movement,the loss of elasticty comes into play (due to higher tensile of doubled line instead of single one to load of climber etc. on line); and the body and support are loaded more. More rope in system making up for some of the loss of elasticity, as long as it does not add more legs of support, increasing system tensile.

So elasticity is important, and with 200# men on 6000# rope doubled over to increase what line will hold; the elasticity is probably more important than the strength.
 
MasterBlaster said:
So, you've had it break using a bowline?

I've been roping whoppers using SB and a bowline, no problemo.

And I prefer the stiffer lay for my bullrope, and my lanyard.


Yep, and the same load has been held by the saftey pro.
 
Carl. It goes without saying that you loaded the rope far beyond the recommended working load doesn't it? I'm not ragging on you hard-I do it too- but we can't blame the rope too much when we load it too heavily. I have never broken an Arborist line- I've popped 1/2 inch Unmanila but even that wasn't easy to do!
 
I led you on, the rope didnt break in a rigging senario.

Stumper, the rope can be blamed when a rope of lesser MBS can repeatably take a higher load.

I use the rope to pull debris from my mexican chipper off the trailer. I pull with a 40hp (Ford 3930 4wd) and the super braid will consistantly break in the bend of the bowline.

As evidence of the weakness of the rope I now use super braid for the choker and the tail of it (that goes to the tractor) is saftey pro. I have figure 8's in the superbraid and bowlines on the saftey pro. This combination has yet to break, but it came close yesterday.

The saftey pro will hold the tractor spinning all 4 tires, but the super braid will break rather quickly.

Also the super braid is practically new, while the saftey pro has lived a very hard life of being the old choker line. It broke so many times that it is too short to reach around the debris and back to the tractor. So that is why I have the super as the choker and the saftey as the leg. Whenever this setup breaks I will use some more super braid and tie it with figure 8's that will stay tied (set way to hard to get undone). Whenever I use up my super braid I will probably use something like blue streak or other 1/2" line that is of high MBS but still maintains strength in the bowline.
 
Because I have the line already available and its paid for.

I dont know of a line that will never break, due to the hard conditions that this rope sees such as high loading (from a 7k lb tractor spinning all 4 tires) some shock loading (sometimes the weight of the mess is hard to get moving, so I lightly bump against the rope with the tractors weight) also I only need short lengths like 40 feet tops. Double braid (like stable braid) would be an option, but I bet it will pick to much.

The only thing I know would stand up to the loading better would be a logging cable choker, and besides the part where I dont have one (it aint paid for) I dont like messing with cable to start with.

Perhaps a nylon strap?

Also when running the mexican chipper I can see the drag line getting cut by the saw as soon as I put something exspensive down there, it hasnt happened yet though.
 
3 strand would be too weak. I simply need to get more saftey pro, or another 12 or 16 strand, I bet Arbormaster would be prime for this task.

Mexican Chipper

I use a trailer to haul my debris. The theory behind the chipper is as you stack limbs on the trailer you create dead space between the branches. So what a mexican chipper does is uses a saw (I use a 044 with a 20" bar) to chop down the brush to decrease the dead space. Using this method I can achieve compatction ratios of up to 10:1, with 6:1 being more common (on hardwoods). With pines the compaction ratio is somewhat less, maybe 4:1.

When the camera gets home I will take a picture of the "chips" the mexican chipper makes.

There are several advantages to the mexican chipper:
Cheap, the saws are already there and everyone should have a good trailer (mine is 7'x18' with soon to be 2' plywood sides)

I can burn the chips from chipper (i live in the country and have room to burn all my woody debris)

I can quickly unload the bed using the tractor that I already have, this saves time and money, without having to buy more equipment.
 
3 strand would be too weak. I simply need to get more saftey pro, or another 12 or 16 strand, I bet Arbormaster would be prime for this task.

Mexican Chipper

I use a trailer to haul my debris. The theory behind the chipper is as you stack limbs on the trailer you create dead space between the branches. So what a mexican chipper does is uses a saw (I use a 044 with a 20" bar) to chop down the brush to decrease the dead space. Using this method I can achieve compatction ratios of up to 10:1, with 6:1 being more common (on hardwoods). With pines the compaction ratio is somewhat less, maybe 4:1.

When the camera gets home I will take a picture of the "chips" the mexican chipper makes.

There are several advantages to the mexican chipper:
Cheap, the saws are already there and everyone should have a good trailer (mine is 7'x18' with soon to be 2' plywood sides)

I can burn the chips from chipper (i live in the country and have room to burn all my woody debris)

I can quickly unload the bed using the tractor that I already have, this saves time and money, without having to buy more equipment.

With an experianced saw operator it is more safe than a chipper in my mine.

It can chip realatively fast (an 066 with a 28" bar might be better)

I can load heavier pieces on top of or along with the brush without having to heft them into the back of a chip truck

There is no extra equipment to have to drive out to the worksite

Disadvantages:
Very dangerous for an unskilled chainsaw operator

Doesnt pack it quite as tightly as a chipper would in a chip box, but this is offset by the size of the trailer.

The chips might could be sold, or left at the jobsite


Works well for me at this point in time.
 

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