I own a lawn company and was thinking about expanding into grinding stumps. I currently don't have a grinder, but have used them in the past. I was just wondering if it makes sense to buy a grinder and do that my self or to sub out a tree company. Also if I did getting into grinding how much to charge.
Stump grinding
- Thread starter DJLawn
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iain
ArboristSite Operative
before you commit a salutory note
http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=23463
http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=23463
Stumper
One Man Band
DJ, Your business is...well.... your business but buying a grinder made sense for me. Yuor local market will determine pricing along with your sales ability and quality of service- the right price is as much as the market will bear along with leaving both you and the customer satisfied. I would advise you to look through some olkd threads here and consider that pricing per diameter inch is a poor method(doubling diameter quadruples the area).
Tree Machine
Addicted to ArboristSite
Subbing stumps
I subbed my stumps out for many years. I went through a number of different guys. All I wanted was a reliable, conscientous guy and 10%. I'd end up spending more time ARRANGING the job for someone else than it was worth- contact with the client, contact with the grinder guy, descriptions of where the stumps were, giving directions. Then when it came time to collect some dough the excuses would begin; "we his a big rock and dulled our teeth, we hit an irrigation pipe, we missed a stump and had to make a second trip out. Then I had one guy grossly overcharge a client, which reflected badly on me. And chasing down money. I just hate that. A week or two after the job is done, no one wants to part with any money. Any check I received would then be was taxed, 10% going down to under 7%.... just so not worth it. Suggest 20 or 25% commission, they would just squeal in pain. There was very little in acknowledging me for sourcing the job and doing all the footwork and keeping record. When they'd see me on a jobsite they'd stop and occupy me for a half hour in idle conversation. Just time thrown down a rathole for me.
My current guy, I arranged this way: Give me a handful of cards. I'll pass them along. The client will call you, I am no longer part of it. Do exceptional work because if poor feedback comes my way you'll never see another stump from me. If you're making money, share the wealth, however you see fit.
My clients are happy. Stump guy is happy. I have next to zero time into it and every now and then I get a kickback where I have zero expectations. It took me 10 years to figure this out. It's not a suggestion of what to do, it's just one guy's personal experience.
I subbed my stumps out for many years. I went through a number of different guys. All I wanted was a reliable, conscientous guy and 10%. I'd end up spending more time ARRANGING the job for someone else than it was worth- contact with the client, contact with the grinder guy, descriptions of where the stumps were, giving directions. Then when it came time to collect some dough the excuses would begin; "we his a big rock and dulled our teeth, we hit an irrigation pipe, we missed a stump and had to make a second trip out. Then I had one guy grossly overcharge a client, which reflected badly on me. And chasing down money. I just hate that. A week or two after the job is done, no one wants to part with any money. Any check I received would then be was taxed, 10% going down to under 7%.... just so not worth it. Suggest 20 or 25% commission, they would just squeal in pain. There was very little in acknowledging me for sourcing the job and doing all the footwork and keeping record. When they'd see me on a jobsite they'd stop and occupy me for a half hour in idle conversation. Just time thrown down a rathole for me.
My current guy, I arranged this way: Give me a handful of cards. I'll pass them along. The client will call you, I am no longer part of it. Do exceptional work because if poor feedback comes my way you'll never see another stump from me. If you're making money, share the wealth, however you see fit.
My clients are happy. Stump guy is happy. I have next to zero time into it and every now and then I get a kickback where I have zero expectations. It took me 10 years to figure this out. It's not a suggestion of what to do, it's just one guy's personal experience.
treeman82
Addicted to ArboristSite
There's a guy around here who does stumps by the hour with a 505 (track vermeer grinder, 50 hp). He charges somewhere in the neighborhood of $80 - $100 per hour. The going rate for stumps around here is I think now anywhere between $5.00 / inch and $10.00 / inch. If can do 30" of stump in 1 hr, then I am making a nice chunk of change off him.
BruceL
ArboristSite Lurker
Bill by the hour
I have customers who make between $50 and $330 per hour with Stump Grinders. Don't get caught billing by the inch, because the bigger the stump, the less you earn.
Go to the Woodsmen show up at Boonville next weekend and you will get to see all the different types of grinders available.
I have customers who make between $50 and $330 per hour with Stump Grinders. Don't get caught billing by the inch, because the bigger the stump, the less you earn.
Go to the Woodsmen show up at Boonville next weekend and you will get to see all the different types of grinders available.
Stumper
One Man Band
Matt, For a 30 inch stump I charge from $105-165 depending upon species and location. Multiple stumps will bring the price down some....But I will grind a 30 inch stump in under an hour with my Rayco RG12 push it yourself mini. Your guy's hourly rate and the per inch rate in your area don't seem to jibe. ??
John Paul Sanborn
Above average climber
My $0.02...Stumping in capitol intensive and low margine w/o high volume.
The initial investment is obvious, but many do not realize the upkeep cost these cutting machines take.
Review old postings (as Justin allready said) and see what guys say about tooth and pocket replacement and cutter types.
Do the math and find howe much work you need to do to pay for the machine. Then see how you can make money with add-ons. Most stumpers do not remove/replace debris/soil. With out volume you need to be a "Value Added" service.
Can you as a lawn compnay sell yourself better by doing renovations?
Do you have a loader that make backfill efficient?
Can you easily do lawn restorations after the tree remval, so that tree companies will want to pass the work to you?
The initial investment is obvious, but many do not realize the upkeep cost these cutting machines take.
Review old postings (as Justin allready said) and see what guys say about tooth and pocket replacement and cutter types.
Do the math and find howe much work you need to do to pay for the machine. Then see how you can make money with add-ons. Most stumpers do not remove/replace debris/soil. With out volume you need to be a "Value Added" service.
Can you as a lawn compnay sell yourself better by doing renovations?
Do you have a loader that make backfill efficient?
Can you easily do lawn restorations after the tree remval, so that tree companies will want to pass the work to you?
hobby climber
ArboristSite Guru
Keep in mind that if the machine is not running ...its costing you money! Make sure you have enough work in your area to justify the purchase, running costs and insurance etc. Maybe rent a few different models to see which one fits your needs the best! My .02 . Good luck. HC
Kaptain_K
ArboristSite Member
I have also been thinking of adding stumping to my offerings. This is my first year in biz and I have a 6" Gravely chipper mounted to a 9yd dump trailer which has been working out great. It was dirt cheap and is fast enough for now. Anyway, on the grinder, I have a Vermeer 620B available to me with a rebuilt 37hp Wisconsin engine and a brand new receiver hitch. I tried it out on 3 stumps and it works fine. The price tag is just over $3k. For a measly $3k (a lot to me tho at this stage) how can I not try it? I'll use the same logic I used on the chipper/dump trailer: for $4k how can I not try it? I can always sell it all and get my $$ back out of them. I just spent the last 12 days doing the chipping/wood hauling/site cleanups for a buddy's tree biz. I would think a decent sized, decent running grinder for such little money would be a no brainer.
Everyone always says that you can't afford to buy a machine and ever have it sit idle. Well, I figure I bought my truck, chipper/dump, AND now perhaps a grinder for what most people might pay for just one of those things ($10K for all that)....therefore if I can keep just ONE of them running at all times, I should be fine...until I grow enough to keep them all running all the time
Kurt
Everyone always says that you can't afford to buy a machine and ever have it sit idle. Well, I figure I bought my truck, chipper/dump, AND now perhaps a grinder for what most people might pay for just one of those things ($10K for all that)....therefore if I can keep just ONE of them running at all times, I should be fine...until I grow enough to keep them all running all the time
Kurt
i paid 8.5k for my grinder its paid for itself in the first 12 months,but if i wasnt doing the tree removals it wouldnt have been worth the purchase IMO.but theres a slight population difference
i had a big chat with a freind who has the biggest stump removal buisness in melbourne this morning,we ?????ed and moaned it felt good.
i had a big chat with a freind who has the biggest stump removal buisness in melbourne this morning,we ?????ed and moaned it felt good.
Eagle1
ArboristSite Operative
"The going rate for stumps around here is I think now anywhere between $5.00 / inch and $10.00 / inch. " QUOTE
What??? On Cape Cod I can barely get $1.25 an inch. WOW
What??? On Cape Cod I can barely get $1.25 an inch. WOW
intheelements
ArboristSite Member
Eagle1 said:
$ 1.25 an inch how do you make any money. Not worth taking the machine out for that
juststumps
ArboristSite Guru
new 352sc vermeer ,, 22K ,,$440/mo,,, no money down, for five years....i assume you allready have insuance with your gig....can you at least break even, at that price???sucks having a machine sitting around,, if your not turning a dime on it...smaller machines are less.. so are used machines.....you gotta figure out if its worth it..
juststumps
ArboristSite Guru
intheelements said:
YO,,, you charging across the stump... or are you getting 1.25 circumfrence...
which is probably the way to go...
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