Should the city save trees?

[fishercat]

knowing you................

Holy crap now I am going to be singing that in my head at Thanksgiving dinner tonight you A-hole

you were probably already singing it before he mentioned it.

 

[Tree Pig]

you were probably already singing it before he mentioned it.

no actually I was singing this

I wish I were an Oscar Mayer Weiner
That is what I truly wish to be
cause if i were a oscar mayer weiner
everyone would be in love
oh everyone would be in love
everyone would be in love with me

 

[fishercat]

you have some serious issues.

no actually I was singing this

I wish I were an Oscar Mayer Weiner
That is what I truly wish to be
cause if i were a oscar mayer weiner
everyone would be in love
oh everyone would be in love
everyone would be in love with me

:greenchainsaw:

 

[treevet]

that power of suggestion stuff is bull and boring as well.............yawn......picture me yawwwwnnnnninnnggg

 

[Taxmantoo]

Yet another innane comment from a neocon.

No, neocons like overbearing governments. Look at GW Bush (or the entire Repugnant Party) for example.

 

[NCTREE]

How about when you are in the tree, you have a song in your head and the ground guy starts singing it.

 

[treevet]

No, neocons like overbearing governments. Look at GW Bush (or the entire Repugnant Party) for example.

ONE thing you can say about the Bushes is if you want to start a war with us you're gonna get your asses kicked.

Same cannot be said for the dumbocrats, Obaga *** and his socialist reparational party

 

[NCTREE]

ONE thing you can say about the Bushes is if you want to start a war with us you're gonna get your asses kicked.

Same cannot be said for the dumbocrats, Obaga *** and his socialist reparational party

I'm sure Palin would do a much better job HA! Seems like the rep. party's canidates just keep getting dumb and dumber. I don't like Obama either think he's biting off more than he can chew. I refuse to be in either party.

Anyone ever see the movie Idiocracy it's nowhere near good but it does have a point.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

You asked for it, you got it!

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Darn, why does that work only some of the time?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97L9ptEUsys

 

[jefflovstrom]

What if their actions decrease your property values? Someone clearcuts a wooded area?

So should I ask the guy next door not to cut his trees becuase I bought here for your trees? Or should I ask him before I buy the property and get a signed contract that he will not cut down any trees because it will bring my property value down> What if it brings his property value up? Just wondering,
Jeff opcorn:

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

So should I ask the guy next door not to cut his trees becuase I bought here for your trees? Or should I ask him before I buy the property and get a signed contract that he will not cut down any trees because it will bring my property value down> What if it brings his property value up? Just wondering,
Jeff opcorn:

The city of Franklin has a ordnance that if you cut more then 10% during development you must put the rest into a trust perpetuity. I've been going back and forth about having a sustainable use clause for woodlots.

One story I heard is where Mr. T. bought into a town in IL that had tree laws. He unknowingly had a company come in and top "everything" as i was told it. He and the practitioner got slapped with heavy fines and remediation requirements because the was permitting required and a no topping code.

What we are discussing here is the concept of community rights versus the individuals. The idea Franklin has, and many other growing munie's, is that developers find it more profitable to clearcut and install what they can get on the cheap. Many stands of remnant forest and mature second growth get destroyed because nobody has taken into account the value to the community and the regional ecology.

It has been stated that the individuals rights end where they interfere with another rights. I am taking the stand that indiscriminate cutovers infringe on the rights and needs of the community in many ways

 

[squad143]

Another case of a developer destroying trees against the municipalities permit law:

http://www.yrng.com/Leisure/Environment/article/99765

 

[ozzy42]

You labeled him for labeling people who label people? I'll drink to that.















And then label them .

[/QUOTE]

I take it all back.
I was actually just observing his observence of others who were observing.

 

[derwoodii]

2 story's from each end of this debate.
Ist our past Prime minister brother gets caught doing the wrong thing.
2nd Council gets it wrong, says no to a tree removal permit. Tree falls kills owner.
The issue is large and complex with much to be said and resolved. I say no to Government permits but yes to the industry being more responsible in protecting worthy trees.

1. John Howard's Brother Facing Jail For Chopping Down Endangered Trees

PRIME Minister John Howard's brother Stan will be prosecuted for chopping down dozens of endangered trees.

Stan Howard, who owns two adjoining properties in Bowral in the NSW Southern Highlands, faces a jail term or a hefty fine if found guilty of knowingly cutting down the threatened species. Mr Howard's wife Caroline recently bought the properties for nearly $6.2 million.

According to a memo obtained by The Daily Telegraph, Mr Howard approved the trees be cut down because his caretaker, Rohan Corby, was worried the trees posed a risk to his children.

In November, acting on a tip-off, a Wingecarribee Shire Council ranger visited Mr Corby's home on the Howard property. The ranger had been tipped off by a neighbour, who was annoyed to see dozens of trees being lopped when she had waited a year to be granted approval to have 13 trees chopped down. When he met Mr Howard and Mr Corby, the ranger asked to look at the lopped trees and discovered between 60 and 70 trees had been chopped down. The trees, classed as Southern Highlands shale woodland and Robertson Basalt tall open forest vegetation, are protected under NSW laws as endangered


2. Timbs v Shoalhaven City Council [7]

Mr Timbs was killed in his bed, asleep, when a tree blown over by very strong winds fell on the roof of his house. The tree, one of four adjacent to Timbs' house, was the subject of a tree preservation order which required the consent of council to cut any of them down.

The control factor was significant because the council, through its officer, agreed to advise the Timbs whether the trees were dangerous. The officer's expressed opinion was a representation by him of his capacity to do so based upon his expertise and experience. This raised the standard of care required of him. Accordingly, there should have been more than a routine visual inspection by the officer or advice should have been given to the Timbs that an inspection and independent advice by an expert should be obtained to support an order that the tree could be cut down. In the circumstances the advice was negligent.

 

[treevet]

Good stories.

IMO credentials that are highly specialized are the answer. I think we are way too slow in developing these.

Someone with the specialist credential identifying them as a decision maker in the removal of trees with knowledge in disease/decay, structural integrity, local abiotic influences such as prevailing winds, soil conditions for stability, familiarity and access to state of the art detection equipment, etc., etc.....

....is something that is of ultimate importance in our profession if it is to become universally respected along with many other specialties with associated credentials.

 

[ROOTSXROCKS]

Monetary value is only meaningful if you are selling your home.
I think there are some things that can not be measured with a dollar.
Like Home family and health, ones environment can not easily be replaced.

As sentient beings Trees are invaluable to the soul and influence the way we act toward one another, just look at the cultures who live in areas without trees.

Throughout history, across geographies and cultures, tree worship can be seen, in one form or the other.

This reverence, although often shrouded in mysticism and superstition, stems from a simple, universal fact of life:

“No trees. No life.”

However, simplicity, it turns out, doesn't appeal to the restless human mind.

NEW! IMPROVED!! ADVANCED!!! LOUDER!!! FASTER!!! That’s what the human mind pursues.

Our wise ancestors, who saw this during their time, and in the years to come, knew it would threaten the delicate balance of life. So to prevent an ecological disaster, they accorded trees with a sacred status.

The logic behind this was simple.

“What’s sacred cannot be harmed or destroyed. It can only be conserved. Thus ensuring a healthy population of trees (and a healthy planet with it.)” Simply genius!

Thus sacred groves were the earliest forms of conservation that can be found in all cultures. These groves were sacred places where trees and plants were allowed to grow undisturbed and where reptiles, birds and animals could live freely without fear of poaching or interference by man.

Sacred groves were the origin of the temples, whose columns were initially trees, and later of the Christian churches which still evoke it by the alignment of its pillars, the semidarkness within it, and the soft coloured light that filters through its stained glass windows.

As long as this fear of tree spirits and gods lived in the hearts of people, their lungs were filled with pure, fresh and clean air.

As with all things in life, this respect for trees also decayed and died.

 

[Adkpk]

Here some good articles on the subject. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/29/nyregion/29tree.html?ref=nyregion These people aren't tree huggers just people out to protect the value of their property. Yes, town laws infringing on your personal property is against the American way. But when the majority is complaining that home owners are stripping the town of it's beauty and devaluing properties then you have a case.

Listen, I know, I've been a lover of trees all my life and work as a landscaper. How many times have I heard really lame excuses to remove a tree; leaf clean up is the most popular, I don't like trees, I am allergic (like the tree on his property is the only one that he's allergic to), it's messy, someone might be hiding behind it, and oh ya, squirrels, squirrels come to my yard because of the tree.

 

[jomoco]

Good stuff ROOTSXROCKS!

I'd love to visit and study an ancient petrified forest!

Trees truly are the foundational structure of countless ecosystems throughout the world.

Symbiotic relationships between trees, plants, animals and insects have been scientifically documented to exist.

We need to emulate and strengthen these symbiotic relationships so they can be integrated into modern communities of the future that are sustainable.

jomoco

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

We need to isolate some areas and exclude human interaction with them except for maintenance and removal of invasive species. Close off seldom used county roads, logging and fire roads. Many species will not survive in boundary environments that are what many remnant forests have become.

 

[M.D. Vaden]

Split out from the crane thread to keep it on topic. These are some thoughts to ponder and I look forward to replies.

You want to save trees? Give a tax credit for every tree on a lot in the city limits. That puts a society value on the trees and reduces taxes at the same time.

I don't like tax credits for something like that. If they get a credit, that expenditure raises taxes for others since taxes pay some kind of bills. Even the recipient would pay a fraction in their taxes to cover any credits for others.

The one aspect I'd like covered, is not so much saving trees, as making sure the process gets paused long enough for everybody to be informed.

That would include notices to neighbors who may have to prepare their trees to prevent sunburn damage. Or requiring some removals to wait for the cool season for the same reason.