Advanced Rigging Walking Brush and Wood

[jomoco]

There have been many takedowns that required me to set up a wood walking rigging setup that meant my rope men had to really pay attention to timing and team work.

How many of you demolition veterans out there know what I'm talking about?
Can you explain the process and the need for it?

Some of the younger aspiring demolition climbers would I'm sure, enjoy and appreciate the discussion.

Work Safe

jomoco

 

[jefflovstrom]

You are right jomoco, Good topic for those of us who had to do it, as is does require a good team.
Jeff

 

[woodchux]

Are yall talkin about drift lines?

 

[beowulf343]

Are yall talkin about drift lines?

That's what I'm wondering. I've never heard the term "wood walking rigging setup" around here. Wonder if it's a california term?

 

[BostonBull]

Is this something like a lowering line as normal with a tag line or lines for guiding the piece out and around things?

 

[jomoco]

Walking Wood and Brush

There is always going to be that tree that you can't get a crane to, that's all over the clients house or building, that has many multiple leaders, has a huge spread and only a little bitty courtyard or patch of lawn in which to lower the brush and wood. Many times these trees can be wider than they are tall. Trees like this can be quite challenging for even experienced climbers. Even if there is a good sturdy lowering point directly over the preferred landing pad, how can you safely get brush and wood to land there when it is farther away than the heigth of your lowering point? It seems almost impossible!

This is when the ability to walk brush and wood is often the only viable means of safely getting the tree down. Walking wood is done by using multiple lowering points in the tree to " walk " the wood or brush over to where it can be safely lowered to the ground. It is a very time consuming process that requires alot of forethought and two or sometimes even three teams of ropemen that know how to work together as a team.

For simplicity's sake let's use two seperate lowering points with a pulley or lowering block in each, two Hobbs devices, each manned with two experienced ropers for a total of four ropemen. The second team lowering point is over the preferred landing pad, the first team lowering point is far away say over the roof thirty or so feet from the first. The climber will tie both lowering ropes to the brush or wood to be lowered, and tell team 1 to tighten up their line and wrap it off, then tell team two to slacken their line and stand by. The climber then makes his cut and team 1's rope takes the weight, now the climber tells team 2 tighten their rope while team 1 slackens theirs, this results in the wood or brush "walking" sideways over to team 2's landing pad in a very controlled manner.

There are many variations of this technique that are possible to perform. I even once used it in conjunction with a haulback speedline to take a nightmare Torrey Pine down over the clubhouse on Torrey Pines Golf Course, it took two days to get down, but worked real sweet.

Do any of you other guys notice that working ropes all day is a sure fired way to get muscle cramps regardless of how many banannas you eat. It sure makes me admire how tough sailors in the old days must have been.

I'm curious, what do you other guys call this technique that I call wood walking?

Work Safe

jomoco

 

[woodchux]

Drift lines

 

[coydog]

http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?p=18439
heres an old thread on a variation

 

[Ryan Willock]

Why not speed line it??? If you have multiple stems on the same tree with an LZ under one of them then speed line it over and down instead of transfering it from one rope and system to another.

 

[jomoco]

Total Control is a must in tight quarters

Why not speed line it??? If you have multiple stems on the same tree with an LZ under one of them then speed line it over and down instead of transfering it from one rope and system to another.

I love speed lines too, but angles of descent and rate of descent can be very limiting factors in tight quarters.

Hobbs device is fantastic for achieving total control whether you're going up, down, or sideways.

jomoco

 

[Sunrise Guy]

There have been many takedowns that required me to set up a wood walking rigging setup that meant my rope men had to really pay attention to timing and team work.

How many of you demolition veterans out there know what I'm talking about?
Can you explain the process and the need for it?

Uh, I think you did just that in your later post. Drift lines, they are. With all due respect, you remind me of the kid in class who asks the teacher a question and then gives the answer, as you did in this thread, to show off. Drift lines are not that tricky to set up or use once you've done a couple, provided, of course, that the tree will handle the load on the blocks, and that you have good guys on the ground. While drift lines can be used in a single tree, many times two trees are used to bring down a given limb somewhere between the two. Rigging that gets a bit tricky as well. You go on to ask if we get muscle cramps from working lines. Hmmm---I guess I'd have to ask my groundies. If you wanted to generate some discussion about drift line work, you might have come off better by just giving the detailed description right off (that you later gave) and then asking us if we used it much. Instead, your original post sort of came off as a "bait." Just my two cents here. No offense intended.

 

[jomoco]

No offense taken Sunrise

You're noy the first arborist to accuse me of being a show off.

Honestly the only reason I jumped in when I did is because I was a bit worried that no one knew, or very few knew what I meant by "wood walking".

I thought it might be an interesting subject for aspiring demolition climbers.

jomoco

 

[Sunrise Guy]

You're noy the first arborist to accuse me of being a show off.

Honestly the only reason I jumped in when I did is because I was a bit worried that no one knew, or very few knew what I meant by "wood walking".

I thought it might be an interesting subject for aspiring demolition climbers.

jomoco

No problem, man. I now understand that you were trying to get the correct term for something you're excited about. That's cool.

Maybe you simply have a knack for coining new terms. "Demolition climbers" is a new one, for me.

Safe climbing to you

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Maybe you simply have a knack for coining new terms.

Could be coloquial, handline, rigging line, lowering line, dropline...

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?p=18439
heres an old thread on a variation

The big differance between drift line and DWT is that DWT "floats" the load on a pulley and the drift and load lines are seperately lashed to the load.

Drift is better for long spans where you would need rediculously long ropes.

DWT is great for where you need high rig points and slow lowering. I do it once and a while with the GRCS. Sometimes a tag line on the load will help control the DWT too since it can move on the rigging line.

 

[woodchux]

Drift lines don't have to be complicated. I use them all the time where trees grow up thru and /or surrounded by decks. No pulleys, portawraps, hobbs etc. are needed. Just natural crotch, trunk wraps, one groundman and climber should be able to easily handle it. Of coarse pulleys and friction brakes are nice and make it easier, but are not always needed.

 

[coydog]

...For simplicity's sake let's use two seperate lowering points with a pulley or lowering block in each, two Hobbs devices, each manned with two experienced ropers for a total of four ropemen. The second team lowering point is over the preferred landing pad, the first team lowering point is far away say over the roof thirty or so feet from the first...


jomoco

why two per lowering device?

 

[jomoco]

Just curious

Drift lines don't have to be complicated. I use them all the time where trees grow up thru and /or surrounded by decks. No pulleys, portawraps, hobbs etc. are needed. Just natural crotch, trunk wraps, one groundman and climber should be able to easily handle it. Of coarse pulleys and friction brakes are nice and make it easier, but are not always needed.

I'm a little curious as to how one ground man could possibly lower one line and achieve any lift at all with the other, particularly if the wood or brush weighed more than he did?

It's the mechanical advantage afforded by a hobbs device that makes them indispensible for walking 500lb pieces of wood sideways over long distances, this has allowed four rope men and I to do what we've done safely. One rope man keeps tension on the rope, while the other rope man uses the turning bar to turn the capstan to achieve lift.

Maybe what you call a drift line is not at all what I'm refering to as wood walking. I am quite sure that what I've described would be impossible to achieve with just one rope man.

jomoco

 

[treeman82]

One man, if properly equipped should be able to do all that with a relative amount of ease. 2 men would make things go a bit quicker, but 4 men is excessive. Then again though I only have experience with the GRCS, and not the Hobbs.

 

[PTS]

Drift lines don't have to be complicated. I use them all the time where trees grow up thru and /or surrounded by decks. No pulleys, portawraps, hobbs etc. are needed. Just natural crotch, trunk wraps, one groundman and climber should be able to easily handle it. Of coarse pulleys and friction brakes are nice and make it easier, but are not always needed.

I agree they aren't always needed but a groundy has much better control using a lowing device and pulley because the natural friction and un-predictability is gone. Plus it saves a lot of money on ropes being wore from rubbing on trees.

As per the one man vs. two men.... One well trained man could run two ropes with the right gear and I have had guys in this position several times. But on a safety standpoint if it is at all avoidable it should be avoided. The possibility of problems is great. My insurance company would be glad to know I used two guys vs. one.