1957 IEL Pioneer RA 100cc project/restoration

[pioneerguy600]

I'm jealous, Jerry!!!!!!!!!! :biggrinbounce2: :biggrinbounce2:

RA`s aren`t hard to find, I was offered 3 last month, shipping them is the problem because they are so heavy.
Pioneerguy600

 

[mickeyd]

. I was 15 and I didn't necessarily want it to start.

hahaha that is so true .
I tell my teenagers dont make plans we are cutting tomorrow and the next day they didnt understand that it was normal for a saw to not fire on the first couple pulls, after 1 pull and nothing they would look at each other and grin,hehehe no work today . 2 pulls nuthin.. glee on their face thinking they could go back to video games and joy in my heart cause I knew on the next pull the old farmsaw would fire up breaking their hearts
thanks for the memory
Mick

 

[HolmenTree]

Good work so far. I am going to doll up a couple RA saws myself. Another member here gave me a parts saw and then I scored a complete runner locally. I think these old Pioneers are some of the best saws that ever came out of Canuckistan.

Yes I agree in 1957 the Pioneer RA innovated the chainsaw industry, here is another innovation out of Canada in 1957. The Avro Arrow interceptor/fighter jet, developed starting in 1953. Top speed mach 2 [twice the speed of sound], ceiling height 50,000+ feet. Designed to intercept Soviet bombers from the north. Same day it was unveiled ,Soviets send Sputnik into orbit, now change of plans, Canadian government cancels and destroys all Arrows in 1959. 12,000 Avro employees are laid off ,all the top engineers join NASA. 10 yrs later man on the moon. Thanks to Canada eh?

 

[SilverBox]

Here's part of why I can't keep it running really well. The carb is a Tillotson HL-22A, which I've never worked on before. At first I thought it identical to the carb on my 090, but it's not. This one has only a Low jet adjustment on the left-hand side of the carb body, the H jet is just plugged with unmilled aluminum. But just above-right of center in this picture, you can see a brass screw with a spring and a post through the end of it so it can be turned by hand. I'm presuming this is the H jet adjustment just by the way it seems to affect how the saw runs. I opened the throttle up and then opened that screw up a couple turns to see what happened, and the saw dropped to just a few hundred RPM, barely running. I closed it down to about 1-1/2 turns and it sounds good at WOT. I'm just having trouble getting it to both run well and start well. I haven't put the compression tester on it yet, but Bob said he tested it out at 130 PSI. Assuming compression is good, does anyone know the recommended jet screw settings for this saw?

I love the big, beefy muffler on the front of this thing!

How d'ya like the glass fuel bowl? It's neat, but I'd think it would be a major liability out in the bush. The rope wrap on the handlebar is coming apart, and I'm torn between leaving it bare as it came from the factory, or wrapping it with something else. So far I left the DIY wood starter handle for now.

I dug up an old ~24" bar that was lying beside the old Pioneer 1450 in the garage here when I bought the place. It seems to fit properly, though I might have to J-B Weld the oiler holes a bit, as they're a bit too big right now and will leak oil all over. That bar is marked Spear & Jackson 1769, if that means anything to anyone. I've never heard of that company before.

This saw really has some character, and man does she bark when you open the throttle up! I didn't think a saw could vibrate worse than my 090, but I was proven wrong. I can't wait to make a couple cuts with it. What little info I've found about this saw seems to say that it takes .4 pitch chain, not .404. I don't think that 4/1000ths of an inch will make a massive difference though, so I'm going to try some .404 on it once it's running properly.

Once I get a sandblaster and a lot more time, I want to strip it right down and get it looking like new again. The metal is almost 100% like new, except for a few chain gouges on the clutch cover and surrounding area.

My Pioneer 650 has that same carb setup, check it out. I haven't got it running on its own yet, it runs good if you dribble gas in the intake, waiting on a carb rebuild kit.

 

[crane]

The l screw is the one on the side(like you stated), and you are correct, the H is at the back. I think the reason it has the "T" handel adjustment needle, is that the H screw should always be adjusted while in the cut. I have an older Clinton that has warning stickers that state the saw must be run wot in wood only. Not free spinning. All adjustments made while in cut. Now I may be wrong, but I don't think those old saws were ment to run wot without load.

 

[pioneerguy600]

My Pioneer 650 has that same carb setup, check it out. I haven't got it running on its own yet, it runs good if you dribble gas in the intake, waiting on a carb rebuild kit.

Hmmm. I wonder who would have the answers to all the above. LOL
Pioneerguy600

 

[SilverBox]

Well at first the glass bulb wouldn't fill, but I replaced the fuel line from carb to bulb and from the bulb down into the tank, now when I dribble gas into the intake and rev it up a lil for the 40-50 strokes it runs the bulb fills up, but it won't stay idling, I tore down the carb and the gaskets are intact and there wasn't much in the way of build up or debris in the carb, but the gaskets seem very stiff, the metering gasket especially, so I ordered this gasket kit, it looks the same as the ones in the carb. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&item=110350563794

The Carb has stamped on it HL 129A, so hopefully I didn't waste 7 bucks

When I get that in a few days, I'm hoping to the have the beast purring on its own

 

[crane]

Well at first the glass bulb wouldn't fill, but I replaced the fuel line from carb to bulb and from the bulb down into the tank, now when I dribble gas into the intake and rev it up a lil for the 40-50 strokes it runs the bulb fills up, but it won't stay idling, I tore down the carb and the gaskets are intact and there wasn't much in the way of build up or debris in the carb, but the gaskets seem very stiff, the metering gasket especially, so I ordered this gasket kit, it looks the same as the ones in the carb. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&item=110350563794

The Carb has stamped on it HL 129A, so hopefully I didn't waste 7 bucks

When I get that in a few days, I'm hoping to the have the beast purring on its own

That kit will work, but it is only the gasket kit. It would have been better to get the full rebuild kit, RK88HL comes to mind, that way you could have replaced the needle and seat. Takle good care to clean everything up real good and check all your passageways and you should be good to go. Keep posting pics.......:greenchainsaw:

 

[Brmorgan]

The l screw is the one on the side(like you stated), and you are correct, the H is at the back. I think the reason it has the "T" handel adjustment needle, is that the H screw should always be adjusted while in the cut. I have an older Clinton that has warning stickers that state the saw must be run wot in wood only. Not free spinning. All adjustments made while in cut. Now I may be wrong, but I don't think those old saws were meant to run wot without load.

That's good advice for new saws too. It's never good to hold any 2-stroke wide open without a load, as it can easily get too hot and/or run too lean.

Also, does the T handle on your H adjustment get in the way of the choke lever? I'm debating whether to bend the lever out a bit, or shave some of the length off of the T pin.

SilverBox, do you have the rubber bushings that go on the cylinder heat shield? If not it'll rattle all over the place and the top cover might not fit properly. Also, have you checked the gasket under the glass fuel sediment bowl? Mine was cork and was cracked quite a bit. If I dribbled gas in the throat it would pull fuel and run, but it couldn't fill the bowl just pulling the recoil at a cold start. Cut a new one from a rubber sheet and it's all good.

 

[mtfallsmikey]

Same carb on my RA...fortunately, mine was / is running fairly well, had to readjust to make it run on the 40:1 mix I'm using now, previous owner ran it at the original 12:1...my glass bulb never has fully filled....Try not to let it run out of gas, it's a be-aahch to start! I'm sure the owner's manual would have the adjustment procedure....never found out who won the manual on E-Bay a couple of weeks ago, went for $50...Where's Pioneerguy600?

 

[SilverBox]

That's good advice for new saws too. It's never good to hold any 2-stroke wide open without a load, as it can easily get too hot and/or run too lean.

Also, does the T handle on your H adjustment get in the way of the choke lever? I'm debating whether to bend the lever out a bit, or shave some of the length off of the T pin.

SilverBox, do you have the rubber bushings that go on the cylinder heat shield? If not it'll rattle all over the place and the top cover might not fit properly. Also, have you checked the gasket under the glass fuel sediment bowl? Mine was cork and was cracked quite a bit. If I dribbled gas in the throat it would pull fuel and run, but it couldn't fill the bowl just pulling the recoil at a cold start. Cut a new one from a rubber sheet and it's all good.

My T handle H adjustment doesn't interfere with the choke lever, at least not that I've noticed.

I only have whats in that first picture, 1 rubber bushing of it looks like 4 on the heat shield. It doesn't interfere with the top cover fitting right thu. I'll check it later today when I'm out of the house

Your right about the gasket under the glass bowl, the gasket looks somewhat questionable and it does leak, but very very slowly (takes days for the fuel in the bulb to get noticably lower). I'll probably cut a new rubber one.

 

[SilverBox]

my glass bulb never has fully filled....Try not to let it run out of gas, it's a be-aahch to start!

Mine doesn't fill all the way either, it gets up to the 2 holes in the top of the metal part, but before I changed the fuel lines, it was bone dry and didn't have any gas in it, I was excited just to see gas being pulled up into the bulb, progress!!

If you run out of gas, pop the top cover and dribble in 1cc or so of premix into the intake, that should run the engine enuf cycles to pull gas up into the bulb, its how I know mine works.

 

[WesternSaw]

Pioneer RA

Hi Fellas
I have looked thru a portion of my newly acquired printed material and found pages of stuff on the H and HL series carbs.Not positive that this is what you want but I am going to post it in the Pioneer collecting thread today,let me know if this helps you guys
Lawrence

 

[Brmorgan]

The glass bowl should never FILL with fuel, just enough to get "over the dam" to the outflow hole that leads to the carb. The problem with having a leaky gasket here is that a bad seal will keep the saw's compression from pulling fuel into the carb - instead it will suck air thru the buggered gasket. This isn't a danger to the saw, as it shouldn't lean it out, but it will make cold starting a nightmare.

 

[SilverBox]

yup, Thats how much mine fills up. To the level of the smaller hole that goes to the fuel line to the carb.

 

[SilverBox]

That kit will work, but it is only the gasket kit. It would have been better to get the full rebuild kit, RK88HL comes to mind, that way you could have replaced the needle and seat. Takle good care to clean everything up real good and check all your passageways and you should be good to go. Keep posting pics.......:greenchainsaw:

It worked great the beast lives!!! lol.

Here's a couple pics of the carb rebuild.

It runs like a champ now, need to tune it up thu.

 

[crane]

Looks good. Those older HL carbs almost always work, and if they don't, a carb kit is easy to install and set. Now, tune it up and post a video of it buried in a nice big round.
Drew

BTW theres a lot of pics and talk in the pioneer thread of those old IEL/Pioneers. Wander over sometime.

 

[WesternSaw]

Looks good SilverBox,but watch that drinking on the job LOL
Lawrence

 

[SilverBox]

Looks good. Those older HL carbs almost always work, and if they don't, a carb kit is easy to install and set. Now, tune it up and post a video of it buried in a nice big round.
Drew

BTW theres a lot of pics and talk in the pioneer thread of those old IEL/Pioneers. Wander over sometime.

Whelp I ran the old Pioneer with a new chain on my mini mill today, she cuts real nice, the slow torque actually pulls the saw thru the wood uphill!! no pushing!!

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[Jacob J.]

I love that old Pioneer sound....

Good work!