Another *)#&(^! question about sharpening, filing, grinding, whatever you call it!

[user 122190]

That's a bit dramatic, if your worried someone is that bad with a chain grinder, imagine what they would do with a saw. And to cut a chain in half, I nearly fell off my seat laughing

We've seen chain grinder work on this forum. Brutal ham fisted attempts, resulting in bright blue cutters. Nothing can surprise me anymore.

 

[fields_mj]

and I have known guys who filed to end-of-life line, and never filed depth.... "my Dad never showed me, just know what Dad showed me"



That is real bad advice the dept gauges need to be filed down as the chain wears out. If not it's not going to cut good. Steve

I don't know anyone who never touches the rakers, but I do think some folks make too big of a deal out of it. I only adjust mine a handful of times over the life of the chain, and my chains cut fine. If the chain is sharp, but the saw isn't pulling into the wood much, or seems slow, I check the rakers and adjust them as needed. .

 

[HumBurner]

I don't know anyone who never touches the rakers, but I do think some folks make too big of a deal out of it. I only adjust mine a handful of times over the life of the chain, and my chains cut fine. If the chain is sharp, but the saw isn't pulling into the wood much, or seems slow, I check the rakers and adjust them as needed. .

With the .325/.43 micro/mini chains, I've found the depths to need less attention than a "normal" chain.

Another way to look at it is you can change the angle-relations based on how you tailor your hook/gullet profile. For dirty work, there is little need for any significant hook to the tooth. File back the top plate a little, which changes the relation of cutter-entry compared to the depth gauge. Less hook most often translates into a wider arc. More hook a narrower arc.

 

[HumBurner]

https://www.arboristsite.com/threads/are-fop-really-progressive-depth-raker-generators.114624/

Hopefully that links to the right page.

 

[livemusic]

I don't know anyone who never touches the rakers, but I do think some folks make too big of a deal out of it. I only adjust mine a handful of times over the life of the chain, and my chains cut fine. If the chain is sharp, but the saw isn't pulling into the wood much, or seems slow, I check the rakers and adjust them as needed. .

I find that adjusting rakers is the exception rather than the norm with your average chainsaw owner. People on this forum are not average. Average Joe is clueless about rakers.

 

[HumBurner]

I find that adjusting rakers is the exception rather than the norm with your average chainsaw owner. People on this forum are not average. Average Joe is clueless about rakers.

There's an interesting mix of folks here from clueless homeowners to amateurs, weekend warriors, firewood cutters, residential-only professionals, to woods-workers and loggers.

Different tasks and settings all may warrant different styles and setups. Knowing what you need when it's needed, and HOW TO ACHIEVE IT, is critical.

 

[ZeroJunk]

I'm very scientific. I have a Stihl grinder that I only use if I hit a piece of barbed wire etc.
I file the chain the same angle that's on it. Probably 30 ish and down 10 or so.
After the cutter gets filed back some I hit the rakers a couple of licks with a flat file.
You can always take some more off, but you can't put it back on.
Unless you are a cookie cutter then a second or two on a cut is meaningless.
Or , you have cut two million trees like previous poster on here.

 

[fields_mj]

I'm very scientific. I have a Stihl grinder that I only use if I hit a piece of barbed wire etc.
I file the chain the same angle that's on it. Probably 30 ish and down 10 or so.
After the cutter gets filed back some I hit the rakers a couple of licks with a flat file.
You can always take some more off, but you can't put it back on.
Unless you are a cookie cutter then a second or two on a cut is meaningless.
Or , you have cut two million trees like previous poster on here.

I only cut 3 or 4 cords a year, but it's mostly big hickory. I mostly run 18" bars. When I'm in wood that's close to or longer than my bar length, I've found that a fast aggressive chain makes more than a few seconds difference. I'm normally cutting logs into rounds after I get home from work, often in the dark (headlamp in the back yard, and I'd like to get done as soon as possible

 

[ZeroJunk]

I only cut 3 or 4 cords a year, but it's mostly big hickory. I mostly run 18" bars. When I'm in wood that's close to or longer than my bar length, I've found that a fast aggressive chain makes more than a few seconds difference. I'm normally cutting logs into rounds after I get home from work, often in the dark (headlamp in the back yard, and I'd like to get done as soon as possible

I understand. But, the difference between one that I have hand filed and one right out of the box is there, but not something that is going to really jump out at you.

 

[Seachaser]

OP, if you got your saw from a dealer, check to see if he sharpens them. Mine does, and he should be glad to show you if you buy a chain or two from him. Or have him give your saw a once over. In person is worth a thousand words.

 

[thenne1713]

So, I thought I had it figured out. Sharpening a saw. Nope. That lasted a few sessions and then, whammo, doing the same thing I've been doing with enjoyable results (multiple chains/saws), it turned on me. What?!!! I don't want to explain what happened, other threads are for that. I'm just ready to hire somebody. Or buy some kind of gizmo that is foolproof, lol, filing teeth and rakers. I've never been great at filing.

Question is... is there anyone I could send a bunch of chains to who can really sharpen? I don't know anyone around here who does it, seems a dying art. What about the online services with these ten grand sharpener machines, do they provide a quality result?

EDIT: I already have the Stihl 2-in-1, Dremel, hand files, and the Husky roller gizmo. Really seek a service/individual.

Just a point that (maybe?) your problem is NOT your sharpening, but is maybe embedded metal, or embedded objects/ glass/ or sand in bark? Milling or firewood? Pictures of wood after cut? Pictures of problems? If bucking, you are aware that TOUCHING DIRT DESTROYS CHAIN SHARPNESS INSTANTLY?

 

[davidwyby]

I'm good with my stihl USG grinder, I will sharpen some chains for you and see what I can do to improve your situation. PM me pics and info of your saw, chain, wood, bar length. Or post them here... may need to blow your logs off with air or pressure wash. Maybe switch from full chisel to semi.

Short term in the field solution - if the saw cuts to one side, inspect to working corner or points of your cutters. I suspect you might have hit something on one side. If not, then it is a probably a raker issue. Quick fix is to take one swipe off the rakers off the side opposite that the curve is going until it straightens out.

 

[PV Hiker]

I'm surprised that it was not mentioned to post up some pictures of your sharpened chains?? Also some images of the wood your cutting.

Here is a 4 page post that goes over some chain sharping discussions with some YouTube examples.
https://www.arboristsite.com/threads/chain-sharpening-help.364495/

 

[trains]

came across this video, it takes the time to explain whats going on and can get you some basics to get started.

 

[livemusic]

I'm good with my stihl USG grinder, I will sharpen some chains for you and see what I can do to improve your situation. PM me pics and info of your saw, chain, wood, bar length. Or post them here... may need to blow your logs off with air or pressure wash. Maybe switch from full chisel to semi.

Short term in the field solution - if the saw cuts to one side, inspect to working corner or points of your cutters. I suspect you might have hit something on one side. If not, then it is a probably a raker issue. Quick fix is to take one swipe off the rakers off the side opposite that the curve is going until it straightens out.

Thanks for your kindness. I am going to go back to basics with just a hand file and try again. Arthritis my thwart that again, though, we'll see.

 

[davidwyby]

Thanks for your kindness. I am going to go back to basics with just a hand file and try again. Arthritis my thwart that again, though, we'll see.

Let me know. I'm on the other site more.

 

[056kid]

Hi LiveMusic,

Please consider the difference between 'shaping' and 'sharpening'.
Shaping a damaged chain can be done with a file, but is so much faster with an indexed file guide or machine.
Additionally, all the cutters need to be pretty close to the same length - again, an indexed system is particularly useful for this.
Once the shape & length of the cutters is correct, it's fairly easy to do touch-ups with a file or file guide.

Are you using full-chisel chains? One encounter with a rock, nail, or dirty log and the cutter tips are bent down. At that point, the cutters need to be ground back to where they are flat again.
With dirt being a consideration, the suggestion from lohan808 to get semi-chisel chains is a good one.

Dremel-type sharpeners can be pretty effective and fairly fast. The stones do wear down so the first and last tooth sharpened can have slightly different geometry.
My understanding is the diamond burrs last a little longer than the stones, and they lose very little diameter as they dull, so more consistent results.
Wheel grinders can have very good results.
With any sharpening system, a significant part of the result is the expertise and care of the operator. Practice on some old chains.

Note that brand new chains can be dulled a bit by rough handling, before you even get them on the bar...

Thanks and good health, Weogo

Bits do not actually need to be the same length. What does need to be the same for every bit is the raker measurement. As long as each raker is filed in accordance with it's accompanying bit to achieve say a .030 depth, you can have a chain with wildly varying bit lengths.

 

[Weogo]

Hi 056kid,

This bit of information is helpful!

Thanks and good health, Weogo

 

[The Shooters Apprentice]

So, I thought I had it figured out. Sharpening a saw. Nope. That lasted a few sessions and then, whammo, doing the same thing I've been doing with enjoyable results (multiple chains/saws), it turned on me. What?!!! I don't want to explain what happened, other threads are for that. I'm just ready to hire somebody. Or buy some kind of gizmo that is foolproof, lol, filing teeth and rakers. I've never been great at filing.

Question is... is there anyone I could send a bunch of chains to who can really sharpen? I don't know anyone around here who does it, seems a dying art. What about the online services with these ten grand sharpener machines, do they provide a quality result?

EDIT: I already have the Stihl 2-in-1, Dremel, hand files, and the Husky roller gizmo. Really seek a service/individual.

I can accept main order sharpening. Rates start at $10 per chain.