Chainsaw choice- help decision going forward

[sundance]

Personally, I'd pick the Echo 590 (or 620 if you really think the differences matter, I don't see $200 of difference) over the Stihl 311. A superb local dealer could change my opinion.
But, I bought a POS MS-250 rather than a Dolmar 421 based on dealer loyalty several years ago and have regretted it. An Echo CS-4910 has pretty much replaced the 250 although I have yet to sell it.
Keep thinking I'll get it to run decently.

 

[IntegrityCarpentry]

... and here's my $109 BlackMax Chinesium saw. 18" bar, so you can see that some of the stuff is really just massive. View attachment 1057043

Not trying to influence decision, but if you go for the echo 590 here is link to o ring kit. I have several sets of orings I picked from, and it didn’t include the metal washer. Not sure if this method is better. I don’t use that filter anymore so it’s not troubling my mind anymore https://www.sawagain.com/copy-of-ec...00p-620p-620pw-air-filter-new-oem-p021016372/

 

[FrugalFirewoodDad]

I replaced it 4 or so years ago with a $109 Grizzly black max from walmart. 55cc range, 18" bar, and that thing has been (knock on a lot of wood) very reliable so far. We recently moved to a new place and I started using wood as a supplmental heat source and I cut probably 3+ cords with it this fall and winter. It Starts easy whether frigid or after running it hot, bar adjusts easily, seems to have good power, and I am not at all unhappy with my cheap saw. Being realistic, at $109, its not made to last, right? I assume this thing will break in a way that I cant fix.

Correction: My current BlackMax saw is definitely not 55cc. It's the 38cc/18" bar model. Apparently a Honda engine design made by Back and Decker/Stanley, if the internet chats are correct.

Not to derail my own thread, but does anyone have experience with these?

 

[sean donato]

As far as I knew they were zenoah copies. Never even heard of Honda making a saw or engine for a saw.

 

[EchoShindaiwaMakitaDolmar]

Correction: My current BlackMax saw is definitely not 55cc. It's the 38cc/18" bar model. Apparently a Honda engine design made by Back and Decker/Stanley, if the internet chats are correct.

Not to derail my own thread, but does anyone have experience with these?

I've never heard of a Honda designed engine being cloned and used in a production chainsaw- perhaps some of the forum experts have.

Black & Decker/Stanley/DeWalt is an American company that, to my knowledge, doesn't make two stroke engines.

Manufacturing execution of any good or even great design is what matters- poor execution can ruin a great design, and the CCP saws are notorious for being low quality and should be avoided at all costs- poor materials, spotty workmanship, weak QC/QA.

 

[FrugalFirewoodDad]

This is where I grabbed it from. Not vouching for it, just that it was "on the interwebs". Cant trust anything ya read anymore... next thing ya know you wont be able to trust the politicians!

 

[FrugalFirewoodDad]

 

[EchoShindaiwaMakitaDolmar]

I'm almost positive Chainsaw Larry is wrong on most if not all of that, but one way to know is for someone to post some pics of Blackmax product labels with the corporate info on it... It'll almost surely say "Made in China" and it'll probably say "TTI, Inc." or the name of another Chinese OEM company.

Chainsaw Larry makes three bold and hard to believe claims about BlackMax, with the hardest to believe at the top, and descending:

1) BlackMax chainsaws use Honda engines (the most absurd claim)
2) BlackMax saws are made in USA (Really hard to believe given the price point of the saws)
3) Blackmax is owned by Stanley Black & Decker (Possible, but is it likely?)

 

[FrugalFirewoodDad]

3) Blackmax is owned by Stanley Black & Decker (Possible, but is it likely?)

I think this is accurate. Or, I should say, this claim can be found in many places online.

 

[Section VIII]

... and here is the town dump that is like a never ending source of oak, beech, and ASH ASH ASH.

This is my real target. As of now, I scrap around the edges looking for the smallest stuff. Handling these would open up an unlimited supply of wood, as the big stuff just sits since no one can handle it.

View attachment 1057042

I need to find a place like that near me!

 

[EchoShindaiwaMakitaDolmar]

I think this is accurate. Or, I should say, this claim can be found in many places online.

Using my google-fu I found the facts:

1) Blackmax Tools (gas chainsaws & other OP Quip) are a sub-brand of Hart, which is an OEM brand of the OEM Chinese conglomerate TTI

2) Blackmax is an OEM Chinese brand & product

3) Blackmax chainsaws are made in China

4) They don't have Honda anything in them, and never did

5) "Stanley Black & Decker" has no connection to Blackmax tools/Hart/TTI

6) Their S.C. address is not a manufacturing facility, it's just a Shpg/Rcvg warehouse

I hope this clears up the misinformation on the 'net, and I have to say that info at chainsaw larry and other obscure sights is about the worst case of misinformation I've ever seen- likely just copied over the years.

 

[sean donato]

Like I said before echo makita boy went on his rant, it's a zenoah clone.

 

[Bubster]

"Never believe everything you read on the internet". That is an actual quote from Abraham Lincoln.

 

[Franko]

Hello. For $400 you can buy a nice h372. the stihl 021 is a good saw for light work.

 

[esshup]

... and here is the town dump that is like a never ending source of oak, beech, and ASH ASH ASH.

This is my real target. As of now, I scrap around the edges looking for the smallest stuff. Handling these would open up an unlimited supply of wood, as the big stuff just sits since no one can handle it.

View attachment 1057042

One thing you may want to do is invest in a metal detector. While it won't save you from finding concrete inside the town trees, it sure will help save your chains from the nails, hooks, etc. that are in town trees.

 

[FrugalFirewoodDad]

One thing you may want to do is invest in a metal detector. While it won't save you from finding concrete inside the town trees, it sure will help save your chains from the nails, hooks, etc. that are in town trees.

My son has one. That is an excellent idea, I hadnt thought of using it. I should be able to visuall inspect for concrete. We'll see.

 

[FrugalFirewoodDad]

Thought I'd toss in an update on my chainsaw decision.

Backstory:
I have a steady supply of some HUGE stuff locally felled all waiting to buck. My BlackMax18" 35cc cant get it done, so I've been chewing around the edges finding the smaller leftovers.

I've been waffling between the highly regarded Echo and a SinoSaw (holz372), 24" or 28". My self imposed budget is 400, but I'd love it to be less though it can be more.

In the meantime I pulled out a powercare 18" 3/8 .050 bar and new chain, both of which I had in the garage from a while back. Took off the blackmax bar and installed the powercare Bar, mostly to dust off the cobwebs and give it some fun.

In the meantime I went to a slightly less than 40:1 mix instead of 50:1. Actually, it was 40:1 with a bit of Marvels mystery oil I had left over on the shelf, just to use up the bottle and clean out. Took a bit to warm up. Coughed out some smoke more than usual. ran rough until warm. AND THEN...
WOW!

Ran like a champ and more importantly I see the HUGE benefit of having a bar that does not have the safety guard on the tip. WOW. today I moved up a couple steps and was able to buck 24-30" ash.

Not having that tip guard thing is a game changer for me. huge. Game. Changer.

... to the point that I am not even shopping for a saw now. Maybe 36" logs are not on my plate, but I've just doubled the diameter I can handle. easily. And the saw seemed to be HUMMING with the new oil mix... once warmed up.

We'll see how long this honey moon lasts, but for now... SO psyched.

 

[FrugalFirewoodDad]

"it helps keep the tip out of the dirt!"

and apparently its been preventing me from really being able to use the saw to its potential!

 

[ericm979]

Switching from 50:1 to 40:1 will slightly lean out the fuel/air ratio. The carb meters premix and oil is not fuel. The saw might run a little better with the slightly leaner setting. It might be worth tuning the carburetor.

The tip things are there to prevent kickback. If you're used to having it there you should keep aware of where the bar tip is.

 

[SteveInOregon]

Hello all contributing members. It looks like you have a good site here, thanks for sharing your collective experience and contributing to this resource.

This winter we moved and I began transitioning to firewood as a supplement to primary heat source. 40-50% wood this year, looking to realistically bump that to 60-75% going forward. (FWIW, as a kid we were 100% wood heat for 18 years.) Running 2 fireplaces now, getting wood stove insert for one this spring. I think we burned about 2-3 cords this winter, but its hard to estimate as I often just bought a load of wood home in the truck and burned it without stacking/measuring.


I am finding that there is a lot of wood available but much of it is on the bigger side.

So I am a homeowner looking to upgrade current saw(s) to one of higher quality and that is more capable.

I just began shopping, and of course Stihl, Husqvarna, and Echo are all names that come up early and often.

Looking in the low $400ish range. Of course less would be great, but I feel I got sold a bill of goods on the Stihl 021 many years ago and dont want to repeat that. Buy once, cry once this time. Still undecided on 18 v s 20" bar.

Pros and Cons of the Farm Boss vs Rancher vs Echo equivalent product?

I have MUCH more info to post that factors in, including current chainsaws and their adequacy. More later.

Thanks in advance.
greg

Echo, echo echo....Do You hear an Echo in this thread