Another log splitter

[Flaps]

First post at this site, so here goes…..I bought a used gas powered horizontal log splitter a year ago for $200.00 and we split a lot of wood with it over the past year. I loaned it to a few friends and they used the heck out of it with no problems. It's an older machine, I'm guessing early 1970's. Has a 7.5 HP Briggs on it now with a 4 X 2 X 24 inch cylinder and small hydraulic lines. Not sure of the pump size, looks small (really old school - slooooooooow machine) but it still does the job.
Last week the push plate cracked off the piston. Instead of welding on the crack like somebody has done many times before, I decided to overhaul everything on the beam including the beam. I'm keeping the motor, pump, control switch, tank, cylinder and the lines the same for now, just beefing up the beam, push plate and the blade.
Eventually I'll upgrade all components and have a nice fast machine (this thing is really slow). I’m just working on the beam, push plate, and blade for now. I cut up the old beam with a torch and scrapped it.
Bought a nice new big beam and a bunch of metal for the push plate and blade all for $160.00. My buddy knows the steel guy and he is doing most of the welding/work at his shop. I stopped by his place today and took a few pics of his progress(check out pics below, note Orange Crush soda can for scale). He is a great fabricator, machinist, do it all kinda guy with every tool imaginable.
We are going to mount the cylinder 8 inches above the beam(not welded yet, waiting for a few reply’s) I’ve noticed everybody has their cylinder mounted very low to the beam, I had a problem with large logs sliding up and over the small push plate, mounting the cylinder 8 inches above the beam should stop that problem. We are going to put a few more gussets in the beam for strength; hopefully it won’t bend with the cylinder mounted up 8 inches from the beam.
I came up with the idea of mounting a 3/8 sheet of PTFE Sheeting (see link below).....

http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=23210&catid=720

to the bottom of the push plate and to the push plate toe clamps. It’s supposed to be really slippery even under a heavy load. Should make the push plate slide nice and easy across the beam. Just thinking outside the box a little. Want to build something different than everybody else's splitter. I'm also mounting the beam on rollers. It will mount on removable pins and slide out backwards about 3 feet to get away from the wheels so we can have room to work. More pics of entire splitter in action to come later.
After the beam is upgraded and we run a few cords threw it with the old 7.5 HP slow set up, my plans are to upgrade to an 11 HP Honda motor that came free with the splitter, keep the same cylinder, 22 GPM 2 stage pump, a larger hydraulic tank-maybe 15 gallons, larger hydraulic lines and a new control valve. How do those #'s (combination) sound ...??? I know there is a lot of math involved here in calculating hydraulic pressures, just thought I’d throw out these #’s and see what others think.
Also, any idea where/who I can get the new parts from? A lot of the people on the arborist site buy from northern tool, I have a few catalogs from different companies that sell this stuff. Any particular brand or make of pump.....control valve...tank....lines….???
Any comments or help here would be greatly appreciated....Thanks for reading….Check out the pics…..Flaps.

 

[Flaps]

Ideas....

That thin white sheet you see under the push plate will be bolted to the plate (not the beam) later. The white sheet on the beam is just sitting there for the picture(will be gone), it will be cut in half the long way and bolted to the push plate toe clamps under the beam. Were going to cut the width of the push plate down an inch or two on each side and chamfer the corners then gusset it in. Open on ideas of how to connect piston to push plate. Also been wondering if the push plate should stop an inch or 2 from the blade ???...Thanks again for reading...and any help here would be greatly appreciated...Flaps.

 

[ray benson]

Can't see the pics.

 

[TreePointer]

I think you are providing links to photos that are stored locally on your computer. You first need to upload them to ArboristSite.com or an image hosting website like Photobucket.com and then use the link from the image hosting website in the body of your forum message.

 

[Rookie1]

Im curious to see the pics. Ill be watching.

 

[Ductape]

Is this like the invisible thread down in the basement???

 

[DUGs-sawshop]

I cant see pics either , but im on a new Macbook and it is giving me some fits.

 

[ray benson]

Sent Flaps a PM.
You can see the pictures but anyone viewing on arboristsite can not. The picture question comes up a lot. Here is one thread that walks you through the process.
http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=65204

Here is another way. The pictures will not be embedded and anyone viewing will have to click on each photo.
Picture is in your computer.

Type whatever you want in the posting box - look below the posting box.
Click on MANAGE ATTACHMENTS
Click BROWSE, find the pic you want to post and click on it.
Click UPLOAD.
Close the window.
Click SUBMIT
Hope that helps

 

[Flaps]

trying to load pics

Hope this works, have 35 pics to post, have to get ready for work, I'll post more later today....Flaps.

 

[Flaps]

posting pics

I think that worked, I did the upload then the "copy shortcut" trick....YAY !!!......More pics later today...gotta go make the $$$$$.....!!!!......Flaps

 

[leon]

log splitter et. al.




Greetings and salutations from my corner

of the slowly defrosting Eastern Wildeness

@ 1,140 feet above mean sea level.

About your log splitter and raising the

cylinder above the beam:


Not a good idea at all, and it will bend

things quite a bit and if the block jumps

out of the grip of the pusher plate

it will become a projectile that will do

much more damage to nearby persons than

your typical projectile vomit when one scares a

turkey vulture.


I will explain why this is so in great detail for you

detailing why this is not a good idea and about

the mechanics relating to these animals:


The actual cylinder type, the way it is postioned,

and anchored with yoke and pusher plate are why it

will bend the cylinder and rod due to the mounting

arrangement which is the most economical type for

the builders of these machines.




The cylinder is anchored at both ends by

the barrel mounting eye and yoke on the

log splitters beam.


The hydraulic cylinder will react to

back pressure by arching while

attempting to split the firewood

until the pusher plate has secured

sufficient leverage to begin the

shearing of the block to be split

you have loaded on the beam


The cylinder rod begins to arch

for the following reasons.


a. the smaller diameter of the cylinder rod

b. the actual larger circumference of the piston in the cylinder

c. the actual net height of the cylinder piston

d. the actual height of the piston packing in the piston grooves

e. the short packing gland of the cylinder which contains the stuffing box,
the rod packing, which seals the stuffing box, and prevents oil from
escaping the cylinder through the distance between the rods diameter and
inside diameter of the stuffing box referred to as the annulus.


f. the fact that a stop tube was not installed in the rod side of the cylinder;
a stop tube adds to the strength and surface area of the piston which increases
the surface area occupied by the piston and eliminates the flexing in the rod side
of the cylinder.

The formula for the sizing of the proper stop tube is " one inch of stop tube for
every foot of extended length to eliminate the cylinder rods bending and becoming
damaged due to bending as the stop tube increases the net height of the piston
adding surface area in contact with the cylinder barrel walls.

The stop tube is not used by the builders of log splitters as it reduces the net stroke
of the cyinder rod one inch for every foot of fully extended length in the log splitters design.

This is something that should be implemented by manufacturers but it is not,
unless it is specificly added to the order for the cylinder as it adds an additional
cost to the purchase of the hydralic cylinder for the log splittter. This is something that can be corrected
easily by a rebuilding shop as the net loss of stroke is justified in practice as the wedge the actual
tool doing the splitting by creating resistance against the wooden block, and by doing so the cylinder
has added strength to avoid flexing as the added surface area of the stop tube increases the load bearing
surface of the piston which eliminates the stress created by flexing of the rod and barrel with out a stop tube.





g. the hydraulic oil pressure created by the forward motion of the piston is exerting
pressure in all directions on the barrel end of the hydraulic cylinder and the cylinder
barrel is reacting by arching and still containing the fliud energy massing in the
cylinder barrel.


If enough resistance is offered by the block due knots or density

of the wood block the cylinder will react and continue to travel

forward until the pressure generated by the forward motion of the piston

creates enough pressure to cause the relief valve to open against the preset

pressure in the relief valve on the spool valve for the forward motion of

the spool valve.



If the block of wood is not sufficiently clamped it will react and be spit out of the

area it is occupying due the slipage, and it becomes a missile in what ever direction

offers the the wood block the least amount of resistance to movement, and if the cylinder

is raised above the beam it will reduce the net resistance created by the pusher plates sled

and the wedge having actual contact with the beam, in which the actual area adds to the

force placed upon the wood wood block essentually becoming an accmulator storing the

mechanical energy created by the forward motion of the ram and pusher plate, and reacting

by flexing back until it becomes horizontaL


The the same problem would occur if the barrel end of the cylinder were used in the cylinder mounting

without the use of a stop tube.


the problem would be eliminated if the cylinder rod was slightly smaller than the cylinder barrel but it would become

a very expensive hydraulic cylinder to purchase and add to the cost of the log splitter, saying that a double acting

telescoping cylinder would be of greater benefit for a small log splitter as it would have none of the probems of the

normally used double acting cylinder and would generate great force with little fluid power energy due to its design

and mechanial advantage of multiple cylinder rods in its design.



About "arches" and why they are so strong, and why you dont want to see bending in hydraulic cylinders.


This is the reason you see a lot of aluminum flat bed trailers hauling goods that have an arch in them.

This artificial arch is created when building the trailer has the inherent added strength to support the load when

it is placed on the flat bed trailer creating compression and the arch is offering resistance to the load

in the arches designed strength and the arch returns when the load is removed.



My sincere apology is offered for the dry content of the material and any incidences of falling asleep

due to boredom while the above items were listed in great detail by me.




leon

 

[leon]

log splitter

Now that I have seen what you have built and modified:


I would strongly suggest that you remove the cylinder rod and stuffing box with the piston and get thee to a machine shop to measure and install a stop tube one sixty fourth of an inch in diameter smaller than the inside diameter of the cylinder barrel or you wil have huge probems as the rod is too small
in diameter for the task.


The cylinder clamp that you have installed to carry and support the rod end of the barrel will eventually break due to the flexing of the rod and barrel as well.

I fully underestand why this happens due to my experience in repairing and rebuilding mining shovels for underground usage and they are missused and abused by the shovel operators.

leon


I dont want you to fail and be injured, or cause injury, I want you to succeed.

:jawdrop:opcorn:

 

[BlackOakTreeServ]

Hi flaps, good to see you got her going!

I do have to agree, I would say your cylinder is way to high off the beam.
When you start splitting hard woods, you will put to much of a load on your cylinder mounts, ripping or bending them...a sure bet with LIVE OAK.

I wouldnt mount cylinder more than 3" above beam.....mine is mounted 1"1/4 above beam and performs flawless, smooth, no binding of slider wedge.

Make sure your welder is arc welding your structual stuff with 7018 rod 1/8 or 3/16th....welds looked kinda weak...at lest from the pics...no offense to your welder, just hope you get many good years of use out of it

If he's mig welding it have him use .040 flux core wire with gas........

 

[Thickskin]

There is a reason why all of the cylinders you see splitters sold by splitter companies have the cylnders mounted low.

 

[ray benson]

Wouldn't use any plastic sheeting under the push plate. It would get deformed pretty quick with the forces generated. Small slivers of wood along with dirt, sand and bark debris get under the push plate.

 

[Flaps]

helpfull hints.....

Thanks all for your help, I thought that the cylinder was a little high off the beam, I'll have my buddy move it down before he welds it in.
Woodsman---my buddy was having trouble with his welder that day, turns out he had a problem with the main wire leading to his welder, was very loose and almost unconnected, would work one second and quit the next, got it all fixed now. Those welds do look a little shakey, but then again even computer welds don't compare to your nice work !!!! LOL !!!
Keep the info (good or bad) coming, I'm all ears on this project. Here are a few more pics, have 35 total.........Thanks again.....Flaps

 

[Flaps]

more pics......

 

[Flaps]

more pics

 

[Flaps]

pics......

 

[Flaps]