1957 IEL Pioneer RA 100cc project/restoration

[Brmorgan]

Sodium Hydroxide (lye) solutions work really well sometimes too. That's the main agent in many of those industrial-strength "pink cleaners".

I have to admit that I didn't to a spectacular job of cleaning this one's tank out. I pretty much just threw some new gas in, took a bottle brush and scrubbed out as much as I could, and put fresh gas in again. It actually wasn't too corroded, just gummed up from the old almost-neon-green gas that was sitting in it.

Speaking of pressure washers, I think I could probably strip most of the paint off this saw with mine. It'll gouge up wood at its narrowest stream setting, and just the 120PSI air nozzle was causing the paint to flake off in spots.

 

[mcor]

Thanks, I'm never sure about whats safe on Aluminum...

Does anyone know how many variations of this saw exist. Of the two examples I have, there's a few differences as well as being different again from other pictures I've seen. Little things like gas/oil caps. One has a badge with serial # at the back of the saw above the bowl, the other doesn't or appear it ever did. One starter is embossed with the Fairbanks Morse label, the other just flat. The Pioneer name is cast int the top cover on mine where many pics I see have the chrome pioneer as well as the IEL label. The parts saws' carb and muffler have black paint on them. It seems that for two years production, that's allot of variation.







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[Brmorgan]

One starter is embossed with the Fairbanks Morse label, the other just flat.

So THAT'S what that logo is... I was wondering, because it didn't appear to be related to IEL/Pioneer whatsoever.

As for the NaOH being safe on Aluminum, let's just say I wouldn't let a strong solution sit in there for too long. Aluminum is fairly non-reactive, but NaOH is extremely corrosive so I don't know what would happen with longer-term exposure.

Regarding the different "versions" of the saw, perhaps one of yours is from Pioneer after OMC bought out IEL, and is actually a Pioneer 600 or 650? After visiting the 600's page again on CSCC I am really inclined to think that might be what you have, especially after reading the following comment there:

"Die cast version of IEL model RA. Built after Pioneer took over the IEL Company. The Pioneer design starter utilizing plastic pawls was not sturdy enough and a conversion kit was available to change to a Fairbanks Morse starter. The genuine Pioneer starter housing is as shown with the tree logo. The FM starter housing will say Fairbanks Morse on it."

So check out your starter mechanism I guess. You should also be able to tell by looking at the metal - the original RA was sand-cast which left a fairly rough surface on any un-machined metal. After Pioneer's takeover, parts were die-cast and much smoother. Also, at least on my RA, all the big metal parts have the part number cast right into them, in the form RA-XXXX etc., so if yours lacks the RA designation it's most likely a later Pioneer. It's strange that yours doesn't have a model/serial tag anywhere. Judging from looks though, most of the parts should still interchange.

One thing I don't get though, is that the RA is listed at 100.5 cc and the equivalent later Pioneers at 103cc, though all have the same 57mm X 40mm cylinder/stroke. Unless the heads are different, though I'd think that would kill compression.

 

[mcor]

Thanks Brad,

Both saws are definitely RA. All parts are marked as such. I was also wondering about the 100.5 cc vs 103 cc.

I just opened up both cylinders and its not good. There's corrosion on 1 piston and both cylinders have extensive scratches. There's also allot of dirt and wood fiber in one saw like it was run without a filter for a long time. The filter itself doesn't seem all that effective anyway. If I get this thing going, I'll probably try finding a suitable more effective filter to fit or mod . I may just try honing the "best" cylinder and cleaning up a piston maybe a new set of rings. Nothing to loose I guess. I'm not sure how far you can go with the honing before you end up with too much ring gap. Do they make special wider rings to compensate for such a situation? There,s a newbie question.

 

[Brmorgan]

Dunno about that, I've never delved into cylinder honing. I guess I was lucky then, my P/C looks like new except for some carbon buildup on the crown of the piston. I agree with you about the air filter - mine just looks like someone wrapped a few layers of ladies' nylons around the filter ring. At least it's intact though.

 

[bigbadbob]

I agree with you about the air filter - mine just looks like someone wrapped a few layers of ladies' nylons around the filter ring. At least it's intact though.

I saw the lady who wore those 'NYLONS'.
I would probably discard them!!:jawdrop:

 

[Brmorgan]

Hah, I bet you did! Hopefully the old gas and oil sterilized anything, er, detrimental to my health. In truth, I don't really know what the material is. The inner layer almost looks like old medical gauze or something. I'm not old enough to know what they used for filters 50 years ago, maybe it's original and just looks half-baked.

 

[bigbadbob]

The inner layer almost looks like old medical gauze or something. I'm not old enough to know what they used for filters 50 years ago, maybe it's original and just looks half-baked.

From where I got that saw you might not want to know what that 'MATERIAL'
is/was!!!:help:

 

[Brmorgan]

What, did you dig it out of some back room in the tunnels under Tranquille/Padova? I've heard of some pretty strange goings-on there in years past... (I apologize to everyone else, it's a local reference) Or more likely, yer just screwing with me. I don't care where it came from, whoever had it took good care of it mechanically.

Get anywhere with that 041 cyl?

 

[bigbadbob]

I have yet to find out what goes below the 041 AV heat shield.
But bought a 041av carb block. Will become creative if I have to, priced out some used cylinders on fleabay ,cheap but shipping is $25 or more.
As for the Pioneer saw,,,I was on a trip from here to Vernon and saw a crude 'Yard Sale' sign. Well it was an adventure to say the least, and low and behold out in the middle of the boondocks is a sale, I may have been the only customer, cows etc everywhere, place in dissarry, lots of old clothes for sale, I lookin around and spot that saw with a $1 tag on it, sold, or did I pay double that??

 

[Jacob J.]

I have yet to find out what goes below the 041 AV heat shield.
But bought a 041av carb block. Will become creative if I have to, priced out some used cylinders on fleabay ,cheap but shipping is $25 or more.
As for the Pioneer saw,,,I was on a trip from here to Vernon and saw a crude 'Yard Sale' sign. Well it was an adventure to say the least, and low and behold out in the middle of the boondocks is a sale, I may have been the only customer, cows etc everywhere, place in dissarry, lots of old clothes for sale, I lookin around and spot that saw with a $1 tag on it, sold, or did I pay double that??

Those are the best sales of all, and you meet the most interesting people that way, provided you don't end up a slab of meat in their cabinet freezer.

 

[Brmorgan]

Heh, that sounds like Westwold all right!

I feel bad that cylinder might end up either costing you a bunch more money or being a waste altogether... Though you could probably get more for those parts on eBay than they cost.

Those are the best sales of all, and you meet the most interesting people that way, provided you don't end up a slab of meat in their cabinet freezer.

Strange you should say that... The sale where I found my 090 for $20 last April gave me that feeling... Way out of town with some unique folks there. And what's more, they actually WERE an old home-based butcher shop and were selling all their old stuff. It's too bad, I could have had a nice right-hand-feed meatcutting bandsaw for a decent price, but needed the money more than the saw. I managed to scrimp together the $20 for the 090 though!

 

[bigbadbob]

Heh, that sounds like Westwold all right!

I feel bad that cylinder might end up either costing you a bunch more money or being a waste altogether... Though you could probably get more for those parts on eBay than they cost.

Parts are $3. Something to play with for the winter.

 

[davecharles]

Well, You guys got me motivated and I got out my old RA. I came across this one stored under our cabin in NW Ontario. I cleaned it up, rebuilt the carb, put on a new chain and TODAY IT RAN. I'm going to repaint it and get it into the same condition it was in 50 years ago. If anyone has one of the chrome "pioneer" logos and one of the round discs that go on the cover, mine are missing.
Dave:greenchainsaw:

 

[Jacob J.]

Well, You guys got me motivated and I got out my old RA. I came across this one stored under our cabin in NW Ontario. I cleaned it up, rebuilt the carb, put on a new chain and TODAY IT RAN. I'm going to repaint it and get it into the same condition it was in 50 years ago. If anyone has one of the chrome "pioneer" logos and one of the round discs that go on the cover, mine are missing.
Dave:greenchainsaw:

Sounds like a worthwhile project, please keep us posted. Good luck on finding the round IEL badge, those are hard to come by. I'm looking for one myself. I have a feeling I'll end up making one.

 

[bigbadbob]

Posted it once before, a little Pioneer knife given to me from an old friend, he has two more still in their original boxes.

 

[Brmorgan]

Finally complete & running well!

Today I found the time to do the few last-minute things to get this saw done for now, minus paint. I was having trouble getting it to pull gas at low RPMs so I searched all the usual suspects. I replaced the fuel line again with proper stuff as I had just used some scrap PVC tubing I had lying around, and in the process snapped the plastic barb fitting on the bottom of the carb off. So it's krazy-glued on for now and seems to be holding up just fine, but I will be getting a replacement as soon as I get up to see the old guy I get parts from. I also cut a new rubber gasket for the glass sediment bowl out of an old skidder/loader tire tube (ask your local tire shop for a flat one, one big tube is a lifetime's worth). I think it was here somebody suggested 3/4T L and 1-1/2T H on the carb but those don't quite work. It needs about a full turn open on the Low and about 1-1/4 on the high at most and still sounds a might rich at that, but I don't have any bigger wood to test 'er out in right now, neither have I run something this old so I'm not sure how it should sound exactly. It starts in just a couple choked pulls now, and I think I have the idle figured out, but it's hard due to the problem below.

One thing I might have to look at is the clutch. When it engages it really "snaps" and and engages HARD, such that at idle every once in a while the clutch will engage just for a split second, making a loud snapping noise. Also I made a few cuts in a ~7" pine firewood piece, but if I really pushed down and made the chain bite in hard, it would stall the saw in an instant, such that I thought it had seized the first time. Scared the crap out of me. Perhaps, though, these are problems endemic to old clutches like this? I was surprised to see such a small clutch (about 2.5" diameter) on a 100-cc saw. I haven't looked at it to check for loose springs yet though, and that would more than likely explain these problems too. Either way something doesn't seem right.

Check out the ORIGINAL dogs I picked up from my older friend. He pulled them right off an RA that he had for $2. And they even have about 75% of their paint! I stripped the old rope that was wound around the handle. It was half coming undone anyway and these came with a bare handle stock. I will try to replace the starter handle as soon as I can see what an original looked like and try to match it.

That's even original Pioneer chain! Though I'm pretty sure it's post-IEL Pioneer. I had a 36" loop of .404 with a section where the drivers had been all chewed up from a skipped sprocket or something, so I just cut that out and made it to fit this bar. Every drive link has "Pioneer" stamped into it. The bar is not a Pioneer but I might be able to convince my friend to sell me one. This one even looks like it's been drilled for milling, which might explain why the oiler holes have also been drilled out. I actually will have to infill them with a small weld because they are drilled past the oiler channel on the saw, though I guess the bar shim plates should mitigate oil leaking. The outer one of them has one "wing" broken off so I will have to either find one or make one out of some sheet steel, which is the more likely option. I've made some pretty decent copies before with a Dremel, a few cutting wheels, and some patience. I think I'm going to build a small sheet cutter out of a chipper blade from the mill though. Give it some extra weight and it should do a fine job. That steel's as hard as a rock.

All in all, this thing wasn't nearly the job I was anticipating when I received it all ugly and dirty. Interesting, to say the least. Once I have the time and experience to give it new paint it'll look really nice up on my shelf. I have respect for someone who used one of these all day. This includes my older friend, who said he used these from when they were introduced until he switched over to Contras/090s a few years later. He loves them, which explains the whole shelf of yellow in his shop. Says they were damn near indestructible, that they would keep chugging along even with less than 100lb compression. He said they never used very big bars on them though because they aren't incredibly powerful for their size.

Has anyone else noticed that Contras are nearly a copy of this saw, with the exception of the oiler differences and the Contra's lack of the glass fuel bowl? I don't mean to blaspheme Stihl, but this saw is the elder and the similarities are many.

 

[Rookie1]

Very cool Br. Its cool to see old saws worked on and restored. Thanks for the pics.

 

[mtfallsmikey]

I just scored an RA this past Friday...good runner/cutter, $40 CL special...should have pics/video today.

 

[mtfallsmikey]

BR:...see if you can do a couple of close-up pics of that chain....no markings on mine, 18" original bar, maybe chain....

Jerry/BR...any parts available for these?...and literature.