Anyone got any experience with VEC ignition coils?

[GMwoodchuck]

I have a 30+ year old late model Jonsered 70e that I need to find a coil for. I have located several used coils and just recently found an aftermarket coil made by VEC that will fit this saw. Has anyone got any time on any VEC products? I haven't had very good luck with the aftermarket coils but as the OE parts are no longer available for this saw I either roll the dice on a used part with unknown hrs.or try the brand new aftermarket. This isn't a front line saw anymore but I absolutely love this old saw for many reasons and would appreciate any input that may be out there! Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[Little Al]

Where are VEC parts made? I have used some unknown brands of ignition kit Italian made & it has proved equal to the OEM Kit, the Italians seem to produce quality kit for producing sparks for small 2 smoke engines, many with unheard of names.

 

[Modifiedmark]

Excuse me, I'm no guru on the older Jonsereds saw in question, but didn't the 70E use a 2 piece ignition like the Partner Ignitron ign?

If it does are you sure that its the coil and not the ign module that died? That's what I have seen happen more often then not..

As for the VEC brand, I think it is just a brand and uses whatever AM, mostly Asian parts they come up with to put there name on. That said, I have had a fair amount of luck with some AM ign coils. They seem to be lasting as long as the OEM did at least.

 

[GMwoodchuck]

Excuse me, I'm no guru on the older Jonsereds saw in question, but didn't the 70E use a 2 piece ignition like the Partner Ignitron ign?

If it does are you sure that its the coil and not the ign module that died? That's what I have seen happen more often then not..

As for the VEC brand, I think it is just a brand and uses whatever AM, mostly Asian parts they come up with to put there name on. That said, I have had a fair amount of luck with some AM ign coils. They seem to be lasting as long as the OEM did at least.

The early model 70e had points and a recoil mounted coil the later models have a cylinder mounted coil but used no points. On my saw I had a mechanical failure of the recoil pulley, when a piece of the starter pulley broke off it wedged itself between the flywheel and the coil breaking the coil. The last AM coil that I purchased was just a cheap 372 China coil that lasted for about 5 hours, maybe I had the luck of the draw as I have heard of others having good luck with them. I am by no stretch soured by one bad AM product. I have used other components seals, bearings, gaskets, etc. that have held up very well. I have seen several VEC products for sale buy the same seller in Greece. VEC is the only company that I have seen offer an AM coil for the 70e, or any AM part for that matter.

 

[Modifiedmark]

So your saw is a early points ign saw is what your saying? That be a model 70 instead of a 70E and a source of my confusion.

Edit,, never mind I see that your first post did say you have a late model 70E so that would be a 2 piece electronic ign.

I looked and seen the VEC coil you referenced on ebay and it does appear to be a lot like if not the same as a Partner Ignitron coil.

If that's the case you might find that a Husqvarna 1 piece coil from a Husqvarna 55 will bolt straight on as a replacement. As long as the core has the same bolt pattern and contour to match the flywheel.

 

[GMwoodchuck]

No sir, I have a late model no points that I am looking to get a coil for. I have both a early model and a late model both are 70e

 

[Modifiedmark]

No sir, I have a late model no points that I am looking to get a coil for. I have both a early model and a late model both are 70e

That's interesting as the manuals and parts list make the point of specifying 70 or 70E

 

[Cantdog]

He's right Mark...70E models up to ser# 1585000 had the SEM module under the flywheel and coil in the recoil cover and a plastic fan. 70E Models from 1585001 and up had an alum flywheel and a cyl mounted coil....like the 49sp but rather than points there is an electronic trigger mounted in the air box under the carb. These are the last iteration of the 70E.

VEC in an Indian firm that makes many things for the 2 cycle world.....They are the only maker of AM pistons for the 49sp.....very nice fit and finish...measured perfectly...very nice.....I did a 49 SP build thread with one a while back from Northwoods. Only problem with it was the wristpin bosses were way to far apart...enough so the conrod big end could hit the counterweights on the crank. I widened them out a bit further and fit a 52/52E wristpin bearing and the trust washers for the 52....came up with 0.012" running clearance...way better than the 0.195 it came with....can't speak to their electrical stuff but worth a shot I guess...options are few...

 

[Modifiedmark]

Glad you showed up Robin, as I admitted I'm not up to speed on all the old Jonsereds.

So am I off base in thinking a one piece husky 55 coil could be used on the later 70e?

The coil looked to me a lot like the Partner ignitron coil and I know the 55 coil will work to replace that and the Thyrister ign.

That would be a great way too fix the problem if it will work.

 

[GMwoodchuck]

Glad you showed up Robin, as I admitted I'm not up to speed on all the old Jonsereds.

So am I off base in thinking a one piece husky 55 coil could be used on the later 70e?

The coil looked to me a lot like the Partner ignitron coil and I know the 55 coil will work to replace that and the Thyrister ign.

That would be a great way too fix the problem if it will work.

Mark you are absolutely on track with the partner ignition I had to do a double take when I first looked at my P55 coil, I had to set them side by side to see the differences. I never thought about the 51/55 coil. I have one in my toy box and will try and test fit it. I will update my findings, that would be good information if it would work. Thank you for the serial information Cantdog! I haven't found a lot of good information on the serials on my old saws, for what I can only assume is due to poor record keeping by the manufacture or maybe it was lost in the buy out.

 

[Cantdog]

Interesting stuff.....I know nothing of the Partner coil but the ignition part mfgrs frequently offer the same ign to a number of different saw makers with minor changes like simply the length of a sparkplug wire or similar creating a different part #. As to the 55 coil......that is used on a vast number of different saws...so maybe...worth a look.....not sure about the mounting bolt pattern and I'm pretty sure the alum 70E flywheel is quite a bit larger dia than the 55 flywheel so that might make it hard to get any kind of proper air gap......be interesting to hear what you find GM.

 

[Modifiedmark]

I'm pretty sure the alum 70E flywheel is quite a bit larger dia than the 55 flywheel so that might make it hard to get any kind of proper air gap......be interesting to hear what you find GM.

Not being that familiar with the 70E is why I mentioned earlier about the core having to match the flywheel contour.

Like I said, I have done the swap on the 55cc Partner and I'm thinking the 70cc Partner had a similar sized flywheel and thought maybe the 70E would also be close.

Modules can be swapped from core to core if it was needed to make it work. If the core contour is not too far off, they can be filed/ground some to fit the flywheel contour as well.

The coils from the later, bigger Partner/Husqvarna saws and cutoff saws used bigger flywheels with the same basic module. I actually have been waiting on a coil from the K900, K1200 to try as a replacement on a 100cc Partner. I'm also fairly certain the Husky 55 style coil/module could be swapped right onto the Partner core and would work fine that way.

I have also used a Nova module to replace the obsolete Partner Ignitron electronic module which appears to basically be the same as the Jonsered module on the 2 piece ign, so I'm sure that would be a option on the Jonsered saws with dead electronic modules also.

Here is a 55 style coil replacing the original on a 55cc Partner

 

[GMwoodchuck]

Interesting stuff.....I know nothing of the Partner coil but the ignition part mfgrs frequently offer the same ign to a number of different saw makers with minor changes like simply the length of a sparkplug wire or similar creating a different part #. As to the 55 coil......that is used on a vast number of different saws...so maybe...worth a look.....not sure about the mounting bolt pattern and I'm pretty sure the alum 70E flywheel is quite a bit larger dia than the 55 flywheel so that might make it hard to get any kind of proper air gap......be interesting to hear what you find GM.

 

[GMwoodchuck]

Here's what I found with the husky 51 coil swap Mark suggested. I measured the 70e flywheel and got a measurement of 4.700 in., I didn't have a 51 flywheel handy so I used one from a 272 (same coil ) and it measured 4.489 in. for a difference in diameter of just under 1/4". The bolt holes were perfect so I set up the air gap with a business card then rechecked with a feeler gauge on each pickup and got .019 in. all looks good to this point. The only major concern is the plug wire should have a little loom installed to prevent grounding on the case where it bends back around to go under the top cover. The coil is no wider than stock so recoil clearance shouldn't be an issue. will have to rewire the kill switch and remove module under the carb. I'm kind of anxious to see if this thing will run but I'm not so sure if the neighbors want to hear it run at this time of the night!

 

[Cantdog]

This sounds very cool.......but your air gap should be 0.012". Or perhaps even a little less.....there was a service bulletin issued for hard starting late model 70Es...the fix was to reduce the air gap to 0.007" with the stock coil.....

 

[GMwoodchuck]

This sounds very cool.......but your air gap should be 0.012". Or perhaps even a little less.....there was a service bulletin issued for hard starting late model 70Es...the fix was to reduce the air gap to 0.007" with the stock coil.....

Thank you for that correction, I will adjust it tonight.

 

[Modifiedmark]

Yes I was going to say the same thing, that .012" is about where you want it. The old business card trick isn't so good now a days, there all different thicknesses it seems.

I need to find a new set of brass feeler gauges, my .012" one is getting pretty wore, I guess that happens with 30+ years of use.

I think your going to find that the saw will run good with this setup on it.

 

[Cantdog]

So......Have you tried starting the 70E yet???

 

[GMwoodchuck]

So......Have you tried starting the 70E yet???

Yes I have Cantdog. She's a runner! I must make mention that I was wrong in a previous post when I said that "it won't interfere with the starter cover". Both of mine have the same starter cover for the early and late model saws so the coil mount bosses are on the inside of both and if the kill switch terminal on the 51 coil is not tweaked back toward the cylinder and the spade terminal on the kill wire isn't insulated spark will be lost when the starter cover is installed. I also might note that just installing this coil seemed to have advanced the timing slightly, as my saw will idle down to a stall and has more rpm on the top end. I can only assume this because I rebuilt the carburetor and tuned the saw shortly before the coil failure. IMHO a little tune time and this should be a great fix to an old "obsolete" saw!

 

[GMwoodchuck]

As I mention in an earlier post a starter pulley failure is what lead to the failure of my coil. If anyone is playing with this model of saw, it might not be the worst idea to inspect the notches (in the corners) of the starter pulley. I found all four corners of my failed part to have hairline cracks. I would like to call this an engineering flaw but hey...It lasted 30+ years!