What made the pine branch break?

[ForTheArborist]

I was looking at a man's trees, and he points out a broken branch that he had not noticed broken until it was already dead and brown. Neither of us could figure what caused the branch to have fallen.

The tree has nothing unusual about it as far as needle and bark color. The branch was about 20 ft long - about 14 inch dia at the base. It broke off at about 3 ft from the trunk at 50 ft high, so add 3 more ft to 20 ft in length.

It's very unusual I think because there is nothing out of the ordinary about the branch or tree. All I could asume was that this kind of pine tree accumulates so much weight in needles and pine cones along with being a heavy wood that this branch happened to accumulate enough weight that it snapped in a heavy wind.

The top part of the tree where the branch fell from reaches the top area of the hill and neighbors' houses while it grows from the edge of the bottom of a hill. Beings that hills condense wind energy and increase winds' speeds at the tops of hills, I assume that the branch was at the perfect position to be impacted by some heavy winds. In combination with the heavy, hill top winds and weighty pine branch it seems reasonable to me that the branch did not have the integrity to bear the burden. By no means could this branch be too over extened either.

Has anyone else encountered anything like this? I'd like tell the guy some logical reason for that branch falling to put him at ease about the tree, or give him the news about its need to be removed.

BTW, the total height there is 70-80 or 7-8 stories.

 

[BlackenedTimber]

Some up-close pics of the end of the piece that broke off and of the stub extending from the tree would be a great help in determining if there were any extenuating circumstances.

It is possible that the length/weight of the limb coupled with wind caused it to drop, but something tells me that there was a weakening in the wood at the point where the limb broke, and this coupled with either the stress of the wood weight and/or wind caused the limb to break at it's weakest point.

FYI, I take a digital camera just about everywhere with me (started doing that once I was running big power projects) to better document situations like this.

You may find that the wood was punky or discolored or had been bored by an insect, or a thousand other things. I am sure with some good pics, some of the AS geniouses ( 'geniouses' meant with respect, not in a derogatory manner) on here could diagnose any defect in the wood.

I would recommend that you atleast trim the resulting stub off, so that you eliminate the possibilty of it rotting and further detrimenting the tree.

T

 

[ForTheArborist]

Some up-close pics of the end of the piece that broke off and of the stub extending from the tree would be a great help in determining if there were any extenuating circumstances.

It is possible that the length/weight of the limb coupled with wind caused it to drop, but something tells me that there was a weakening in the wood at the point where the limb broke, and this coupled with either the stress of the wood weight and/or wind caused the limb to break at it's weakest point.

FYI, I take a digital camera just about everywhere with me (started doing that once I was running big power projects) to better document situations like this.

You may find that the wood was punky or discolored or had been bored by an insect, or a thousand other things. I am sure with some good pics, some of the AS geniouses ( 'geniouses' meant with respect, not in a derogatory manner) on here could diagnose any defect in the wood.

I would recommend that you atleast trim the resulting stub off, so that you eliminate the possibilty of it rotting and further detrimenting the tree.

T

I'll start carrying the digital camera/camcorder from now on starting tomorrow. I'll get some shots of this for later. I'm not going to be be out that way for a few, so...

Thanks for the hand with this.

 

[jomoco]

Were you able to tell the client which species of pine he had that broke?

You're askin for a lot of extrapolatin, on pennies of chump change info.

Is it a canary island pine, an alleppo pine, a ponderosa or jeffrey pine?

Is it a beetle ridden halapensis lookin for a chipper?

Post enough pics and details, and we can make you too look like a board certified master arborist to your client!

jomoco

 

[Tree Pig]

Were you able to tell the client which species of pine he had that broke?

You're askin for a lot of extrapolatin, on pennies of chump change info.

Is it a canary island pine, an alleppo pine, a ponderosa or jeffrey pine?

Is it a beetle ridden halapensis lookin for a chipper?

Post enough pics and details, and we can make you too look like a board certified master arborist to your client!

jomoco

It would probably be pure luck if he got the Pine part right never mind which pine.

 

[KRP]

It would probably be pure luck if he got the Pine part right never mind which pine.

Help him instead of putting him down. How much do you know about west coast pines?

 

[ForTheArborist]

I'll find out as soon as I can. We'll see if we identify it as the same thing.

I'm interested to find out. Like jomoco said, a guy sounds like he's worth a lot more when he identifies trees and their diagnoses instantly. He sounds like he's in "the league."

 

[jomoco]

But yu gotta come to the table with somethin, a pic, a branch, a bug, anything but, it's a pine tree, it lost a few branches, do yu think it was the wind guys?

My tarot cards say, get digital camera young arborist.

jomoco

 

[ForTheArborist]

But yu gotta come to the table with somethin, a pic, a branch, a bug, anything but, it's a pine tree, it lost a few branches, do yu think it was the wind guys?

My tarot cards say, get digital camera young arborist.

jomoco

I know what you mean. I said I'm ready to play ball. I'll start taking the digital camera/camcorder around from now on and bringing some pix as soon as I can get back to the property again.

 

[treesquirrel]

It would probably be pure luck if he got the Pine part right never mind which pine.

If it has cones it is a pine.....right?

JK

 

[Tree Pig]

Help him instead of putting him down. How much do you know about west coast pines?

My responses to him go back a long way you must have missed a few dozen of his prior posts.

 

[BC WetCoast]

Mature Scotch pines are susceptible to limb breakage with only minor forces (snow/wind) acting on it.

As others have stated, knowing the species makes the diagnosis a lot easier.

 

[pdqdl]

His original post in the thread seems reasonable. You might consider letting bygones be just that.

Dwelling upon and never overlooking past injuries is what causes most problems in this world.

 

[TotalNZ]

I work almost exclusively in plantation radiata pine forest's and see broken branches like that all the time, they kill alot of fallers who don't look up when felling.
It's the wind or snow that breaks them, sometimes the whole top of the tree's broken off.

 

[ForTheArborist]

I work almost exclusively in plantation radiata pine forest's and see broken branches like that all the time, they kill alot of fallers who don't look up when felling.
It's the wind or snow that breaks them, sometimes the whole top of the tree's broken off.

The branches come down when they are felling trees. Why?

I've seen the fellers in forests with the helicopter extraction service, and I know those workers were commenting on their branches falling out because of the draft from the helo blades. I can't imagine the branches falling out just because the trees start falling without any helo wind.

 

[TotalNZ]

The tree's are very close together so branches get lodged on the neighbouring tree and fall as the tree falls, they usually land right at the stump too so you've gotta have your wits about you

 

[wigglesworth]

Gravity....any more questions?

 

[BlackenedTimber]

Sometimes the only thing holding a limb up is the fact that it is being supported by another tree, very common in the woods. When you fell the tree, the position of the tree moves, changing the relationship between the dead/broken/hanging limbs and the other trees that are supporting their weight. Then the limbs fall, and if your not careful, they fall on you and you go splat.

T

 

[Buckshot00]

Pines shed limbs as they grow older. Look at some older pines that are surrounded by other trees. It is natural.