Cultural Cedar Damage

[clearance]

Where I live Native people use red cedar bark to make baskets and hats, they get this bark from live trees. What they do is make a cut horizontally across the tree at waist level with a knife, about 6"-10", then pull the bark, hard. It rips up the tree sometimes 20' untill it breaks off. This leaves the tree with a huge piece of bark missing, the trees selected are around 40'-70' tall. I have seen many of these trees beside logging roads, alive, but with the big future catface. What do you think about this practice? Is it alright because the Natives have a legal right to it?

 

[Adkpk]

I would have to know more about that to make a judgement on that. Defacing anything is wrong. But native people man do they ever get screwed over.

 

[Ekka]

A pic would be good.

Are they removing the entire thickness of the bark down to the cambium or just stripping off some hairy outer stuff?

This might show you what I mean.

http://images.google.com.au/imgres?.../images?q=ribbon+bark&svnum=10&hl=en&lr=&sa=X

 

[clearance]

Its right to the bone, thats why the young trees. You can see the bare wood after, the cambium layer is on the removed bark and the tree, cambium layers are pretty thin, you know. The big old trees have the thick, hairy bark that slabs out sometimes as you climb, that bark is impossible to rip off, and I believe not supple enough to make things out of.

 

[greg carr]

As a member of the Nova Scotia Metis I would say that they have as much right to strip the trees as the loggers do to cut them down.

 

[treeseer]

If the wounds are <10" wide, and not close together, then the tree seems to have a reasonable chance to seal over the wounds. Considering the species' resistance to decay, it could be called sustainable harvesting, though I'd much rather they get together with loggers and debark trees taht are slated for removal.

 

[clearance]

If the wounds are <10" wide, and not close together, then the tree seems to have a reasonable chance to seal over the wounds. Considering the species' resistance to decay, it could be called sustainable harvesting, though I'd much rather they get together with loggers and debark trees taht are slated for removal.

The wounds are like 6"-10" wide by 15'-20' long, how is this ok when spur marks are bad? Not that I care, they are using the bark for traditional activities, I think its great that the Haidas are redicovering thier heritage. Trees that small are not logged, unless they are understory in a clearcut show. Just wondered what some people here thought, not suprised. Tiny pinpricks bad-massive wound ok. Makes sense.

 

[Adkpk]

Tiny pinpricks bad-massive wound ok. Makes sense.

I didn't get that line, clearance. Sorry, is that what you meant to write?

 

[spacemule]

Looks to me like using spurs would be like a nurse using the same needle on several different patients, whereas pulling bark loose would be like using one big ass syringe on one patient. :greenchainsaw:

 

[clearance]

I didn't get that line, clearance. Sorry, is that what you meant to write?

Yes exactly, spurring anything live is bad, ripping a huge chunk of bark of a living tree, no big deal. WTF?

 

[Adkpk]

I didn't get the tiny pin-prick as the spur thing, sorry, thanks. But I still got to say, the native people all over the world don't get a break from us modern people, no way. If it was vandals doing the stripping I say punish them but for native cultural yarn, I say let them deface the trees. It's a lot less shameful than what we do to them. Nobody defaces the planet more that modern man. You'll be the native when man get off the planet and starts to live on the moon. Then they'll be telling you to stop cutting the trees because they like the green better that the brown from outer space. How do you think that would make you feel.

 

[treeseer]

Dan leave that poor horse alone willya? Find a new hobby.:help:

The difference is--a wound that does not break the cambium-wood boundary is less damaging than one that does. Pathogens have a hard time breaking that boundary.
Also, stripping bark off can leave bits of callus tissue. I've seen it grow and spread, even when disconnected.
also, stripping bark does not disturb the sapwood, but spiking does.
Is that enough reasons, c? ok one more.
The "pinpricks" from spiking are angled downwards, the ideal infection court for spores and insects.

It's kinda like in feudal times--serfs had the right to cut off branches only, not the trunks. Being economical with their time and energy, they made the smallest possible cuts to yield the most possible wood. aka Natural Target Pruning.:hmm3grin2orange:

This is the time of year to strip bark for baskets. I've stripped felled Liriodendron--tuliptree--bark for that use; by others who know how.

 

[Ekka]

I think Clearance likes to