Do ants make trees unsafe?

[Derek]

Hi Jason!

In My long version, (yet to come) I was to go into some detail about other ants living where termites (white ants )
once where..

I never took the time to study ALL the bugs in our trees, but see some strange things going on!
In my firewood days, I would drop a tree, termites still eating it some ten years after they killed it.

I did watch in amazment, the larger black ants feeding on them
the black ants went into every hole and dragged them out one by on!

Couple of days later you have nice clean wood to deliver..
Shots soon..

Aussie we have to talk!!...Wasent an issue in Brisbane or Sydney( dont get a lot of them) or even on the lines these years, just adjust your exit path to suit the infestation...

"NO WORRIES MATE" chit, makes it hard when I got roofs, gardens,sheds,tanks etc in the way..And you can't get past it..

I dont want to get into the debate about are termites bad for trees, I want to know how to deal with the huge defects they have made in the tree im in at 30 m (Todays was). And I couldent tell it was there (when I quoted), 5 hours longer than it should of been and thrashed me for some reason( old age?)..

Pics of that will be tommorow..Have a look and let me know..
"There must be a better way"...PS my price on ANY gum in future
just went up by 200 bucks, $400 if its over 40m, stuff it, Damage bill this week is huge, had to take the 88 in , can't fix it myself?
New jets for it, Replaced the filters (was fine ,but) breathers cool.
Still RS ...Got "Hec" to close the bar up and dress it, changed gears to a 7 , can't get it to cut right since the "shocker" ...

I need the 42' to drop the gums around here, cracked the tank on the 009 (arildite) So I dont tend to use the Jonsered 625
(way to cheap Aussie!) for felling, the only reliabale saw in the fleet ATM..[bit heavey as a climbing saw though, ever notice?]

Opps this is an ant thread...Thought I was somewhere eles..

I have to finish it now!... First time in my life ...READY...Cut my flipline, stuffed it. dident hit the wire core but made a mess of the rope, it will just jamb up on the B52 grab..Quick hundred and fifty there...
I think The owner got a shot of it..( why im rushing the pics, I WANT TO SEE)..
It got hung up on somthing, obviously dident check it and started cutting, felt the saw hit it through my hips, WoW that was close, I would of fallen a meter at least before my 2nd POA kicked in...I have another coming express, rang from the tree just after it happened ( owner thought it histericial, chatting to my (expencive) contact in Brisbane, UP A TREE..)

and just to top it off I recon I have stuffed another rope, ill look in the morning...chit thats now..12.36AM what am I doing waffeling on to you?...Night..Derek.

 

[a_lopa]

ok Guy, lets put it on the line.you say ants are no harm whatso ever to trees correct?

 

[a_lopa]

alex was out here testing my freinds sealant 25+years ago as well

 

[Derek]

I really cant be neutral on the subject...Heres some new pics just in..the first one is the "street tre$$" i posted (three weeks ago)

You saw me at the very top of the tree, come down drop it, this is what you find..millions of bugs, we still call them "white ants" here
AKA termites...

 

[a_lopa]

what we call,ill tell you in pm

 

[Derek]

That was to show the same background, as when the climing shots where taken, perfectly healthy looking tree...


This is the same hole closer..

Granted only a very small tree base, you have much better terms (Guy), what was holding up the tree, I know that the outer layers (cambium) are very soft on gum trees, This is from a few days later (after the rain ended) as it dries, the different colors in whats left show up better

How long till you think it will be killed by the insects??


So many trees I climb are like this only much bigger,..

Many more blury pics of ants this week..
Some others turned out..Ill post them next..Derek..

 

[Derek]

In my old firewood days, to find a dry standing solid Ironbark (best firewood available) tree was very rare, the farmers (cockies)
will telll you it just died, no one ringbarked it, it had no mistreatment, it just died...

I cut it down, hopeing for good wood, i get this (see pic)..

Turns out I made more money planting plants from the nursery here, in to the now hollow logs ( gives away the photo hey?) and selling them at local markets

This is one of the hardest trees in Austrailia the termites ate it out and killed it (IMO)....

In the same trees you will find any number of (real) other ants, they seem to take over areas left by the termites ..Are they just eating eachother or are they also hurting the tree?

The pic is ironbark on the bottom, an old Yellowbox root on top of them, see the rock still in the right side? I cut it in half with the 46..dident do the chain much good, thats why I kept it, it was massive, this peice broke off..

When I get to cutting the grass it makes a nice seat...

 

[Derek]

What I really wanted to show/ask dident come out, way to close for this camera..

I will retake some shots of a Trilleana (?) so infested with black ants I cant get into the tree, they normally have a dark green bark, this tree is black with ants..

They are travelling into holes, could be old branches snaped off ( very brittle tree), every meter or so, what the inside must look like is somthing Im gunna wait on a bucket (EWP) to sort out...Not climbing that one, wait till you see where the domestic drop line is..
plus, even a healthy one , NO BUGS, (brisbane) Is increadibly dangerous to climb, never been in more fragile trees, they just fall apart at the slightest touch..

current roll, so it'll be a while..Ill prolly get them done at the one hour (plus the two hour drive), w/end mabey..

I sold hundreds of plants( all the good pics on print still) here are some leftovers "and strange things" pile of snake hidding spots..

Point being these trees were once perfectly healthy trees before the bugs came to town..They died 2 or 3 hundred years before there time. and I think the reason is clear..The tree doesent survive haveing its guts eaten out while its still alive..

Gord had some pics recently of a hollow tree he climbed, what hollows trees out over there...??Derek..

Aussie, got your PM..replying now..

 

[Guy Meilleur]

Originally posted by Derek
..The tree doesent survive haveing its guts eaten out while its still alive.. , what hollows trees out over there...??

Derek, thanks for the great pictures. I have a bench by my pond that's constructed like yours, and I use hollow logs as planters here too--a $uper re-use of trash.

In your pix we can see a line demarcating decaying wood from sound wood. All the hollowing visible in your pix seems to have been started by decay fungi. The fungi send out enzymes which presoften the wood so it can be digested--remember the spitting Velociraptors in Jurassic Park?

The demarcation line is the extent of the enzyme's advance. sometimes it can look like a compartmentalization wall. But either way, what's inside of that line is rotting, made unstable by fungi.

The ants march in and out, indicating decay but not causing it that I can see. If you can show pix of ants entering sound wood and not just decayed wood, I'll believe that Australian ants can indeed make trees unstable.

 

[Derek]

Rot, Fungus, diease, BUGS...What did come first...

Still (more) confussed that ever!..


Are we talking bout "forGuy" pic??

I would of thought so..The Planters are now to dry to see any discoloration..

The yellow ring wasent there when i cut the tree down..
YES, now it does look like its rotting, or at least "pithey" and soft..

I recon its still real hard, I dont notice any "softness" in the other parts of it..

This is making me a little parioniod!!...Already 40 knots out side, off to do some more gums, in a while..are they going to blow over with me in them?? (chit that gust just shook the whole house! )

I can aggree in princable that "decay fungi" may be allowing ants into the tree, ON GUM TREES, but have some reservations on the ironbark, yellow box (Eucs)..they just dont ever seem to "break down" with out help from termites! An increadibly hard wood..

Are our Mistletoes over here starting the decay prosses in the tops of trees? they seem to kill the tree pretty easy to..

If i can get the chance before the w/end, a propity near me is full of stringy bark trees, (the same as in this thread,ie Lusas mill site)

Ill need some "excuse" to go drop a couple ("I need them to build a "bank" to put my "ripper mark 4" on)[that will do, true to]

Then I can show termites going into trees with no decay at all..


I have heaps more questions on the subject..

Got to go do battel with more rotton/bug infested Gums...

Hopefully I make it home tonight. Ill get some pics of the damage,
(To the tree, not me!)....Derek..

 

[ray benson]

A little research turned up the Texas Leaf Cutting Ant and the Allegheny Mound Ant.They damage trees- don't think they are extinct.
http://entowww.tamu.edu/extension/bulletins/uc/uc-033.html
http://bugs.osu.edu/~bugdoc/Shetlar/factsheet/christmasstree/allegheny_mound_ants.htm
Ray

 

[Derek]

As you will see from the first few words on this site, A GOVERNMENT site at that,,we are a bit lax with the term ant..

Not really bout trees, but the law is interesting....

Its illegle to have them..

http://www.logan.qld.gov.au/LCC/residents/pestcontrol/termites.htm

 

[a_lopa]

mr meullier

ok guy,what are these guys doing :angel:i do like your opinions thou

 

[a_lopa]

and look out a lurker may be interested its all cool, love your pruning chit myself! youve only helped me really

 

[NeTree]

Friday, December 10, 2004
Ants' tree snack leaves homeowner with big bill
By Jason Tait
Staff Writer

METHUEN -- Two neighbors battling over a 150-year-old willow tree had their dispute settled yesterday -- by carpenter ants.

Ants ate through the core of the estimated 150-foot-tall tree, causing it to split away and crash into Wilfred Desruisseaux's 905 Riverside Drive home yesterday. The tree punched at least nine gaping holes in the roof and caused an estimated $50,000 in damage.

"I've been trying for three years to get them to take it down," Desruisseaux said of his backyard neighbors. They live at 35 Laurel Ave. and declined to comment.

Desruisseaux wasn't home at the time, but said he could have been hurt as part of the tree crashed through a skylight above his bed, showering glass and branches onto the comforter.

"It's a disaster," Desruisseaux said, standing outside as workers tried clearing the mess and patching the roof with plywood.

Dan Caggiuca of Coast to Coast Tree Service said the fallen portion of the tree likely weighed more than 2,500 pounds.

The tree could still pose a danger, Caggiuca said, as the second half could fall at anytime.

"If this weather gets bad, the rest of that could go," said Caggiuca, who has been hired to cut the remaining tree down with a crane -- a task he plans to do today.

Desruisseaux said his insurance company will pay for the damages, which Caggiuca estimated would cost $50,000.

Yesterday afternoon, workers from Jones and Company of Methuen put temporary plywood patches on the roof. Meanwhile, Desruisseaux is living at home, and said he hopes that his insurance company helps with the heating bills.

 

[NeTree]

Actually Mike, I just thought it was a cool article and it seemed to flow with the theme here.

Whether the ants in the article chewed through the CODIT walls of that particular tree wasn't mentioned.

Keep yer pantyhose on...

 

[NeTree]

Where the heck IS Guy??

Mike, not really- for the most part the ants appear to have limited their carpentry to areas of wood that appear to already be decayed; although in #10 towards the top it would appear they have caverned into an area that looks free of decay.

 

[NeTree]

It's irrelevant.

 

[NeTree]

Nice to have you back, Mike.

 

[NeTree]

Aw... why so bitter?