Aerial Rescue?

[nitwit dolt]

I was just reading a thread in the Business Management Forum that was talking about how Fire Depts. are unable to do aerial rescue. Not a subject that many treeguys like to discuss, but still important. Who do call? What do you do?

 

[P_woozel]

Its not that they are unable to do it. They just have to mobilize the high angle rescue team, and not all depts. have one. If they cant access the paitent with a ladder truck then they got to climb, and they have guys who train for rope rescue. Make a huge effort to avoid the situation is priority #1.

 

[nitwit dolt]

So what do you suppose the response time would be?

 

[SteveBullman]

here in the uk its law that theres another trained person on site at all times with the appropriate certificates and gear to hand to make a rescue if necessary. course no one plays by that rule!
:deadhorse:

 

[nitwit dolt]

I believe the same is true here in the states for power line work.

 

[sawn_penn]

I'm not a tree guy, but I have had experience in vertical ropework, both recreationally and commercially.

People use ropes to get to places normal people can't reach. If you get into trouble in a place you needed ropes to get to, don't assume that others can help you. The difference between a victim and a rescuer is their ability to work in the accident environment.

The vert rescue squad at the fire dept may not be much use for tree rescue - all their training might be focused on having a solid accessible support ABOVE the victim. This assumption of an accessible anchor point above the victim is fine for building sites and cliff rescue, but not so good for trees.

The vert rescue squad are likely to be part timers (with other fire service duties) so don't expect them to be awfully proficient when taking on rescues on the edge of their experience.

Time is also an issue. If someone has been hit by an object or cut by a tool then the rescue needs to start immediately, not in an hour's time.

Tree guys spend their whole life in trees. They are going to be 1000% better moving around in trees than a fireman. If having two trained climbers on site is commercially impossible, then I'd make sure that your groundies have the mobile phone numbers of other climbers who work in the same area.

 

[nitwit dolt]

To climb or to rescue? If times a factor whats the quickest way?
I actually pulled this on one of my ground men. I had him lower me with no knot under the pretense of an injury. He freaked pretty bad until he knew I wasn't hurt. Now he knows what the situation could be.

 

[Groundie30]

What if?

Wow, this subject makes me think. What if my partner was up high and got hurt? I think we are going to have to purchase a second set of climbing gear, spurs, belt, etc. just in case of that. I am pretty practiced in climbing, which would help, but it would all depend on the lowering technique right? Food for thought.

 

[clearance]

here in the uk its law that theres another trained person on site at all times with the appropriate certificates and gear to hand to make a rescue if necessary. course no one plays by that rule!
:deadhorse:

We have the same regs here, cept for the certificate bit, "a duplicate set of spurs, belt, flipline etc." along with another climber must be present. I was taught to climb up, snap the guy to your saddle and then use your rope and his rope to come down. Easier said than done, I'm sure.

 

[doggonetrees]

While on the line crew, we had a dummy that we used for pole-top rescue and aerial basket rescue. Was glad to see that the company safety man decided it would be a good thing to train the ROW crews tree rescue. Its most definately hard when you have to carry a hot stick and wear gloves to " knock them off the source". I have my guys trained to climb as well, allthough there are times when they aren't available to work.

 

[clearance]

While on the line crew, we had a dummy that we used for pole-top rescue and aerial basket rescue. Was glad to see that the company safety man decided it would be a good thing to train the ROW crews tree rescue. Its most definately hard when you have to carry a hot stick and wear gloves to " knock them off the source". I have my guys trained to climb as well, allthough there are times when they aren't available to work.

Here if someone is in direct or indirect contact we are supposed to call the emerg.# at the power co. and have the power shut off before rescue. Usually people are blown free from a high voltage line, so I hear, if they are still on it and the line is still energized, its over. It was drilled into our heads at utility school to never rush in and to accept that sometimes people die and there is nothing you can do about it. The line they use is "Don't become a second victim". Fact is people have been killed when they didn't know better and tried to help. Must be a terrible thing to see someone you work with burn.

 

[doggonetrees]

It is.

 

[Tree Machine]

Wow, this subject makes me think. I am pretty practiced in climbing, which would help, but it would all depend on the lowering technique right?

That is absolutely right, in a tree situation. Alpine rescue or a canyoneering situation might require you to hoist them up to get them out.

We as treeguys should be able to do that stuff. We've got a Sister thread going on about aerial lowering of limbs from up in the tree, meaning the treeguy rigs, cuts and lowers limbage. Aerial rescue is that, minus the chainsaw. in aerial rescue the 'object' weighs about as much as you. In tree limb rigging you may go double or more your weight.

If you can consistently and safely lower limbs from up in the tree, you could probably be trusted to lower a human down from a burning building.

It is less about mechanical advantage and more about the absolute, precision control of friction.

 

[jmack]

I was just reading a thread in the Business Management Forum that was talking about how Fire Depts. are unable to do aerial rescue. Not a subject that many treeguys like to discuss, but still important. Who do call? What do you do?

you must have a second tree climber with you in voice communication while climbing thats who is gonna rescue you , call 911 and getcher your boy down fd and esu arent trained for tree stuff but we are, if you arent pm me so i can give you sites its too serious of a subject to have censored

 

[Bermie]

First aid kit on harness, I do.
It has large wound dressing, knife, whistle, and some large band aids, elastoplast type, not the plastic ones, they sweat off!

 

[bendtrees]

I believe the term is "Vigilance."

Although I am an optimist at heart and always solution oriented. I am also constantly imagining "things gone wrong." Generally I favor the following in preferential order... Of course every case is different.

-the belief in self rescue, (get yourself down)

-the belief in peer rescue, although our civil servants are great guys and have only good intentions at heart, they spend most of their active duty pulling obese people with coronary issues off toilets or prying apart the offspring of a toyota/ford rendezvous. Your best chance in a worst case scenario is your crew. I have seen veteran fireman hedge while tying a bowline and NOLS instructors begin to cry while the situation was far from dire.

-Lastly and hopefully, they might be able to pluck you out with a ladder.

 

[mattmann1972]

We are taught to carry a rescue bucket. It contains a rope, throw bag, first aid kit, and a saddle. If your are working with someone that cant get up the tree and get you down in 4 min. I hope you left a will somewhere.

You also must take care when getting up the tree as well. Hope that the vic's position will make a good crotch. The vic's friction hitch will act weird if you use his climb line to foot lock up there. If you can manage it clip his D ring into yours so the saddle will take the bulk while you can still manuver. I can't stess enough that EVERY crew has a rescue plan and practice every month at the least.

Dont count on the Fire dept. to rescue.

Dealing with power lines rescue is a whole other ball of wax, but if you are a line clearance guy then you should know what to do. If you dont then stay the hell away from them lines, you have no buisness being up there.

 

[clearance]

In a rescue situation, forget all the BS, put your spurs on. Many places I have seen it written, spurs are only to be used for removals or emergencies. Must be a reason why this is said, any ISA types want to explain this?

 

[reachtreeservi]

Fast as a set of gaffs.

In a rescue situation, forget all the BS, put your spurs on. Many places I have seen it written, spurs are only to be used for removals or emergencies. Must be a reason why this is said, any ISA types want to explain this?

Amen. no rope technique is as fast as a set of gaffs. If it comes down between my buddy's life or tree rights, I hate it for the tree.

 

[jmack]

In a rescue situation, forget all the BS, put your spurs on. Many places I have seen it written, spurs are only to be used for removals or emergencies. Must be a reason why this is said, any ISA types want to explain this?

amen bro, guys if you arent aware we are supposed to rescue our own aerial rescue training is timmed in case of heart stoppage, new guys ask away,everybody else should be certifying and recerting yearly, bucket and climbing..... knife clean rope etc etc if this isnt ringing bells you arent trained and ya should be.