SRT Questions

[Sep]

When using SRT what is the preferred way to connect the ascenders and back up to the saddle? Are handled ascenders or a gibbs easier to work with? What types of static lines do people like using?

Thanks Sep

 

[Lumberjack]

I use Blue Streak, for my climbing line. Tom uses 7/16" KM 111. I perfer a closed shell ascender to a handled. For long accents I use a CMi ropewalker closed shell ascender, and a pantin. I (to be PC) put a 6 coil prusik above the ascender.

On accents under 40' I used my rads to ascend. On my rads I use the same closed shell ascender, biner, and the Petzel i'D. I tow the line up using the throwline, and when the rope hops over the TIP, I put on the ascender and thread the rope through the pulley, and pull it over. Then I ascend body thrusting up.

Here is the thread that goes all over SRT.

Carl

 

[MasterBlaster]

Boy, you guys make it sound like chinese 'rhithmatic.

 

[Lumberjack]

Fairly simple if you give it a chance. Open mind and all. Even in chinese rithmic, 2+2=4.



Carl

 

[MasterBlaster]

Originally posted by Lumberjack
Fairly simple if you give it a choice.

"Fairly simple" does not adequately describe the SRT scenerio.

 

[rahtreelimbs]

SRT = PITA...........


Got your attention didn't I???

 

[Lumberjack]

My panties aint in a wad, but I bet this doesn't help Sep much.


Carl

 

[rahtreelimbs]

Gotta have a little humor here!

 

[MasterBlaster]

Sep can read all he wants to, and form his own opinions.

http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12211

 

[Lumberjack]

Well, to answer your smart@$$ question, I have only used SRT, as that is what was the simplist to figure out. My lack of a lid (which was supposed to be here today) has nothing to do with my choice in how I hang on the rope. Unless I am mistaken we have never met, so how could you make an assumption that my climbing tech. is unsafe?


Just wondering.

Oh, and on topic, I had the KM111 1/2", but got some blue steak to replace it. KM has much less stretch than BlueStreak, IMO.


Carl

 

[Sep]

Carl why do you like blue streak over a static line? I thought that static lines where preferred in SRT? The question I had about connections of ascenders to saddles came from a picture Tom Dunlop had posted in a previous post where it appeared that he was using two micro acenders for SRT, the acenders looked like they where tied to one and another with webbing then tied off to his saddle?
Thanks again Sep

 

[Lumberjack]

The reason I perfer BlueSteak is because it is easier to repel without wearing gloves, than the KM111. Nothing major, I may try it out again.


Carl

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Many who use SRT beleive that there should be redundancy in the system.

I've met 2 people who have had camed ascenders open from twigs while going through the canopy.

I like having a lower ascender because it centers my weight on the rope better.

Any backup should connect to the saddle separately from the upper.

Rock climbers have shown that using a prusik for backup is not effective and can be unsafe.

 

[tophopper]

Originally posted by John Paul Sanborn


Any backup should connect to the saddle separately from the upper.

I do not fully agree JP-personally i use a petzl handled ascender for my main connection- as a back up above this I clip a Yates rocker to the upper holes in the petzl ascender. The rocker slides along smoothly but grabs like a seat belt mechanism when loaded. It functions as a back up to the main ascender, the only reason I can see the need for seperate attachment to the saddle would be failure of the petzl asceder body itself(or the strap and snap which connect to the saddle) very unlikely IMO. To me a seperate attachment is over redundant and not necasary.

any thoughts?

 

[NeTree]

Redundant isn't always a bad thing - especially when it concerns safety.

 

[tophopper]

I agree Erik, but I did say over redundant. My system has a back up, it just doesnt have a seperate attachment to the saddle. I cannot envision a scenerio where this would pose a problem, unless debris where sucked into both units, which i do not allow to happen EVER. And if it did happen a second attachment point would not do any good either.

 

[Burnham]

The failure of the strap attaching the ascender to the saddle has been one of the more common causes of ascender system failure, if I remember Smith and Padgett correctly. Look for parallel backups. As JPS notes, they recommend for any ascender system to have a minimum of two independent life support quality attachments to the ascender line, both clipped to the climber at waist high or above.

 

[tophopper]

Originally posted by Burnham
The failure of the strap attaching the ascender to the saddle has been one of the more common causes of ascender system failure,

while i do see your point Im still not sold on it.
What if the strap in question was made out of climbing line, it would be no more likely to fail then a traditional climbing system.

Heck, most tubular straps are rated plenty strong for this.
If in good condition I cannot see this happening. I would like to see actual data stating that the most common failure is from failure of this strap.

I have "on Rope" tell me where to find this data

 

[Burnham]

Hopper, you are absolutely right when you say that tubular webbing in good condition has no significant failure hazard. Of course, the operative word is "if". And using a length of climbing rope is even more bomb proof. Constant attention to condition is the key, and if you are doing this, and replacing worn components early and often, your risk is very low.

The caving environment is a harsh one; poor visibility for constant inspection, and high abrasion potential...Smith and Padgett must deal in that venue. Our tree world may be somewhat more forgiving, but don't overlook the hazards of pruning tools around webbing and ropes...something the cavers don't have to worry about.

You may have a point. But you are out of step with mainstream vertical rope disciplines by choosing to set your backup system in series, rather than in parallel.

My copy of On Rope is at home, plus I'd have to do some hunting, so I can't point you to a page just now. I'll do some looking, and if I can find the section I think I remember, I'll post it soon. I don't think it was "data", rather an anecdotal statement.

Could you set the Rocker to ride along clipped directly onto your saddle, so that it was below your handled ascender?

 

[TreeJunkie]

First of all to the previous comment about replacing km111 w/ blue streak, for reason of repelling. This doesn't make sense. This is primarilly an line used for entry into the tree. Thus repelling isn't a common issue, if you were it should be on a gri-gri , i'd, or fig. 8.. The problem w/ using blue streak or any other dynamic rope while ascending is the rope actually absorbs energy, thus you wind up spending more time and energy trying to get up than if you were on a static line.
I use a petzl rt. ascender attached w/ a length of webbing sling and then back to myself. Beneath that i use the left handed petzl ascender, clipped to a foot tether for my left foot. Below this, I tie my v.t. w/ a micro pulley as the tender. On my right foot i use the Pantin. This all works very smoothly and I'm backed up at all times w/ my V.T. I like having a back up at the waste, so if I need a minute to rest, i can put my weight on the v.t. and unload the ascender. To constantly load the ascender (toothed variety), puts alot of wear, unneccesarilly, on the rope. The whole system works great, I think this system may be referred to as rope walking, all i know is for long ascents it's a breeze.