Stump Grinding prices??
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Hexa Fox
The Fox Rocks!
10 years and you still don't get it. No ins., no license, not worth it? ! It's called the cost of doing business. Half the people that posted in this thread don't even post anymore. I kind of want to help you but you don't seem to want any real advice?How is it good for the customer if somebody with the right equipment only needs to charge $200 and your wrong equipment will cost them $2,000???
I don't think you get it. Respectfully I do not mean that in a offensive way. All I was pointing out is that I would believe (in my opinion) that you would be better off charging by the inch in diameter across the stump rather than by the hour. Because simply this is going to bring everyone in the business near the same estimate.
Also I do not know where you got your assumption that I did not want advice. I just told Foggy before you posted that his positive criticism and opinion was much appreciated. I do not know if you went back and read some of the other comments from a while back but they are pretty unnecessary. I would not consider my self a beginner but I am far from a professional/commercial business. That is why I am here often, to seek aid.
Now I welcome your opinion (and everyone else's) with open arms. The more information I have before investing in a piece of equipment the better off I am. Just if you can't be respectful I rather not have your advice.
Hexa Fox
The Fox Rocks!
I also did not see that but people could have just ignored it. The guy came here for advice and got slapped in the face by some of the members.
Hexa Fox
The Fox Rocks!
I mean do what you want. I do not know about you but I live in a free country.
Hexa Fox
The Fox Rocks!
Now let me clarify really fast.
One of the users that ticked me off the most said that it would be a grand idea to do some work for free to get some well needed experience and learn what to charge. Let me tell you guys what I think is terribly wrong with this.
1.) It may give you experience but is only going to give you an idea of what you would like to charge. Not what your competition is charging. So by coming here even though the idea is going to be a little rough because of location he is still going to have a rough idea of what to charge.
2.) Customer #1 tells potential Customer #2 that you did the work for free and did a great job. Customer #2 expects you to come in and do the work for little or nothing because of treatment Customer #1 got. This is a prime example of your business being ruined before you start. I have seen this a lot. There is a guy around here that plows our development out in the Winter time. Now people have gotten very upset with him because he does not charge his friends to have their driveway plowed. This is a problem because he charges everyone else and people got to talking and found out. Well now a lot of his business is forfeit because of that. It only takes one person to ruin your business.
3.) You have a very expensive piece of equipment and made nothing. Even though you are just starting it is still a bad idea.
One of the users that ticked me off the most said that it would be a grand idea to do some work for free to get some well needed experience and learn what to charge. Let me tell you guys what I think is terribly wrong with this.
1.) It may give you experience but is only going to give you an idea of what you would like to charge. Not what your competition is charging. So by coming here even though the idea is going to be a little rough because of location he is still going to have a rough idea of what to charge.
2.) Customer #1 tells potential Customer #2 that you did the work for free and did a great job. Customer #2 expects you to come in and do the work for little or nothing because of treatment Customer #1 got. This is a prime example of your business being ruined before you start. I have seen this a lot. There is a guy around here that plows our development out in the Winter time. Now people have gotten very upset with him because he does not charge his friends to have their driveway plowed. This is a problem because he charges everyone else and people got to talking and found out. Well now a lot of his business is forfeit because of that. It only takes one person to ruin your business.
3.) You have a very expensive piece of equipment and made nothing. Even though you are just starting it is still a bad idea.
How in the world do you offer a service and don't know what to charge?
Jeff
Jeff
Hexa Fox
The Fox Rocks!
I don't know ask they guys that posted before. I always have a decent idea of what I want for a job. However if you have never done something before how would you know what to charge? To answer I would not offer a service unless I could come up with a figure in my head. To come up with a figure in your head you should know what you're getting into and what someone else would charge for a similar job. A lot of people here have no idea and that is why they should be here. To get good advice from people that do know.
You don't seem to understand the process. When you charge by the diameter inch, you may do ok on the smaller stumps. But say you get called to do a 10" stump, you will make $30 (@$3/in). Yah, the stump will only take you 5 min to grind, but you got mobilization (find parking, off the trailer, set up plywood barriers, move the machine) and cleanup (rake and blow, put machine back on trailer, put plywood away) and collect cash. So now you're at about 1/2 hour. Now what if that same stump is in the backyard behind a rhododendron shrub and you have to get through a gate. You got to pull the duallys off, wiggle the machine through the gate and into the backyard, wiggle the machine around to miss the rhodo etc etc. Now you're at 1 hour for the same $30.
Now the size issue, obviously you have forgotten your high school math (see you should have paid attention). As the diameter increases, the surface area increases by exponentially (pi X r^2), hence the volume you have to grind increases. If the stump doubles in size, the volume to grind increases by 4.
You need to view and price every stump based on access, grinding time, mob/demob time, cleanup time and potential damage such as rocks.
Now the size issue, obviously you have forgotten your high school math (see you should have paid attention). As the diameter increases, the surface area increases by exponentially (pi X r^2), hence the volume you have to grind increases. If the stump doubles in size, the volume to grind increases by 4.
You need to view and price every stump based on access, grinding time, mob/demob time, cleanup time and potential damage such as rocks.
^ as stated above the mathematics behind per inch diameter pricing is totally flawed, there is no consistency in your earning as it only measures distance in a straight line, you are grinding volume not distance remember. To work out a rate you need to work what the machine costs to run per hour and go from there, if your are running a business then your rate should also include your labour, overall business expenses plus profit. That's not to say that you must charge per hour-more that you have a target for what you are turning over hourly on average and you price the work according to your estimate on time taken.
Minimum call outs are a must also, its bad business to bring a 7000lb machine worth $4000.00 to someones house and be happy to charge only $25 because the stump was only 8".
Minimum call outs are a must also, its bad business to bring a 7000lb machine worth $4000.00 to someones house and be happy to charge only $25 because the stump was only 8".
Hexa Fox
The Fox Rocks!
I totally agree. I already mentioned this. It was part of "where is it at". This is great advice for the original poster who wanted a lot of information real fast. Anyway maybe there are both positives and negatives to charging by hour. Do not take this the wrong way but there are a lot of good reasons here not to use the by inch method. However what I do not see is a solution. Except for this here.
I found that in my area a lot of people want to know, know, know, before you even come out or they may call someone else. I always, always, always push to see the job so I can give an accurate estimate. As I said my job would have a minimum if I had to tow it somewhere. I would however try to get in as much work as possible with it right in my own neighborhood. This is good advice though because to pay for the equipment I am at some time going to have to tow it out of the neighborhood.
Hexa Fox
The Fox Rocks!
Just like I mentioned before I would say that I would like to see the job first before giving any kind of estimate. One thing that is true around here is there are a lot of older folks who still treasure the value of a dollar. They think that they can get a lot of work done for a little bit of nothing. It is not my fault and is not their fault. They lived in a time where a $20.00 bill was more than adequate for having the neighborhood boy mow their grass. So when you pull up and give them a $250.00 estimate to grind up a stump you might just give them a heart attack.
This is part of my plan. I am not familiar with stump grinding equipment. All I know is what I know from the internet, word of mouth, and YouTube. Which is honestly a great start. I am going to do the work around my neighborhood based on what I know and by then I will have a set plan for what I want to make to be profitable. I will have some money in my pocket and hopefully be able to venture out beyond my neighborhood.
This is part of my plan. I am not familiar with stump grinding equipment. All I know is what I know from the internet, word of mouth, and YouTube. Which is honestly a great start. I am going to do the work around my neighborhood based on what I know and by then I will have a set plan for what I want to make to be profitable. I will have some money in my pocket and hopefully be able to venture out beyond my neighborhood.
Topbuilder
Mouth breathers need not apply.
By the inch charges too much on smaller trees and not enough on the big ones. At least by the hour you are charging evenly for both. Like a cab driver charging by the mile...
Hexa Fox
The Fox Rocks!
What is a good rate to charge by hour? Do you count the time it takes you to load and travel with the equipment?
Topbuilder
Mouth breathers need not apply.
Check out flaws in "by the inch" here:
http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/stump-grinder-math.256405/#post-4794931
http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/stump-grinder-math.256405/#post-4794931
Hexa Fox
The Fox Rocks!
It looks like a good healthy argument on both ends. You mentioned in your post that you put in a bid for twenty-eight pines right? You said it would come out to be around $1700 if you went by inch correct? You said you ended up placing a bid of $600? We just talked about that here. You give discounts for multiple stumps. It would be ridiculous to try and charge by inch in diameter for someone that has multiple stumps.
Hexa Fox
The Fox Rocks!
What are you talking about and who are you directing this to? This is so far off topic and a waste of my time and everyone present in this thread.
Hexa Fox
The Fox Rocks!
This is the internet. You can not always tell someone's attitude by what they write. Plus it is the internet, so no one really cares what you say. Where I come from we can say whatever the hell we want. Like how our president Obama Bin Laden is the biggest garbage on the planet.
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