DEDA lanyard with ART Positioners

[rahtreelimbs]

This lanyard evolvement has been really interesting. I just switched to a Distel and micropulley setup on my lanyard. One thing that I am trying is a 30 ft. lanyard ( thanx JPS ). I have one of those accessary bags from Sherrill. I stuff the tail in the bag like throwline and let it come out right next to the snap on the bag. I have been tying a slipknot in the tail to keep from having too much rope come out. If I need more I simply remove the slipknot. Since I use a Buckingham master saddle with all its extra tie points I can move the lanyard off of the side D-ring to a center tie in D-ring and have a point for double crotch. The jury is still out as to how much I will like this. I only use it on big crown pruning jobs.

 

[Stumper]

'Fess up now Tom you ARE a gear snob! - A friendly, helpful one. All these discussions are great for helping us see the possibilities for our own applications. For years I thought that an adjustable buckstrap was the pinacle of lanyard development. When that was completely inadequate I used a second climbing line and never bothered to think about a better lanyard (actually that isn't completely true-I did make a longer bucksrap than I was able to buy "standard")-the buckstrap worked 'pretty well' after all!Ahh.....but I'm feeling much better now! :

 

[BrianCooke]

Thanks Sean, good to know. Would you mind giving a little info on them to those who are relatively new to this whole tree climbing bit. Just curious what the Positioners do and how they do it (see my post above).

Again thanks,
Brian

 

[Tom Dunlap]

It's been said that Hubert's ART tools are expensive replacements for free knots. That is true, at a really basic level. But then again, a lowering device is a very expensive replacement for tree wraps. The user has to decide the value of the tool.

Tom [the friendly gear snob ]

 

[Dan Flinn]

I went to the long lanyard with a distel/pulley setup and I really do like it.

I have a problem with all the excess hanging there, so the bag idea is cool. I have to solve another problem, though, the distel/pulley attachment is on the side I hang my chainsaw and it ALWAYS gets tangled in the excess lanyard.

Oh well, growing pains are a small price to pay for advancement!

Brian, we should get together and climb some. I'm always looking for new ideas!

Dan

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Dan,

JPS referred to one method of taking care of some of the long tail.

Secure the end of the lanyard to a loop on your saddle behind the side d-ring. Then use some shoelace or small cord and tie a friction hitch around the lanyard. Attach this hitch to your saddle near the dead end. This will store the excess back "around the corner" behind your hip, a little away from your chainsaw. When you need the full length, you pull it out of storage. Its much quicker doing this than stuffing or daisy chaining.

Tom

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Tom, do you have a little tiny fair lead for the little tiny shoelace hitch? We should get ART working on a micro positioner for that.
Did you ever think of putting one positioner on each side?


Small diameter rope is better for the longer lanyards, otherwise bulk and weight become an issue.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Mike,

If I put a P on each side, I'd have a loop to contend with. There are three loops of rope with two P's in the system. After climbing with my lanyard on the left for thirty years I think my brain and muscles are pretty hardwired. I'd be searching for my lanyard if I changed now

Tom

 

[BrianCooke]

Hey Dan,

Asheville huh, I had a grandfather who grew up there. In fact his father had the Civil engineering company that built the Beaucatcher Tunnel.

My wife is from Brevard and has a lot of family still there. Small world indeed.

I'd be up for climbing some time, drop me aline and we'll see what we can do.

Thanks & take care,
Brian Cooke

 

[BrianCooke]

Thanks Rocky, for some reason the name Dave Mattox sounds incredibly familiar. I'll have to get in touch with him. Would you mind dropping me his email ([email protected]) just in case.

Thanks for your reply,
Brian Cooke

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

Guess that shoe lace might work better than the piece of throwline i tried with extra lanyard tail support.

Am realy liking the extra long 22' long lanyard, don't tell ol'JP; but i kinda wish i did make it longer now, which would fit with Mike's suggestion of lower diameter/stashable line.

Instead of using a short lifeline today (that i keep around); i used the long lanyard instead.

i always carry a 3rd attatchment, a wide D karab and 4' sling mostly for redirects, but also have a Sherrill 'express sling on the karab for exteending bridge. Now the sling can add 4' extra to lanyard. Also, i choked/girthed it to D, and used karab to make like a short lanyard for 2x TieIns for 'legally' running saw.

Then, on some of the even lighter DW etc., no powersaw, gym shoes, but still earplugs in for peace as i played with handsaw/ pole saw.

So i guess i can downgrade short lifeline, and have less gear, as i just begin to explore this level that Big'Un been saying all along about longer lanyard. Guess even with those long legs, he's easier to catch up to here, than TD constantly running point on this path!

And........ is DEDA always on 1 side, not 1 adjuster on each hip?

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Originally posted by TheTreeSpyder
And........ is DEDA always on 1 side, not 1 adjuster on each hip?

Well, he only cut one D-ring off....

 

[Tom Dunlap]

I can't see what advantage there would be to have a Positioner on each hip. Maybe I'm having another thick-headed moment again. Please explain.

So far, I haven't cut off the left D-ring. I'm pretty sure that I will though. The square MR is rated way above 5k# so I'm not worried about the regs. Since I didn't modify the saddle, just changed attachments no one should worry about it. It's no difference than using any other biner or MR to attach a lanyard to the saddle D-ring.

Tom

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

A few fellas around here that try to be safe use 2 fixed lanyards (these are the advanced guys....) 1 on each hip and no split tail, to sell them on 2 lanyards like that (lanyard and split tail). so they climb up to tie in, flipping lanyards and spiking, but any way kinda looks natural on the lanyards sometime.

Not my style. i made one of them a 19' lanyard with knut on each hip, girthed throwline scrap punched into center backpad, and a swivel line holder also on each side that he loves, for it uses that same style of feeding from both sides. Which besides carrying my saw on my left, and no synthetics; kinda seems better (or more familiar?) than both on 1 side. So figured i'd ask! Someone pointed out it was a DEDA, i really didn't know/had forgotten that that was an accronym for the function. But, any way this pattern of hanging from hip to hip, yields more length storage room in the loops behind legs if nothing else.



What is the minimal strength/diameter of line recomended and commanded for lanyard?

This is the pic i posted and the pattern of the line running behind the wearer to each D, to give adjustable length available to either side while having loops higher than most steps at full, and out of the way to the rear storage.

 

[rahtreelimbs]

Wasn't there a pic of Tom's original DEDA set-up using Distal hitches? Can anyone point me in the right direction?

 

[Tom Dunlap]

You have to go over to Tr**buzz and search on DEDA. Hillbilly made a nice graphic.

Tom

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Originally posted by Tom Dunlap
I can't see what advantage there would be to have a Positioner on each hip. Maybe I'm having another thick-headed moment again. Please explain.


Tom

Didn't you ever watch the old westerns? The gun slinger always had one gun on each hip, not two guns on one hip.
I wonder if there might be an advantage in situations where your all bunched up on one side, or turned to one side, and if the snap was out in the open on the other side it might save some digging.

I'm having a thick headed moment myself, figuring out why there would be an extra loop.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

here is why there are three loops:

Snap to #1 Postioner
#1 Positioner to #2 Positioner
#2 Positioner to snap

I'm going to look at looping the middle loop behind my back through a small ring. Tree Spyder gave me the idea.

Since I use a leg scabbard for my handsaw, my right side isn't really cluttered.

Tom

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

TheTreeSpyder wrote on 05-31-2003 04:39 AM:
So what is your preference for Safe Strength/ Minimized Diameter-Weight?

Don't ever remember you directly saying as this has come up before......

Certainly, it must meet 5400 mbs. After that, any size goes in my book. I use my lanyard hard, so longevity is an issue. I don't want to be making a new one every few days, or working with one that has snags. The smaller the rope, the faster it wears. I tried some of the HMDP(kevlar type) unjacketed rope and it wore very poorly, that test(and the rope) lasted about two days.

I'm using a fly lanyard now and would not like it any thicker than that. There's a nice hank of 5/16" ultra tech floating around in my truck somewhere, I bet that would be sweet, although the thin jacket wouldn't last too long.

To keep these comments on topic, the ART positioners require a certain size rope, so not much choice there. They(mechanical devices) can be fussy about the type of rope too, is that right Tom?

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Mike points out a short coming of mechanicals. I'm using 7/16" static line for my lanyard now. It works fine with the Positioners. this rope has a 6k# breaking strength and a really tough shell. I don't mind having the barrel hitch tieing the snap to the rope. It would be nice to have a splice though. I've got a lot of this rope though. I used a Tibloc for one day and it chewed the sheath in a number of places so I retired both the rope and the Tibloc.

Yesterday I picked up some round, split collars that will clamp around the square MR. This will keep the Positioners in place and not flopping around. I'm going to see about putting one on each hip too. That's intriguing.

Tom