Stihl 066, tuning and slight crank play

[altair]

A good friend has an 066 which has been "changing tune" recently, and stopping when left idling. He fitted a new P/C about a year ago.
I suggested a carb kit,so I fitted a new carb kit today, soaked carb in cleaner etc, only had a little crud in it. The impljuse line looked good ( I removed it and cleaned it, couldn't see any cracks) and fuel filter is new. Gas is new 40:1 with Stihl Ultra.

It idles okay, revs instantly, and easily adjusts via the H/L screws, but is hard to start hot. The starter side crank is solid, but the clutch side I can feel the beginnings of up/down movement. Would this cause the tune to change?

Its a firewood saw only, and has plenty of grunt..just trying to "keep it in tune" for him..but wondering if the old girl has seen her best already?

Any ideas, or am I close in saying maybe she is worn out?

 

[nmurph]

Radial play is BAD. It will cause the seal to leak and the tune to be lean. It's not the end of the saw unless it is not corrected (may have already begun to score the piston). New crank bearings will fix the problem. While you in there I would install seals, fuel and impulse lines, carb kit, and a new piston and you will have a saw that will cut for many years.

 

[Deets066]

Why the new p&c? Was the first problem ever fixed? I agree with Neal sounds like bearings and seals. No biggie everything is replaceable on these saws.

 

[67L36Driver]

Any felt play in ball bearing is bad.

Keep messing with it and the P/C will be toasted again.

 

[altair]

Thanks guys, he bought the saw secondhand and used it for a while, then it simply "stopped" one day..so he pulled it down and the piston was badly scored. I've suggested a total rebuild, although the price to get that done at a shop here would be possibly $2000 all up, the 066 are maybe $2800 here. I've never split a saw before, its beyond my capabilities..P/C is easy enough but nothing further.
Might whip the muffler off while its still here and check the piston, its probably only done 40 hours or so since being fitted..see what it looks like.
Cheers guys

 

[WheresWally]

Thanks guys, he bought the saw secondhand and used it for a while, then it simply "stopped" one day..so he pulled it down and the piston was badly scored. I've suggested a total rebuild, although the price to get that done at a shop here would be possibly $2000 all up, the 066 are maybe $2800 here. I've never split a saw before, its beyond my capabilities..P/C is easy enough but nothing further.
Might whip the muffler off while its still here and check the piston, its probably only done 40 hours or so since being fitted..see what it looks like.
Cheers guys

$2800 there for a 660 ? i thought we had it tough over here @ $1800...

 

[nmurph]

You can ship to the States and let someone rebuild it, port it, and ship it back for a whole lot less than $2800. I would guess a rebuild would cost less than $700 with shipping included.

 

[Matt81]

$2800 there for a 660 ? i thought we had it tough over here @ $1800...

Mate $1800 won't even buy a 461, not even close to a 660. A 461 is $1899 and a 660 is $2099.
We just bought a new 461 for work and even with the Stihl rebate (joke!) promotion the 461 was over $1750.

 

[Matt81]

Thanks guys, he bought the saw secondhand and used it for a while, then it simply "stopped" one day..so he pulled it down and the piston was badly scored. I've suggested a total rebuild, although the price to get that done at a shop here would be possibly $2000 all up, the 066 are maybe $2800 here. I've never split a saw before, its beyond my capabilities..P/C is easy enough but nothing further. Might whip the muffler off while its still here and check the piston, its probably only done 40 hours or so since being fitted..see what it looks like.
Cheers guys

Wow! I was complaining about the 660 cost after the price increase here.

Something wrong if dealer is charging $2800 however....

Stihl NZ pricing:
View attachment 365997

Stihl Australia pricing:


We had our old 066 rebuilt by our local dealer early in 2013. Only cost $800 with Stihl parts and labour. $2000? is that a guess or a quote you have received? Seems like they saw you coming IMHO.

Strikes me as funny (in a very unfunny way!) that Stihl has this rebate promotion on new saws only months after they hike up the prices on most pro models. Prices go up around $100 per model i think around april this year then we get a $150 approx max rebate promotion on some larger models. Are consumers really that stupid??

 

[WheresWally]

Mate $1800 won't even buy a 461, not even close to a 660. A 461 is $1899 and a 660 is $2099.
We just bought a new 461 for work and even with the Stihl rebate (joke!) promotion the 461 was over $1750.

Bought a 660 in may for 1799 with 2 chains and a useless Stihl combo file...

 

[Matt81]

Bought a 660 in may for 1799 with 2 chains and a useless Stihl combo file...

Damn that's a good price. Would have preferred another 660 to the 461. Stihl RRP for 660 is $2099. They usually are VERY inflexible on pricing for saws.
What did you have to do to get $300 off RRP? What size bar did it come with?

 

[WheresWally]

Ahh its Agfest, we have it here every year the exibitors offer good deals, pretty standard with the 25 inch bar but i reckon down here if ya pushed em they would come to the party seeing as the forestry industry in Tas has bitten the dust.

 

[Matt81]

Ahh its Agfest, we have it here every year the exibitors offer good deals, pretty standard with the 25 inch bar but i reckon down here if ya pushed em they would come to the party seeing as the forestry industry in Tas has bitten the dust.

We have similar things here with farm and field days. Stihl and Husky have stalls with demos and promotions but i have not seen anything that attractive, at least at the ones i have been too.

 

[WheresWally]

We have similar things here with farm and field days. Stihl and Husky have stalls with demos and promotions but i have not seen anything that attractive, at least at the ones i have been too.

Yeah ok, i never really thought it was that red hot of a deal actually, its only a couple of hundred bucks when the saws in my opinion aren't worth half what they charge anyway...

 

[Matt81]

Yeah ok, i never really thought it was that red hot of a deal actually, its only a couple of hundred bucks when the saws in my opinion aren't worth half what they charge anyway...

That Stihl charges waaaaay to much for saws, we are both agreed. My 7900 cost me exactly half a 660. Yes 7900 is 80cc and 660 is 91cc but 7900 cuts as good or better as any 80cc saw i have ever used.

 

[altair]

Hi, was just a guess from me regarding rebuild price really, the dealers would want to use genuine Stihl which would be expensive..and my price of $2800 for the saw is way out!!Maybe I was looking at the 088!

Well the saw is playing up the same as it was beforehand, I'll describe it as best I can and hopefully someone may be able to say that its the seal/crank bearings for sure?

It starts easy cold, has plenty of grunt in the cut, then sometimes dies instead of coming down to idle. Then it will not start again, unless I'm holding the throttle on full, but when it starts its like its flooded, and takes a few seconds to clear and run right again. Have tried leaning the idle out a little at a time, but then it wants to die (too lean at idle then)..I'm talking 1/8th of a turn each time. It Is 4 stroking at WOT then cleans up when in the cut...its just the idle giving us grief. Does this scenario sound like seals/air leak?

My mate is slowly coming around to getting it rebuilt..its such a sweet saw to use when it was running well.

I did complete carb kit, metering set correctly, adjustment screws look like new, and it was cleaned properly...impulse line good, fuel line good...just can't figure out why its seems to "flood" when it dies.

So a saw does not have to sound 'lean' when seals are bad? I've told my mate to not use it in the meantime, just in case it toasts the new top end.

Cheers

 

[nmurph]

...but the clutch side I can feel the beginnings of up/down movement. Would this cause the tune to change?

Since you are 10,000 miles away, we can only go by what you tell us. Yes, a bad seal will cause a lean condition and bad bearings will cause the seals to lose contact with the crank and result in an air leak. You need to resolve that problem and replace everything else as you go. I'm still not sure you don't have a problem with the impulse line, but you said the bearing is bad...

 

[Moparmyway]

She floods due to fresh air being ingested through the seal, the air disturbs the fuel air mix velocity (which is very low at idle) and the atomized fuel hangs around and condenses in the case ........resulting in a very rich (flooded like) condition when she starts.

IMHO, emphasize that he does not play with it anymore, look at that P&C and hopefully she still looks good, then its just a repair to the bearing and seal (admittantly a total tear down, but easy on the parts cost) and not the top end as well !!!

 

[altair]

Thanks guys, all makes sense now..the piston still looks new through exhaust port, and he isn't going to use the saw until this condition is sorted. The impulse line I pulled right off, and cleaned it thoroughly..no cracks or splits when bending it. The red flag for me is the very slight up and down play in crank.

Thanks for all replies, much appreciated.