decending on split tail system

[CanopyGorilla]

My post was ment as a last option bail. When everything else fails. Can you get out of a tree with one carabineer and one rope? From 150' up?

 

[CanopyGorilla]

I can. I have been doing rope work for much longer than tree work. My job used to be pulling injured people off of the largest cliffs in the continental u.s. (think el cap/ half dome).

 

[CanopyGorilla]

I would be shocked (also willing to listen) if you felt you had a better understanding of working rope systems than I do.

 

[acer-kid]

I would be shocked (also willing to listen) if you felt you had a better understanding of working rope systems than I do.

I would never claim that. And there was no argument about the munters hitch. That would work, no doubt. But i think an 8 lends itself to a friendlier bend ratio. And if the 8/long tailed bowline was already incorporated in your spar descent plan.. Would it not be faster to unlock (soft) an 8 and repel? I meant NO disrespect. I have an obessesion w/ rope, and please correct me if im wrong.

 

[acer-kid]

My post was ment as a last option bail. When everything else fails. Can you get out of a tree with one carabineer and one rope? From 150' up?

If i had about 160' of rope or so. Depending on diameter, i guess. Running bowline, munter hitch, carabiner?

Or are we talking about tying a b.o.b rope saddle, too? In that case id need way more rope.

(im not just some know nothing dink, and i didnt mean to offend you. Just trying to help some one to start thinking about spar descent/bail out practices)

 

[CanopyGorilla]

A figure 8 is one of the friendliest bend ratios you can find. I have been working with that knot for 13 years and have no idea how you would propose to decend on one. It is a tie in point knot. Perhaps I don't quite grasp what you are explaining. My scenario was this; you have no gear, (say you dropped it all) and you have one caribener, you choke the spar and descend on a munter on that one caribener. You would be utilizing every inch of rope available. It would not be doubled. I must be hearing you wrong.,.

 

[CanopyGorilla]

Good discussion by the way!

 

[CanopyGorilla]

Is it a figure 8 knot or a "figure of 8" repel device your talking about?

 

[acer-kid]

A figure 8 is one of the friendliest bend ratios you can find. I have been working with that knot for 13 years and have no idea how you would propose to decend on one. It is a tie in point knot. Perhaps I don't quite grasp what you are explaining. My scenario was this; you have no gear, (say you dropped it all) and you have one caribener, you choke the spar and descend on a munter on that one caribener. You would be utilizing every inch of rope available. It would not be doubled. I must be hearing you wrong.,.

okay. I think i found the root of the issue. Im proposing using an aluminum/steel figure 8 descender.

A choked running bowline w/ 8' tail. A single leg of line run through a figure 8 descender, soft locked, attached to saddle via carabiner. You can descend say 6' to your next work area, pull tail of bowline to retrieve. Re-choke waist level, remove slack. Yea?

And i agree with you. If you had nothing but a carabiner, saddle and rope, a munters hitch is a perfect descent method. I said 160' of rope I. Response to the TIP being 150' taking the running bowline and munters into consideration, and giving myself lots of room for error.

Bowline on a bight saddle.. The only way i can figure that with one biner @ 150' is with 300' of rope. More when you take the saddle/blakes into consideration.
I could be wrong! Sorry if i came off as combative

 

[acer-kid]

Another rope nut. I love it.

 

[miko0618]

I run a grigri 2 or a d4 instead of a figure 8. One hand everything and auto-locking. A soft locked 8 can be tough to lock/unlock with 1 hand. And, unless it's backed by a prussic, one slip and you can be in real trouble. I always carry an 8 on my saddle though. Always.

 

[acer-kid]

I run a grigri 2 or a d4 instead of a figure 8. One hand everything and auto-locking. A soft locked 8 can be tough to lock/unlock with 1 hand. And, unless it's backed by a prussic, one slip and you can be in real trouble. I always carry an 8 on my saddle though. Always.

Can a gri gri take a fall? I was under the impression the were strictly a belay device? Im unsure of that, though. Good point on loading an eight too heavy, and being hard to unlock. A definite drawback to my system, without doubt.

 

[miko0618]

Can a gri gri take a fall? I was under the impression the were strictly a belay device? Im unsure of that, though. Good point on loading an eight too heavy, and being hard to unlock. A definite drawback to my system, without doubt.

I've seen cammed ascenders tested. The unit doesn't slip or fail but, it can tear the sheath on kernmantle rope. Effectively making grip impossible and riding the sheath down the core. That was a toothed ascender on a serious fall. For tree work anyway. I am not sure on the grigri

 

[acer-kid]

I've seen cammed ascenders tested. The unit doesn't slip or fail but, it can tear the sheath on kernmantle rope. Effectively making grip impossible and riding the sheath down the core. That was a toothed ascender on a serious fall. For tree work anyway. I am not sure on the grigri

I would assume slipping some would be beneficial, no? So you would end up dragging the whole cover down and exposing core? If that's the case would it be considered dicey on a 16 stand construction?

 

[miko0618]

I don't know of any 16 strand ropes that are a proper diameter for a grigri. They will handle a fall within ansi standards.

 

[miko0618]

Yes, if it tears the sheath, you're going down. Unless you luck out. I feel like the grigri or D4 would do less damage in a fall situation. But i can't back that up.

 

[acer-kid]

Yes, if it tears the sheath, you're going down. Unless you luck out. I feel like the grigri or D4 would do less damage in a fall situation. But i can't back that up.

too high a diameter i assume? Ive no experience with gri gris, so im just speculating.

Edit: natgear makes a 7/16 16 strand. I think thats about 11.5?