Thoughts on Oregon 511A and 520 grinders

[Sidecarflip]

You have an opinion but is it based in facts?

Simply put, real world experience. Why I only use domestically produced cutting tools in my machine shop as well. I've had excellent results with Diamond Abrasives and no issues at all and I've had numerous conversations with the owner in the past.

It's been said many times that 'opinions are like butt holes, everyone has one and most stink'

I really don't much care what anyone buys or uses, I buy and use what I find works the best and I use the end cost of anything as a secondary consideration, plus I support American industry and always have. Why I buy very little from sites like Amazon where they support foreign industry over American industry when at all possible. That includes the 'Won Hung Loe' chainsaws too.

 

[Philbert]

I get all mine from Diamond Abrasives, not that I buy a lot because I don't. The Diamond CBN wheels go a LONG time without changing them. Just sharpen clean (free of pitch and debris loops) and 'clean' the wheels with the supplied with soft cleaning stone. Currently, I have well in the excess of 100 sharpened loops (20" average) on this one with no sign of it degrading what so ever. They have aluminum rims and are very balanced and have no runout at all.

Because I have 2 grinders, one grinder runs a 30 degree wide CBN wheel for depth gages and the other runs the radiused wheel for sharpening cutters.

Additionally, the Diamond Abrasives CBN wheels are a much finer grit than the stone wheels and produce a much finer finish to the sharpened tooth and unlike the stone wheels, they won't overheat a cutter and cause it to loose it's temper.

All I use and I have a pretty good 'pile' of stone wheels on the shelf, if anyone wants them let me know and I'll send them to you, all you have to do is pay the postage.

One good thing about CBN wheels is, you don't have to install the clunky guard that comes with grinders because the CBN wheels will never 'explode'. The grit is deposited on the solid aluminum rim and is in perfect balance, so no chance of the wheels coming apart. I really don't care for the wheel guards anyway, hard to remove and hard to install.

Diamond Abrasives sell on Amazon online but they also have a very informative website, look it up on your favorite search engine... They ship right away too and take all credit cards and personal checks as well.

They manufacture CBN wheels for almost every make of chain grinders.

Be apprised, they aren't cheap but considering the useful life of the wheels (Diamond claims at least 400 average 20" loops), the cost is really less than stone wheels and you never have to dress them or be concerned with a compromised stone wheel that can explode in your face.

I won't use anything else.

I run the radius CBN wheel on the cheap Vevor grinder I purchased because the depth stop on the Vevor is much better and way more repeatable than the Oregon and the depth gage wheel in the Oregon, plus the Vevor has a much better (tighter clamping chain vise).

I'll never go back to stone wheels.

I have to disagree, based on my experience.

I purchased a pair of CBN wheels from Diamond abrasives, several years back, due to all the positive comments posted in forums like this.



Was not impressed.

The finish was much coarser than I got with a standard ‘pink’ wheel. I could still ‘burn’ a cutter if I tried. Did not sharpen faster overall.


The company offices are 20 miles from my home. I called them a few times, and asked if I could stop by to discuss my issues ( something I could do differently?).

They did not really want to talk. They told me I just needed more practice with a grinder.

Some guys suggested ‘dressing’ with the white, cleaning stick. No change. Sold them in the ‘Trading Post’.

Not saying that another brand or grit of CBN can’t work better. My experience was poor.

I get Tecomec branded, vitrified wheels for $15 each, shipped, off eBay from ArcherPlus. They last a long time, I like the finish, and I can profile them, if needed. They do produce more dust.

I lightly dress them once per loop to keep exposing fresh, sharp abrasive.

Philibert

Starting with Post# 145
https://www.arboristsite.com/threads/511a-grinder-improvements-tweaks.197073/page-8#post-6407682

 

[Sidecarflip]

I have to disagree, based on my experience.

I purchased a pair of CBN wheels from Diamond abrasives, several years back, due to all the positive comments posted in forums like this.

View attachment 1128932

Was not impressed.

The finish was much coarser than I got with a standard ‘pink’ wheel. I could still ‘burn’ a cutter if I tried. Did not sharpen faster overall.
View attachment 1128931

The company offices are 20 mikes from my home. I called them a few times, and asked if I could stop by to discuss my issues ( something I could do differently?).

Did not really want to talk. They told me I just needed more practice with s grinder.

Some guys suggested ‘dressing’ with the white, cleaning stick. No change. Sold them in the ‘Trading Post’.

Not saying that another brand or grit of CBN can’t work better. My experience was poor.

I get Tecomec branded, vitrified wheels for $15 each, shipped, off eBay from ArcherPlus. They last a long time, I like the finish, and I can profile them, if needed. They do produce more dust.

I lightly dress them once per loop to keep exposing fresh, sharp abrasive.

Philibert

Starting with Post# 145
https://www.arboristsite.com/threads/511a-grinder-improvements-tweaks.197073/page-8#post-6407682

Absolutely no issue with me at all. My experience and yours differ, obviously. You might want to reverse the wheel rotation to eliminate that burr, just a suggestion and easy to do, just manually induce the rotation and then power the grinder up and it will rotate in the opposite direction.

Far as removing the temper in a cutter, I agree that you can overheat any cutter with any wheel if you 'get down' on them when grinding or attempt to remove an excessive amount of material but that is less likely with a CBN wheel versus pink stone wheel.

Far a coarseness of the wheels from Diamond, I've not experienced that either. Maybe they changed their bonding grit screening to a finer screen but again, don't know.

Finally, I don't care where anyone buys their wheels, or saws, or oil or equipment from. That is a personal choice and what I use really has no bearing on anyone else. I just posted my suggestions and nothing more and I'd never have any desire to push anything on anyone. You included...lol

 

[Sidecarflip]

Sort of corresponds with my experience with the cheap Chinese made Vevor chain grinder. I don't normally buy Chinese made stuff but I was pleasantly surprised with it.

Today, what can you buy for a hundred bucks, shipping included, that don't even net you a full bag of groceries today, let alone a chain grinder. and it actually has a much better depth adjustment (more positive) than the current Oregon (Tecomec) offerings.

Not that I put much credence in Chinese stuff anyway because I don't and I imagine that comes with my age as well.

In the grand scheme of things today, it was a very pleasant surprise. I've learned from first hand experience that the Chinese can produce a quality product and are masters at copying stuff but unless there is strict and continuous oversight, they tend to produce inferior products and that was not the case with the Vevor chain grinder and interestingly, the chain vise is also superior to the Oregon grinders with the exception of the hydraulically operated one because that chain vise is much different than their standard chain vise on the other grinders.

In fact I have a Vevor mag drill coming along with a full set of carbide tipped annular cutters, which is something I needed as I bore holes in vertical steel quite a bit but I wasn't about to pay the freight on a Hougen or a Milwaukee mag drill, I find them to be way over priced for value received. Finally, when I get the Vevor mag drill, if it isn't 'up to snuff', I'll return it and consider a Hougen or a Milwaukee at that point but the Chinese Vevor is still at this juncture, a viable alternative.

 

[Philbert]

Apple computers, and many other, high quality tools and items are manufactured in China. They can make good stuff.

However, for a number of years, people would take something over there and say, ‘make this cheaper!’ And they did. Often with lower quality, for those who bought by lowest price.

First saw these ‘clone’ grinders from ‘Northern Tool’ (‘Northern Hydraulics’) for $99, when a basic Oregon was $300 (more than a lot of guys paid for their chainsaw).

Now, sold under dozens (hundreds?) of names.

Biggest issue has always been inconsistent quality.

I have one that I bought off CraigsList, used, for $25.

I can use it. But not the same quality as my Oregon and Tecomec grinders.

Philbert

https://www.arboristsite.com/threads/northern-hyd-grinder-making-it-work-pics.40844/

 

[singinwoodwackr]

Absolutely no issue with me at all. My experience and yours differ, obviously. You might want to reverse the wheel rotation to eliminate that burr, just a suggestion and easy to do, just manually induce the rotation and then power the grinder up and it will rotate in the opposite direction.

Far as removing the temper in a cutter, I agree that you can overheat any cutter with any wheel if you 'get down' on them when grinding or attempt to remove an excessive amount of material but that is less likely with a CBN wheel versus pink stone wheel.

Far a coarseness of the wheels from Diamond, I've not experienced that either. Maybe they changed their bonding grit screening to a finer screen but again, don't know.

Finally, I don't care where anyone buys their wheels, or saws, or oil or equipment from. That is a personal choice and what I use really has no bearing on anyone else. I just posted my suggestions and nothing more and I'd never have any desire to push anything on anyone. You included...lol

I've found it easier to blue a cutter with the cbn vs pink Oregon wheels. I have 2 older Diamond brand and 2 new Baltics. Both 3/16 and 1/8".
These are rated at 80g in their adds. The pinks are 60g. I get a finer finish with the cbns, either one.
S
It would make sense for easier bluing with a finer grit wheel, imo.

 

[president]

Tried CBN.

I like the standard’ wheels.

I might be an outlier.

Philbert

? why not

 

[president]

Diamond sells the poorest quality imho.
They also mostly push #150 grit. They also sell a lot of people diamond matrix instead of cbn. They are a poor service to ask for help. They sell is about all.

T1

 

[Philbert]

? why not

Posted above.

Mostly due to rougher finish with CBN. Might be other grits available?

Can still ‘burn’ cutters if not careful. Not ‘magic’.

Can profile standard wheels to custom shapes, if desired.

A variety of grits available.

Can buy 7+ standard wheels for cost of 1 CBN.

CBN does produce less dust.

Philbert

 

[Sidecarflip]

Apple computers, and many other, high quality tools and items are manufactured in China. They can make good stuff.

However, for a number of years, people would take something over there and say, ‘make this cheaper!’ And they did. Often with lower quality, for those who bought by lowest price.

First saw these ‘clone’ grinders from ‘Northern Tool’ (‘Northern Hydraulics’) for $99, when a basic Oregon was $300 (more than a lot of guys paid for their chainsaw).

Now, sold under dozens (hundreds?) of names.

Biggest issue has always been inconsistent quality.

I have one that I bought off CraigsList, used, for $25.

I can use it. But not the same quality as my Oregon and Tecomec grinders.

Philbert

https://www.arboristsite.com/threads/northern-hyd-grinder-making-it-work-pics.40844/

Your post reminded me of

Can buy 7+ standard wheels for cost of 1 CBN.

...and spend countless time re dressing the radius as well. Don't forget that little tid bit.

Not going to continue to comment other than to say the Diamond Abrasive CBN wheels continue to exceed my expectations, especially for longevity. Over 100 loops now and no appreciable change in radius or grindability.

 

[sundance]

Apple computers, and many other, high quality tools and items are manufactured in China. They can make good stuff.

However, for a number of years, people would take something over there and say, ‘make this cheaper!’ And they did. Often with lower quality, for those who bought by lowest price.

First saw these ‘clone’ grinders from ‘Northern Tool’ (‘Northern Hydraulics’) for $99, when a basic Oregon was $300 (more than a lot of guys paid for their chainsaw).

Now, sold under dozens (hundreds?) of names.

Biggest issue has always been inconsistent quality.

I have one that I bought off CraigsList, used, for $25.

I can use it. But not the same quality as my Oregon and Tecomec grinders.

Philbert

https://www.arboristsite.com/threads/northern-hyd-grinder-making-it-work-pics.40844/

Shame the pictures are gone.

 

[Sidecarflip]

Shame the pictures are gone.

To whom it may or may not concern...

I do find the comments about the Chinese chain grinders interesting in as much members on this forum rave about the Chinese chain saws which I find to be very prejudicial. A while ago I purchased one (a farmtec or some such) and it was a **** pot saw to say the least and I gifted it to the guy down the road that I really don't like anyway) It was cheap to purchase and it was cheaply made as well. Total crap.

Of course I prefer Echo saws over the holy grail Stihls' even though I do own 3 of them and my ancient 028 still runs like a top and will probably outlast me but I'll never buy a new Stihl when I can purchase an Echo for less. Bad enough I have to deal with computerized, drive by wire vehicles, I don't want a drive by wire saw ever. I don't believe I can plug my Autel scanner into one anyway.

My farm tractor dealer just inked a deal with Echo so he will be carrying the full Echo line soon. That makes Echo a one stop shop for me and I have a bad feeling that I'll wind up working on them in his shop anyway, usually how that stuff works for me as I do work for him very part time delivering new tractors, not like I don't have enough to do as it is.

However, the Vevor that I purchased must have not been made on a Friday because the base casting as well as the upright are very well executed and like I said before, the chain vise is a lot better (clamps tighter) than my Oregon does and the depth stop is also much more positive and located in a much more user friendly position than the Oregon, which is tucked away up underneath of the wheel guard and has a plastic knob and a locking plastic over knob that don't lock the depth adjustment very well. and it's very cumbersome to adjust, let alone set consistently.

Don't really care what anyone buys or what they don't buy, all I know is the one I purchased for 100 bucks is equal to and in some respects better than the Oregon I paid about 3 times as much for.

Candidly, I bought the Vevor just for grinding depth gages but I'm now using it for tooth grinding and have relegated the Oregon to raker duty.

Additionally, I find Diamond Abrasive CBN wheels to be just fine and the the owner as well as the staff are always helpful with my questions but then I am working with them so they can develop and market a Wearsharp carbide cutter tooth regrinding setup for stump grinder teeth so I do have a relationship with them that is probably over and above the average wheel purchaser. I toyed with making a sharpening unit in my machine shop but I really don't have the time or the inclination to get involved with that.

Finally, I'm well in the excess of 175 loops sharpened with their CBN wheels (I have both their radius wheel and a 30 degree flat faced wheel) I use on the depth gages and the radius wheel shows no degradation what so ever. All I do is clean it infrequently with their supplied soft white stone and that is it but I do clean every loop in my heated ultrasonic cleaner to remove any foreign material prior to sharpening and post sharpening they all get a bath in light weight motor oil.

Maybe I'm the odd one out but I see no downside to Diamond Abrasives or the Chinese made Vevor chain grinder as I was hesitant about purchasing it but my fears of poor and inconsistent Chinese quality was unfounded, least with the grinder. The Chinese saw I purchased was a different story.

Carry on as I'm done with this thread anyway.

When I get into the shop, I'll take stock of the stone wheels and let you know (Philbert) what I have that I'll never use again and I have quite a few. I have a business meeting tomorrow morning. I'm quoting a short run machining and TIG welding job for a 3rd Tier automotive supplier. Have to keep my 2 employees busy. and the lights on as they say... Keep in mind that next time you wrap your mitt around that high buck Milwaukee cordless tool, you can take solace in the fact that it was made in China as well. Better look it over closely for hidden defects and build quality as it might be like the Vevor chain grinder but made on a Friday instead.