Bulk Firewood Purchase...Educate Me

[Woodcutteranon]

Hi Everyone...

My rusty wheels have been turning in my brain after a very good relationship I have established with a local supplier. I am almost sold out of all my own produced split, seasoned firewood and FINALLY found a local supplier who has quality firewood that meets my standards...AND...the price is right.

Anyhow...

Maybe life would be much easier on my back and shoulder if I bought my cut, split wood in bulk...a semi truck load...then me breaking my body and my equipment to produce what I have.

Can anyone give me the basics on bulk purchases? Do you buy by the ton? Cord? Seasoned would weigh less I suppose so do you buy in the fall or spring? Has anyone experience negotiating these purchases? Will the supplier deliver it to my lot or would I be better to sub contract to a private trucker?

Any insight, experience good or bad, recommendations would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance for your replies.

WCA

 

[chucker]

whenever you can cut the middle man out there's a better chance for a bigger profit. the problem is that I find myself cutting myself out about 7 times before I finally make a little profit! wear an tear are optional choices...

 

[cantoo]

Lots of things will weigh into this. Do you own bush, maybe you could just get the logs up and have a processor come in by the hour or cord? Would you be better to hire a local kid to do the physical work? Depends how much control you want to have.
Buying finished firewood means you are at his mercy, prices might change often, supply might dry up, quality might be up and down. He might decide to change careers.
Cheapest wood I have ever had was when I bought a load of logs delivered, used my bought used chainsaw to cut it up and borrowed my brother in laws splitter to split it. But that was a long time ago. Now I have $1000's invested but I'm saving $100's.

 

[T. Mainus]

All depends on what you can buy it for as opposed to what you can sell it for in your market. We have a guy that will sell you a semi load of split firewood (11 Cords) for $2255.00 plus shipping. For arguments sake take out the shipping. That comes out to $205 a cord delivered. How much can you sell a cord of wood for? Is the wood the correct size for your customer base? Our customers like a little smaller size split so we split it smaller. Assuming this wood is coming off of a processor, some of the splits might need to be re-split. Are you going to stack it? Do you have room for a delivery like that? Time is money with firewood and the less times you have to touch it the better. If he is selling green wood you would have to at least buy in the spring time to have it ready for fall. Lots of variables here that only you know the answers to.

 

[chucker]

many have tried to make a buck and a living off of someone else's labor with few winners'! one 100" length that needs to be $bucked 5 times will not leave many cent's at the end , but maybe a few wooden nickel's and a cookie or two. easy is easy and labor is hard work with pride in the pocket more than sense mostly!

 

[ChoppyChoppy]

What reason does that vendor have to sell it at let's say $200/cord vs delivering to what would be your customers for $300/cord?

I could see if the product he delivered was not the final product. (IE, he is delivering logs and you are processing them).

 

[jrider]

What reason does that vendor have to sell it at let's say $200/cord vs delivering to what would be your customers for $300/cord?

I could see if the product he delivered was not the final product. (IE, he is delivering logs and you are processing them).

Maybe the vendor doesn't want to deal with the general public. Maybe they don't have the space to store it so he wants to unload it as soon as he processes it. Maybe running smaller loads (less than a semi load worth) isn't worth it to him. Maybe in his market, people only want to buy seasoned wood and he is busy with something else that time of year. There are a whole lot of other possibilities that we don't know and can't predict why a person chooses to run their business the way they do. Why does a middle man exist in the first place if every vendor could just sell their product for retail?

 

[lknchoppers]

I buy from three separate reliable sources during the season. I only buy split seasoned firewood ready to go. Some deliver and drop off and some I pickup. It takes time and effort along with constant communication to develop a proper business relationship. The value I bring to the table is a volume purchase on a regular basis. I keep a close eye on the quality, moisture content and quantity for every load to keep my customers happy. My market is different than their markets, we sell in different areas with little overlap. I have a price point I need to hit to make it worth the effort. I usually buy about 100 Cords a season.

 

[Sandhill Crane]

lknchoppers: Are you resplitting?

 

[muddstopper]

I hate work, there I said it. When I was younger, I used to sell a few truck loads of firewood. Run to the woods, cut a tree and split it and deliver. It was quick pocket change. Over the years, I have built and owned several wood splitters, but besides just helping out a few freinds, I just considered selling firewood to much work for very little return. Now at 60yrsold and partially disabled, I just dont see me hitting the woods with a chainsaw and hoisting big rounds to split all day long. I scrounge up what I need for myself and take my sweet time processing it.

Producing saleable wood is where all the work is. I would think that buying firewood already processed, with the intent to resale cant be that profitable. The guy that is producing the wood already has a lot of time and money in the product and he needs to make a profit. Buying from a producer and resaling make you the middle man. The producer can take you, the middle man, completely out of the equation at any time he chooses to. One ad in the local papers and he could sale wood straight off his lot for the same price he sells to you and make more money by simply not having to deliver. I can see the tree service guys selling their wood in bulk. They have already been paid once for taking the wood and they need to get rid of it. They can sell it as firewood or pay to dispose of it. Their business is doing tree work, not selling firewood.

Buying wood in log lengths I think is probably the best way if one wants to be a reseller of wood. Loggers know what a load of wood will bring at the mill and dont care a thing about turning that wood in to firewood. If they can make a few extra bucks by selling a load or two of wood to a firewood producer, they will. And its usually a cash sale that they conviently forget to report to Uncle Sam. Now once you buy that load of logs, you have to process it and sell it. Your labor is what you are getting paid for. How fast you can process determines how much labor you have invested. The less labor, the more profit. To reduce labor you need equipment. The more equipment you have, the more you have invested and the more you have to make. Must haves includes a chainsaw and something to split with. Then you need a truck and possibly a trailer to deliver with. Then you have the seat time as well as the load and unload labor.

I think if I was going to sell firewood, I would prefer to be a bulk producer. I would buy truck loads of logs and use a processor to process the wood. I would sell to middle men and the public. You show up at my wood lot and I load your truck with a fel out of a pile of split wood. No stacking for me, to much work. If your a middle man, I cut you a break on price, you can show up, load your truck and deliver to your customer. If your a homeowner, you bring your truck and pay a slightly higher price. Dont call asking for a delivery, I dont have time to fool with you. If I wanted to do deliveries, why would I even want to sell to middle men. Well maybe deliver for a grandma or someone disabled, but that would be about it. If you are a home owner or even a wood seller and you want to buy your own load of logs, I would make my processor available for hire to come to your site and process your wood. In fact, I would probably prefer to do it that way. No mess on my yard and no money out of pocket to buy loads of wood.

I dont know how well my business plan would actually work out, but I would probably make as much money as the guy that hits the woods everyday scroungeing wood and processing and delivering, and I would have more time to do things like go fishing.

 

[jrider]

I produce and sell my own firewood directly to the customer but have 2 issues going on with demand. Through selling a quality product, I can't keep up with demand and sell out earlier and earlier each year. This year I spent more time with my family and didn't produce as much as I usually do. 130 cords has been what I can normally produce and this year I only got to around 85 cords. I started looking to buy in bulk just like the op and have found 1 guy so far that produces the same quality my customers have come to expect. He only has about 30-40 cords he is willing to sell me. I will be turning a fair profit per cord and have started think that I should look into doing more of the same. So I'm out looking every day and trying to make more contacts to continue to build more suppliers. Maybe down the road, I won't have to worry about producing much of my own?

 

[Marshy]

The OP has an interesting question because he wants to buy bulk finished and seasoned wood at a discount price and resell at market price.

I'm not knocking the idea but my first thought is you are basically becoming the middle man for your customer. Your success and profit is going to be directly proportional to the purchase price of the product you can get.

You gotta ask yourself, at this point what is the advantage for the guy you are buying it from? Why doesn't he just sell it to the customer and pocket the markup you are passing on? Would you sell your entire stock at a 10% discount if one buyer approaches you and wanted it all for a discount? Not many people would.

I tend to think you will have the most success funding someone that normally process and sells large amounts of unseasoned wood. This way you can buy it cheaper than seasoned wood, sit on it for one year and Mark it up. Everything is going to depend on quantity of scale so if the guy has the ability to process large amounts and deliver a tractor trailer load then you will be better off.

Even home owners buy a 10 wheeler dump truck load or two of processed firewood. Again quantity of scale at play, how much are you going to purchase to make it worth while for the guy processing it? I think it would have to be a significant amount. I've worked for a guy that easilly sells a few hundred cord a year directly to customers. He always had 2-3 years worth of wood stacked in log length waiting to get processed. By the time it was processed it was seasoned and bark falling off.

Personally I buy log length and process it myself for personal use. I can get hardwood logs for $80/cord if I buy a log truck+pup and a little cheaper for a tractor trailer load.

There's no easy way to get the right deal for log length. The best way is to find the closest landing and stop to asking they sell log length. The closer the better chance they will deliver the cheapest. The same theory would probably apply to your situation. Just going to have to find people why are processing it and see if they would sell a significant quantity to you. You might have success if you can purchase unseasoned wood from them in their off season when it's slower for them.

 

[Marshy]

What reason does that vendor have to sell it at let's say $200/cord vs delivering to what would be your customers for $300/cord?

I could see if the product he delivered was not the final product. (IE, he is delivering logs and you are processing them).

Or that vendor is not selling seasoned wood. Thats the only reasonable way I can see anyone taking a product and being able to Mark it up without taking it to a different market (area) where it typically sells for more.

 

[lknchoppers]

lknchoppers: Are you resplitting?

The wood I buy is ready to sell, no re-splitting, I load it with my skid steer and head to the city. Dump, unload by hand, stack, wheel barrow down ramps what ever is needed but there is an upcharge for anything besides dumping.

 

[Woodcutteranon]

I buy from three separate reliable sources during the season. I only buy split seasoned firewood ready to go. Some deliver and drop off and some I pickup. It takes time and effort along with constant communication to develop a proper business relationship. The value I bring to the table is a volume purchase on a regular basis. I keep a close eye on the quality, moisture content and quantity for every load to keep my customers happy. My market is different than their markets, we sell in different areas with little overlap. I have a price point I need to hit to make it worth the effort. I usually buy about 100 Cords a season.

Thanks for the reply... Do you have a web site?

 

[lknchoppers]

Thanks for the reply... Do you have a web site?

I don't have a website but I do advertise on craigslist.....you can see one of my ads at the link below

https://charlotte.craigslist.org/grd/d/firewood-sale-seasoned-oak-20/6360329646.html

 

[greenskeeper]

JFC

large quantity purchased = lower per unit price

small quantity sold individually = higher per unit price

somewhere in there is profit to be made, how large or how small is the question.

 

[Woodcutteranon]

So here is my current situation... I ordered a logging truck load of poles in the summer...it was too hot to work on them until this week...been hot in Ohio...and I have about 5 hours of saw time on the pile in the two pics below. The 3rd pic is a load I just had delivered this week. This load came in a little shorter...a lot of 8 and 10' logs so I got it cheaper. Regardless, a general estimate is I'm paying $100 a cord for the poles. If I can buy a semi truck load of already cut and split firewood for $150 a cord I think that would be worth it given the labor and wear and tear. Although, that is also where all the fun to be had is.

 

[Jhenderson]

Why would a producer not want to sell to the end user? Because cut and split customers are a pain in the rear. Been there , done that. Why didn't you split it finer? Why did you split it so fine? I want it through the 4' gate and packed behind the garage. Tree length is all I'll do. I sell to a few retailers but mostly homeowners. Tree length customers are the salt of the earth. They know the product and what it takes to provide it to them. You couldn't get me to sell another cord of cut and split for all the tea in China.

 

[NSMaple1]

So here is my current situation... I ordered a logging truck load of poles in the summer...it was too hot to work on them until this week...been hot in Ohio...and I have about 5 hours of saw time on the pile in the two pics below. The 3rd pic is a load I just had delivered this week. This load came in a little shorter...a lot of 8 and 10' logs so I got it cheaper. Regardless, a general estimate is I'm paying $100 a cord for the poles. If I can buy a semi truck load of already cut and split firewood for $150 a cord I think that would be worth it given the labor and wear and tear. Although, that is also where all the fun to be had is.
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Looks like you have a lot of time into stacking rounds? I have found that to be kind of pointless since you have to turn around and unstack them when you split.