Silver solder muffler

[Jasonrkba]

When porting a muffler using silver solder to add a port what solder is the right one? I see a range of silver content. Im going to try it using mapp gas. I have a pair of small oxy acetylene tanks but its just not in the budget to have them filled.

Thanks. Jason.

 

[northmanlogging]

When porting a muffler using silver solder to add a port what solder is the right one? I see a range of silver content. Im going to try it using mapp gas. I have a pair of small oxy acetylene tanks but its just not in the budget to have them filled.

Thanks. Jason.

You'll be fine using plain bronze/brass filler, Silver Solder is Spensive and very overkill for a muffler. I just use the pre fluxed stuff you can usually by by the stick at most hardware stores, Mapp gas will probably be hot enough... for the brass anyway, certainly not for the silver solder, at least not without out an O2 kicker.

 

[Jasonrkba]

Just what I needed to here! Thank you.

 

[northmanlogging]

Little extra paste flux won't hurt either FYI, makes a helluva mess but does flow the brass better...
I've even used broken cymbals with borax, its a PITA but it does the trick.

 

[Squareground3691]

Harris Solder Kit 4531 & SSWF7 - Safety-Silv 45% 1/16 Solder 1 Ounce w/Flux https://a.co/d/0dPAXVo

 

[HansFranz]

You could also buy an old worn-out Mercury dime on ebay for $2 or $3 and use that for solder.

I just O/A and silicon bronze and 20 Mule Team borax (available at Walmart) for flux.

 

[northmanlogging]

You could also buy an old worn-out Mercury dime on ebay for $2 or $3 and use that for solder.

I just O/A and silicon bronze and 20 Mule Team borax (available at Walmart) for flux.

theres a lot more to silver solder then just silver, granted a junk coin is going to be 10% copper, but sillver solder is 30-60% silver, with other ingredients for strength and temp control. silver by itself is fairly soft

 

[HansFranz]

silver by itself is fairly soft

...but plenty strong for a front sight on a gun, or a muffler, or plenty of other things.

Mapp gas will probably be hot enough... for the brass anyway, certainly not for the silver solder, at least not without out an O2 kicker.

I've found that it takes a lot more heat to braze with bronze than to silver solder. Depending on alloy, you can silver-solder with air-acetylene, but you're gonna need oxy-acet for bronze fillers in most cases. I sometimes use tig instead of flame...

 

[northmanlogging]

...but plenty strong for a front sight on a gun, or a muffler, or plenty of other things.


I've found that it takes a lot more heat to braze with bronze than to silver solder. Depending on alloy, you can silver-solder with air-acetylene, but you're gonna need oxy-acet for bronze fillers in most cases. I sometimes use tig instead of flame...

They use actual Silver solder on fire arms not 90% silver from coins, only fools use it on mufflers, especially one that will get the S beat out of it on the regular
IF some idiot is using pure or nearly pure silver for soldering anything except jewlery (which even then its not 100%) please feel free to punch them in the stinky parts
As for heat, it mostly depends on the base metal, big thick chunky cast iron takes a great deal of heat, a muffler, not so much. and taint no one using air acetylene, it needs 02 to burn clean, you can do it with Mapp gas, which I think is a mixture of propane/acetylene, again though it depends on the base material.

Furthermore, Silver soldering needs to have a very close fit, not a tight fit but close and with minimal gaps. using it on mufflers is a huge waste of money and time, a stick of precoated brazzing rod is less then $3 and will do 4-5 mufflers, Silver solder starts at what $75? and you still need special flux

 

[northmanlogging]

the link above to scamazon is 1 oz of rod and flux for $40. plus shipping, 1 0z probably wont do a muff mod FYI.

 

[HansFranz]

taint no one using air acetylene

Well, except every HVAC guy on the planet.

it needs 02 to burn clean

Air is about 21% O2. And air-acetylene burns plenty clean, so long as you clean the cobwebs out of the torch that impede air flow. Try it sometime!

 

[HansFranz]

Mapp gas will probably be hot enough... for the brass anyway, certainly not for the silver solder, at least not without out an O2 kicker.

Silver solder (56%) melts around 1200°F
Low-fuming bronze melts around 1630°F
Silicon bronze melts around 1800°F

Sometimes it helps if you know what you're talking about. Here, maybe this will help:
https://ch-delivery.lincolnelectric...t/c7bc627d75564dd9aa53c88942660c70?v=b42ab9c9

Furthermore, Silver soldering needs to have a very close fit, not a tight fit but close and with minimal gaps.

Not all alloys. Many alloys fill gaps. See:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_brazing_alloys

 

[TheRealWorld]

Good luck with your project! Lots of iffy advice here, I use Sil-fos, and if your material is not too thick you can use mapp. With Sil-fos 15 you will need flux and it will need to glow light red. And you can use this on steel, I fix many hydraulic lines and brake lines with this same method. have it clean and use flux. This will work on copper to copper; copper to steel, and copper to brass.

Here is a link

SIL-FOS 15​

https://www.silfos.com

 

[northmanlogging]

Well, except every HVAC guy on the planet.

Air is about 21% O2. And air-acetylene burns plenty clean, so long as you clean the cobwebs out of the torch that impede air flow. Try it sometime!

yer thinking of MAPP gas there bud, which as I mentioned before is a mixture of acetylene (MethylAcetylene) and propane. Though I suppose you could go through the added trouble of getting a dedicated acetylene torch ($300) that requires a regulator, hose and bottle (special order only), or you could just use a MAPP gas torch, $30 at any hardware store ever, often sold near the prefluxed brazing rods...

But I will admit I'm wrong about silver solder melting point. To be fair though, the 90% silver coin you mentioned has a much higher melting point then silver solder.
As for filling gaps with Silver solder, yeah its possible, its also stupid expensive and makes for a weak "weld" besides being something that takes at least a little practice to pull of without wasting yer days wages in drippings.


The SIL_FOS mentioned above I'm unfamiliar with, though from the looks of it, its something I should get familiar with, does appear to be what janky hydraulic fittings are joined with, and I tend to tear those up a long ways away from help... especially when said fitting is attached to a truck that has a log sitting on it sideways and now you have no way of moving said log without said hydraulics... grrr

 

[HansFranz]

yer thinking of MAPP gas there bud, which as I mentioned before is a mixture of acetylene (MethylAcetylene) and propane.

MAPP gas hasn't been made since Bush was in the White House there bud.

 

[TheRealWorld]

It is available here in the midwest.

https://www.menards.com/main/tools/...der-14-1-oz/332477/p-1444447741316-c-8533.htm

 

[northmanlogging]

MAPP gas hasn't been made since Bush was in the White House there bud.

wut? to be fair, MAPP is a commercial name for it, however, the Yellow Cylinders next to the blue and sometimes Red cylinders... are MAPP...
https://www.homedepot.com/b/Tools-Welding-Soldering-Torches-Tanks/MAPP/N-5yc1vZc8lqZ1z0z746 Though it appears they raised the prices on this stuff too...

 

[Squareground3691]

the link above to scamazon is 1 oz of rod and flux for $40. plus shipping, 1 0z probably wont do a muff mod FYI.

I’ve done 4 muffler mods with it couple steel and one 592 stainless with it and have enough for a few more. as long as you do a good job with preparing and fitting matting surfaces you don’t use a lot of rod the flux does the work for ya and no problem with Mapp and this solder the metal thin and heats fast ur not heating 1/8 plate . And if you weren’t into making ur own a ported muffler of good quality cost ya from 35 to over 100 depending on ur preference so the 39 dollars to do a number of them isn’t a issue.

 

[HansFranz]

wut? to be fair, MAPP is a commercial name for it, however, the Yellow Cylinders next to the blue and sometimes Red cylinders... are MAPP...

Nope. They still sell yellow bottles LOL, but it's not MAPP gas. It's either propylene or Country Time lemonade.
And for the record, "MAPP" gas never had any acetylene in it. So you're batting about .050 here bud.

 

[northmanlogging]

Nope. They still sell yellow bottles LOL, but it's not MAPP gas. It's either propylene or Country Time lemonade.
And for the record, "MAPP" gas never had any acetylene in it. So you're batting about .050 here bud.

well what do you think methylacetylene-propadiene propane is then? I'll wait