036 questions

[Bob Hedgecutter]

So finally got a chance to tear it down but the piston and cylinder look fine beside this one small gouge in the piston... the connecting rod has some side to side play is this normal? What are yalls thoughts?

My thoughts are- excessive carbon build up.
That wee bash mark top of piston sort of to the left and above your thumb look an awful lot like a ring location pin indent- which leads us to.......
Why is the top ring opening on the exhaust side of the saw? Is the location pin missing from the top ring groove?

Slight sideways movement of the big end rod on the bearing surface is normal- up and down movement is not.

 

[Jmcgatha1991]

Oh yeah... my daughter helped me tear it down I went to grab a rag n she was spinning the rings when I came back... I put them back in the right location... and the big end rod has no up and down play whatsoever. As for the carbon buildup Maybe to much oil was run I'm it? So is it safe to say the cylinder n piston is ok? Should I try and fix that little gouge on the piston? Thanks for the help new to the chainsaw maintenance appreciate all the help

 

[Bob Hedgecutter]

Oh yeah... my daughter helped me tear it down I went to grab a rag n she was spinning the rings when I came back... I put them back in the right location... and the big end rod has no up and down play whatsoever. As for the carbon buildup Maybe to much oil was run I'm it? So is it safe to say the cylinder n piston is ok? Should I try and fix that little gouge on the piston? Thanks for the help new to the chainsaw maintenance appreciate all the help

I would scrape off and out, get rid of, polish out as much carbon as you can- including the stuff on the walls of the exhaust port while you have it apart.
Measure your ring end gap and piston to cylinder free play (with feeler gauges is fine).
Clean the ring grooves and is there are no nicks or scores in the rings, the end gap is acceptable, slap it all back together once cleaned out.
Carbon buildup can cause all sorts of issues- especially if it hangs on the inside of the exhaust port and starts glowing red in the combustion chamber.

Too strong an oil ratio, low grade oil and rich tuning can all add to carbon buildup.

 

[SteveSr]

Oh yeah... my daughter helped me tear it down I went to grab a rag n she was spinning the rings when I came back... I put them back in the right location... and the big end rod has no up and down play whatsoever. As for the carbon buildup Maybe to much oil was run I'm it? So is it safe to say the cylinder n piston is ok? Should I try and fix that little gouge on the piston? Thanks for the help new to the chainsaw maintenance appreciate all the help

Before you put any work into the piston I would measure the piston/cylinder gap at the bottom of the piston skirt. Too much gap and you will need a new piston. I would also measure the ring end gap in the cylinder.

 

[stihltech]

The piston is worn. Shiny is bad. Should have machine marks going around the piston. Replace it first. Scuff up the cylinder with some 320 wet or dry sandpaper to help the new rings seat.

 

[SteveSr]

The piston is worn. Shiny is bad. Should have machine marks going around the piston. Replace it first. Scuff up the cylinder with some 320 wet or dry sandpaper to help the new rings seat.

Also, after using ANY abrasive on a cylinder i.e. Scotchbrite or sandpaper be sure to THOROUGHLY clean the cylinder with dish soap and hot water to remove any leftover traces of abrasive.

 

[ZeroJunk]

Also, after using ANY abrasive on a cylinder i.e. Scotchbrite or sandpaper be sure to THOROUGHLY clean the cylinder with dish soap and hot water to remove any leftover traces of abrasive.

I run mine through the dishwasher. Wife hasn't killed me so far.

 

[spuldup]

On my early model MS 360 I tried a hyway cylinder but the plating did not take to porting. So I grabbed the old OEM cylinder, gave it a simple exhaust widening, intake lunging, slight port shaping, and Eagen muffler. Also put in new carb internals (limiter delete, of course). After research I did decide to buy a hone and hit it with that (this is largley not recommended on paper, but the rings seated in 1 tank...). Put in new cast iron rings and the hyway pop-up piston, milled down the head .020", keeping the base gasket. It cuts above its class (using 20" full chisel chain and 7 sprocket drive) and starts easy with plugged decomp. I'm a happy camper. Easy saw to work on, really.

 

[Captain Bruce]

You can still get new oem pistons for about 90 bucks, get a zama parts kit for the carb, the top carb cover likes to accumulate sawdust fines through the diaphragm breather hole. I have found more than one with stuck gummy rings or rings that have lost their spring tension that would start run a few then shut off when returning to idle. My 034 super had a start then shut off issue that turned out to be a warped carb cover causing air to be sucked into the fuel pump. Pressure test the carb, pressure test the fuel tank then vac test it to test the vent. Stihl fuel filters can look clean but can be restricted, with a old soft fuel hose it can cause it to be sucked flat shutting fuel off. Even a old worn out plug can cause shut offs after it gets some heat into it. ms360, 036, 034 super is arguably the best 60cc saws stihl has ever made, when ported they become a Tasmanian wood devil. Use all oem parts on it and it will go another 30+ years, stay away from aftermarket engine parts because they are just not the same quality or provide the same performance. If you plan to us it for a everyday work horse get and install the updated clutch/bearing/rim/clutch drum setup. They make so much power for a 60cc that the original small clutch needle bearing will fail and it can wipe out the oil pump and possibly the case. I loved my first one so much I built 2 more and keep one extra of everything

Customer / friend has a MS360 PRO with a bad engine. He wants it back running. I am seeing Farmtec engine assemblies already in the chassis for $200. He won't go for all OEM, and the labor involved. Anyone used one of these after-market cradles, ready for clutch and flywheel?

 

[Lightning Performance]

Customer / friend has a MS360 PRO with a bad engine. He wants it back running. I am seeing Farmtec engine assemblies already in the chassis for $200. He won't go for all OEM, and the labor involved. Anyone used one of these after-market cradles, ready for clutch and flywheel?

If your not building the base send it back. It is not worth the trouble you might be incurring. It needs to be split or at the least inspected with the cylinder off.

 

[Captain Bruce]

If your not building the base send it back. It is not worth the trouble you might be incurring. It needs to be split or at the least inspected with the cylinder off.

I'm confused. I asked.....has anyone bought an aftermarket engine assembly, in chassis....put the rest of the saw back together, and had an problems with its operation.....as in, Fired Up!

 

[stihltech]

It is a crap shoot with aftermarket parts. Bee the thread "Why won't it run?".

 

[spuldup]

@Captain Bruce I have not used an entire AM engine only, but my experience with clone saws (made from essentially the same parts as AM) is that you need to take them apart and inspect/adjust things as needed. You may need to replace some things not always apparent in the initial inspection. There is a strong vibe here in the forum that OEM is the only way. Don't get me wrong, OEM is usually very good, but not everyone has $900 to spend on an old saw.

 

[Lightning Performance]

I'm confused. I asked.....has anyone bought an aftermarket engine assembly, in chassis....put the rest of the saw back together, and had an problems with its operation.....as in, Fired Up!

Oh yeah years ago though. No issues with 036/360 blocks that I know of. Never was to my knowledge. I wouldn't use the piston or wrist pin clips now days knowing what we know about parts being cheap. The rings are a crap shoot. In the beginning only two companies sold shortblocks back then. So one used better parts and cost double. They were about $105 last time I bought one. Quite a while ago. Probably $160 now days. That said I still won't run somebody else's assessment and assemblies now. Most things leave here ported or heavy mods so it's not worth the trouble it may cause to not inspect the block with the jug off and change out to a Meteor kit.

You do you we do our thing. You will continue to get the same response.

GL

 

[cookies]

Customer / friend has a MS360 PRO with a bad engine. He wants it back running. I am seeing Farmtec engine assemblies already in the chassis for $200. He won't go for all OEM, and the labor involved. Anyone used one of these after-market cradles, ready for clutch and flywheel?

Give it back and have him go look at new saws, when the chicom block fails he will be right back at your shop crying and its not worth the chance of failures.

 

[J D]

The general consensus from what I've read is the machining & finishing is pretty hit & miss. The bearings & seals are usually ok but not OEM standard by any means.
Buying an assembled unit & running it as is would be 50/50 that it lasts any reasonable amount of time. If you have the experience & know how to, pulling down the assembled unit & going over it with a fine tooth comb can greatly up your odds of having a unit that runs half decently & doesn't grenade itself in short order.
The squish, port timing & finishing in general on the cylinders isn’t usually great. The pistons, rings & circlips can be rubbish too hence the suggestion to just replace them with meteor if you are taking it apart.
When you say "a bad engine" is the OEM cylinder going to be re-usable?

 

[Captain Bruce]

If your not building the base send it back. It is not worth the trouble you might be incurring. It needs to be split or at the least inspected with the cylinder off.

Bad Engine.