Shorted delivery

[RCR 3 EVER]

When I purchased firewood over 10 years my rule was the the person who delivered it would bring it in a truck tightly stacked and I would help throw it off. I took measurements of the truck prior to delivery and we agreed what the exact volume was before I paid them. I sent a couple unhappy sellers home when they tried to short me.

I could have taken measurements of the truck but with the wood tossed in haphazrd there would have been no point doing so. Unless the wood is stacked in neat and tight there I do NOT see tell how a seller can judge exactly how much wood is actually in the bed of a truck.

 

[RCR 3 EVER]

Dept of Agriculture weights and measures called today, they are checking within dept if my case will be investigated further since it involves face cords not cords. Face cords are not regulated but he became more interested when I told him I spent $600 for $400 of actual wood delivered. Someone may actually come to house and measure the stacks,hopefully.

 

[RCR 3 EVER]

I had same thing happen to me this year .. Paid 400$ for 3 cords delivered and after it was all stacked out it wasn't but a little over 1.5 cords in my wood shed . I will probably never have it brought in again . I'll cut it all myself or buy pallets of eco bricks before I get shafted again

The first year we had fireplace we also did not have enough wood cut and split from the property so we had to buy some. A store nearby our house (now out of business) had a huge pile of firewood to sell so we ordered several 4 face cords. When stacked it was very short of firewood. WE went to the store and watched them stack the wood on pallets 2 logs deep and feet high,BUT the pallets were ONLY 3 FT LONG. Thus the 2 log deep pallets would only produce a pile 6 foot long. PLus the logs were split extremely small 3-4 inch diameter piece of Oak was split in half. I told him since he was advertising firewood face cords for sale and he was very short I wanted partial refund or I would report it.
I wonder how many other people who deliver wood just stack wood on 3' wide pallets thinking all pallets are 4' wide to dry the wood and then toss the wood into a truck for a short delivery.

 

[turnkey4099]

The first year we had fireplace we also did not have enough wood cut and split from the property so we had to buy some. A store nearby our house (now out of business) had a huge pile of firewood to sell so we ordered several 4 face cords. When stacked it was very short of firewood. WE went to the store and watched them stack the wood on pallets 2 logs deep and feet high,BUT the pallets were ONLY 3 FT LONG. Thus the 2 log deep pallets would only produce a pile 6 foot long. PLus the logs were split extremely small 3-4 inch diameter piece of Oak was split in half. I told him since he was advertising firewood face cords for sale and he was very short I wanted partial refund or I would report it.
I wonder how many other people who deliver wood just stack wood on 3' wide pallets thinking all pallets are 4' wide to dry the wood and then toss the wood into a truck for a short delivery.

Lesson learned. he was not "short". He advertised face cords, he delivered face cords. That his 'face cords' don't meet your definition of one is your problem, not his. THERE IS NO LEGAL DEFINITION OF A FACE CORD. In the future order by cords or fraction thereof then you will have a legal complaint that can be investigated.

Harry K

 

[discounthunter]

in the future deal only with CORDS. quick asking for or referencing face cords or truck loads.

 

[cantoo]

Maybe you should consider propane? Or if you have as much wood as you say you do then make a deal with a neighbour, they cut and split and you get a share. No more shorted face cords, full cords, bush cords or whatever you want to call them. And considering your problems with your splitter maybe they should supply a splitter too. What do you think a fair split of split wood would be? 5 to 1?

 

[MrWhoopee]

When I purchased firewood over 10 years my rule was the the person who delivered it would bring it in a truck tightly stacked and I would help throw it off. I took measurements of the truck prior to delivery and we agreed what the exact volume was before I paid them. I sent a couple unhappy sellers home when they tried to short me.

I always met the delivery with a tape and calculator. The three young guys in the jacked-up truck brought me .85 cord. That's what I paid them for. They weren't happy.

 

[Dan_IN_MN]

Lesson learned. he was not "short". He advertised face cords, he delivered face cords. That his 'face cords' don't meet your definition of one is your problem, not his. THERE IS NO LEGAL DEFINITION OF A FACE CORD. In the future order by cords or fraction thereof then you will have a legal complaint that can be investigated.

Harry K

I know this isn't a legal definition and I don't like partial cord terms, but I thought a face cord is 4' high, 8' long, and 16" wide. The dimension of the face of a cord. Am I correct?

 

[turnkey4099]

I know this isn't a legal definition and I don't like partial cord terms, but I thought a face cord is 4' high, 8' long, and 16" wide. The dimension of the face of a cord. Am I all correct?

No. DThat is the generally ACCEPTED definition but it is not legal and cannot be used to file a complaint. A face cord is anything the dealer wants to call it as long as it is only one stick wide. DThat is why one should only deal in cords or fractions there-of. Dealer say "I only sell face cords" Bye, I'll look somewhere else.

Harry K

 

[Redhorse]

I know this isn't a legal definition and I don't like partial cord terms, but I thought a face cord is 4' high, 8' long, and 16" wide. The dimension of the face of a cord. Am I correct?

Those Dimensions would actually be 1/3 of a cord.
Around here wood is sold by the 'rick' usually 4' high and 8' long but can be anywhere from 15" to 20" sticks. The only way I see that one could hold legal complaint on any of these so called units of wood would be if it is specified on a bill of sale the dimensions of wood sold


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[spike60]

Paying for firewood is a double hit since our property is over run with blowdowns since I cannot cut anymore and my wife and I, she does the cutting, have not been able to get to property to bring the wood home to us. Then we get ripped off to boot.

I've only read the first 2 pages of this thread, so someone may have already suggested this but.............This situation sounds like a perfect opportuinty for a GTG at your place. Especially with you having wood on your own property that can be cut. Many guys have expressed an interest in helping, but many like myself are obviously way too far away. But might there be enough members within a couple hours of RCR's place?

We did this for a member in central NY back in Sept. He was injured and unable to get his wood done for the season. We had 8 guys come from 1 to 3 hours away. We had 2 splitters, a dump trailer, 2 tractors and of course plenty of saws. We processed a LOT of wood in a just a few hours.

 

[zogger]

I've only read the first 2 pages of this thread, so someone may have already suggested this but.............This situation sounds like a perfect opportuinty for a GTG at your place. Especially with you having wood on your own property that can be cut. Many guys have expressed an interest in helping, but many like myself are obviously way too far away. But might there be enough members within a couple hours of RCR's place?

We did this for a member in central NY back in Sept. He was injured and unable to get his wood done for the season. We had 8 guys come from 1 to 3 hours away. We had 2 splitters, a dump trailer, 2 tractors and of course plenty of saws. We processed a LOT of wood in a just a few hours.

A GTG would work, as well as just sell stumpage off the property on a shares basis,. whatever ratio that could be agreed on with a local who wanted wood for himself or to sell.

 

[Gjt1980]

I have been selling a little wood for the 2 years going on 3. The first year i sold it of a single pile year 2 i pre measured it. The trailer load is a 6 face cord order i am delivering that i helped stack in the customers garage. It measured out to be over 7.5 face cord. I have not had a complaint yet.

 

[FLHX Storm]

I have been selling a little wood for the 2 years going on 3. The first year i sold it of a single pile year 2 i pre measured it. The trailer load is a 6 face cord order i am delivering that i helped stack in the customers garage. It measured out to be over 7.5 face cord. I have not had a complaint yet.

Is your "Face Cord" a half cord? Third or a cord, perhaps a 4th of a cord? Even an eighth of a cord? So how many CUBIC FEET do you consider a "Face Cord?"

Personally, I try to cut all my wood 16 inches in length. So that would mean I get 3 face cords per cord. Hmmm, that sure sounds like I have more wood than I really do. Maybe if I cut it all 12 inches in length. Then I could have 4 face cords per cord. Since I have about 12 cord split n stacked That means I'd have a whopping 48 face cords if I went the 12 inch route. Or even 96 face cords if I went the 6 inch route. That sure makes it sound like I REALLY have a lot of wood when the reality is, I only have but a measly 12 cord.

That's almost as bad as selling a pickup truck load. Stacked it comes out to a little better than a half cord if the truck bed is 8 feet in length. If it's thrown on, it's less than a half cord. So do tell, how many face cord in a pickup truck load if the truck has an 8 foot bed?

All of this is presuming your using at least some form of standard measure from an actual cord which is 4' by 4' by 8' (or 128 cubic feet)

 

[turnkey4099]

View attachment 318947 View attachment 318948 I have been selling a little wood for the 2 years going on 3. The first year i sold it of a single pile year 2 i pre measured it. The trailer load is a 6 face cord order i am delivering that i helped stack in the customers garage. It measured out to be over 7.5 face cord. I have not had a complaint yet.

Why do you fool around with "face cords"? The amount you are working with a plain "cord" would be much simpler. It also would be a legal measure.

Harry K

 

[MrWhoopee]

Apparently in Michigan, the cord is the legal unit of measure, but it is not illegal to sell by other units.
http://www.arboristsite.com/communi...-legal-definitions.228746/page-2#post-4153939

However, the only variable dimension in face cords is the length of the pieces. The seller agreed to deliver 6 stacks 4x8 feet x whatever length the wood is cut.
He didn't.

 

[turnkey4099]

Apparently in Michigan, the cord is the legal unit of measure, but it is not illegal to sell by other units.
http://www.arboristsite.com/communi...-legal-definitions.228746/page-2#post-4153939

However, the only variable dimension in face cords is the length of the pieces. The seller agreed to deliver 6 stacks 4x8 feet x whatever length the wood is cut.
He didn't.

And if the buyer insisted on a legal measure, i.e., cords he could take the seller to court.

Again. Deal in cords or fractions and all that argument, dispute, etc. about whether the amount delivered was what was ordered goes away. It is beyong comprehension why people stick to those fake measures.

Harry K

 

[FLHX Storm]

Dang, just think, I could have 576 face cord if I made each one an inch thick!

 

[Gjt1980]

A full cord is a 128 cubic feet my face cords are 42.66 cubic feet and the load in my pic is about 320 cubic feet. I deal with face cords because a lot of people i sell to that is what they want to buy at a time

 

[FLHX Storm]

A full cord is a 128 cubic feet my face cords are 42.66 cubic feet and the load in my pic is about 320 cubic feet. I deal with face cords because a lot of people i sell to that is what they want to buy at a time

Okay, but what is so bad about saying your selling in 1/3rd cord increments. Or that your trailer is holding two and a half cord? I will admit though, if you said you were selling 42.66 cubic feet of wood for $X and 320 cubic feet of wood for $X I would be inclined to purchase from you. If I see that "Face Cord" crap, I'd seek a different vendor.

Do you accept cubic dollars?