Ever hit a sprinkler line with a stump grinder?

[ForTheArborist]

I was grinding away the other day on some Cypress Tree stumps with the Vermeer Hydro Power, and I caught the top of a drain pipe. 3 stumps later I caught two PVC pipes that flooded. The married couple proceeded to flip out like the Vermeer was on fire - natural disaster!

The guy goes, "what do we do?" Right then I knew I was dealing with a TV baby, know nothing. "Shut the water off." They chewed me out, and then asked about how to fix it. They were going to call a irrigation contractor out, but I told them how simple it was. That's when they turned "the gun" onto me. They thought I had "screwed them over,' so I'd have to go to Home Depot and get the supply and repair everything. The guy's reasoning was that I should have checked with the city for the location of the pipes - all my fault.

The guy was a "royal idiot," and she took a wrong turn into the hitch with this one. I sympathized with her, and I went ahead and repaired everything at my expense. If she wouldn't have been there, I would have muffled that guys mouth with a proverbial boot whinch I basically did from that point own. I don't take loud mouth, inconsiderate, A.H.s better than anybody.

Most HOs just take care of their problems themselves, and brush off stuff like this. These ones had no idea how to manage their home.

Should I have charged them? Should I have it up to them to repair the pipes? What are the rules when you hit these things that nobody can have a heads up on before they even order a stump grinder in the yard?

 

[gr8scott72]

I was grinding away the other day on some Cypress Tree stumps with the Vermeer Hydro Power, and I caught the top of a drain pipe. 3 stumps later I caught two PVC pipes that flooded. The married couple proceeded to flip out like the Vermeer was on fire - natural disaster!

The guy goes, "what do we do?" Right then I knew I was dealing with a TV baby, know nothing. "Shut the water off." They chewed me out, and then asked about how to fix it. They were going to call a irrigation contractor out, but I told them how simple it was. That's when they turned "the gun" onto me. They thought I had "screwed them over,' so I'd have to go to Home Depot and get the supply and repair everything. The guy's reasoning was that I should have checked with the city for the location of the pipes - all my fault.

The guy was a "royal idiot," and she took a wrong turn into the hitch with this one. I sympathized with her, and I went ahead and repaired everything at my expense. If she wouldn't have been there, I would have muffled that guys mouth with a proverbial boot whinch I basically did from that point own. I don't take loud mouth, inconsiderate, A.H.s better than anybody.

Most HOs just take care of their problems themselves, and brush off stuff like this. These ones had no idea how to manage their home.

Should I have charged them? Should I have it up to them to repair the pipes? What are the rules when you hit these things that nobody can have a heads up on before they even order a stump grinder in the yard?

Get a signed contract BEFORE you start grinding with one of the disclaimers saying something about not responsible for unmarked sprinklers, septics, etc.

It sucks to break $100 worth of stuff on an $80 stump job. lol

 

[Curbside]

I've hit a number of sprinkler lines but I make it clear to the home owner that we do the best to avoid them but we will not take responsibility for sprinkler lines. I make sure that we look for sprinklers on the property just like we make sure utilities will not be an issue and if they are we notify the home owner that their is possibility of sprinkler issues or if utilities are an issuer we require a utility clearance.

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

utility clearance

i hit electric service with a digging bar and i was 30 inches from their red mark i am so glad i took pictures before digging

 

[ddhlakebound]

I don't take loud mouth, inconsiderate, A.H.s better than anybody.

Really? Well that just totally screws up the "birds of a feather" saying...

Most HOs just take care of their problems themselves, and brush off stuff like this.

Sounds like it's pretty common to leave a broken, bashed, and battered trail of destruction behind you.

These ones had no idea how to manage their home.

Obviously....I mean they hired you right?

Should I have charged them? Should I have it up to them to repair the pipes? What are the rules when you hit these things that nobody can have a heads up on before they even order a stump grinder in the yard?

Na, they should have charged you to have their irrigation system professionally repaired. Being hired by someone doesn't relieve you of responsibility because they ordered in a stumper. How friggin hard is it to see a bunch of sprinkler heads all over the lawn?

 

[mikewhite85]

I usually have the homeowner point out where any irrigation lines are before working and I test them before leaving the job to make sure everything's ok.

Sometimes, I still break them though (just ground a 3/4" line the other day) but I almost always carry sprinkler supplies with me in my truck just in case. Saves A LOT of time running out to Lowes or Home Depot when stuff like that happens (especially when you have a rented grinder and time is an issue). I just have a 5 gallon bucket with a couple small pieces of pipe, primer and glue, a head, and a couple fittings (especially couplings). Thankfully, irrigation supplies are wicked cheap. A little kit like that costs 20-30 bucks (the heads being the most expensive).

Sorry about your bad break, FTA. I have definitely had my share as well. Hopefully, we learn from our mistakes!

 

[ForTheArborist]

I got it now. Sign the contract waiving my responsibility to repair, and offer them my pipe repair service

I hate to sound cold blooded, but if you are healthy/fit enough, you should be able to repair a little PVC. So if you can't, you should have to pay me a few hundred dollars to do it.

Think about it. If you don't want to use your legs, pay someone for an automobile. If you don't want to communicate via mail, pay someone to use their phone system. If you don't want to fix your pipes, pay me to fix them after you let me bust them. If you have to hold on to your money, start walking, start typing, and start using your brain to figure out how to put a link in a PVC pipe. :greenchainsaw:

I can sure use the money you know. Guys that thunk these old pvC's out sure have thought about how to use money.

 

[mattfr12]

the worste thing i ever have hit in a stump was an electric line that actually was live. and growing through the center of a stump about 2 inches above the ground. it powerd outdoor lighting so it wasnt like a 220 or 440 line but still scared the poop out of me when i seen it.

 

[ForTheArborist]

the worste thing i ever have hit in a stump was an electric line that actually was live. and growing through the center of a stump about 2 inches above the ground. it powered outdoor lighting so it wasn't like a 220 or 440 line but still scared the poop out of me when i seen it.

You cut the wire, but you were not electrocuted through the grinder?

 

[ddhlakebound]

I got it now. Sign the contract waiving my responsibility to repair, and offer them my pipe repair service

I hate to sound cold blooded, but if you are healthy/fit enough, you should be able to repair a little PVC. So if you can't, you should have to pay me a few hundred dollars to do it.

Think about it. If you don't want to use your legs, pay someone for an automobile. If you don't want to communicate via mail, pay someone to use their phone system. If you don't want to fix your pipes, pay me to fix them after you let me bust them. If you have to hold on to your money, start walking, start typing, and start using your brain to figure out how to put a link in a PVC pipe. :greenchainsaw:

I can sure use the money you know. Guys that thunk these old pvC's out sure have thought about how to use money.

I bet your momma is sure proud of you.

And I can see it now.....two years down the road... FTA's county wide conglomerate corporation: Irrigation Remediation, Fence Restoration, Roof Rehabilitation & Tree Hacking Service, where the motto is "we'll work for you....once."

 

[pdqdl]

You screwed up. Your lack of preparation means that the bill is all yours.

1. It doesn't sound like you called to get the underground utilities marked. It's good sense, and it is the law in our neighborhood. It wouldn't have protected the irrigation pipes you hit, unless it made you begin to wonder what was really down there to cause problems.

2. You seem to lack the experience to consider the normal risk to an irrigation system. This is standard procedure for most of us; just consider the cost of repair to be an investment in future stump grindings gone right.

3. Arguing with customers or being impatient with their unwillingness to fix your mistake will cost you the customers good will. They hired you because they thought you were the expert. Stop trying to convince them otherwise.

4. If your customers were know-it-all, do-it-yourself-ers, they wouldn't have hired you to begin with. They would have gone out and rented a stump grinder themselves. Be thankful they don't know how to fix your little mistake, otherwise they probably wouldn't need you for anything else, either.

5. How did you hit an irrigation system with water pressure in it? Were you grinding while the sprinklers were on? It is pretty unusual to hit any kind of trunk line with a grinder, because they are typically buried deeper than you would grind. So how deep were you grinding?

 

[Brodie]

At the end of the day YOU hit the pipe so it is YOUR responsibility to fix the problem.

Ill give you an example if I get a guy to fix my washing machine and he pulls the pipe out of the wall because he didn't check to see that the washing machine was disconnected before moving it I expect that the any damage is fixed by him at his cost.

We are meant to be professionals with sufficient training to do our job that is why we charge our services out at a premium plain and simple thats it. If you want to do a poor job then don't charge a premium rate because you just plain dont deserve it.

The way I run my stump grinding service is to:
1) Ask the client of services and pipes they know of on the property.

2) Check with Dial Before You Dig they have records of where utilities have placed their services.

3) If there is still cause for suspicion then I require a service location and mapping service which cost around $200 pre hour (Australian Dollars) not expensive compared to replacing a utility line.

I also have a disclaimer that if after all that we still hit something that was not found on any maps or locating services then it is at their cost. Any other damage is our responsibility. The Disclaimer also states that we will do everything we can do avoid damage.

I also dont understand how you hit a pressurised line I mean if its irrigation then there must have been water coming from some kind of jet.

 

[treesquirrel]

I hate to sound cold blooded, but if you are healthy/fit enough, you should be able to repair a little PVC. So if you can't, you should have to pay me a few hundred dollars to do it.

Sounds like the kind of tree service that would drop a huge spar onto a driveway then inform the homeowner that they also do concrete work and hand them a quote. It just creates more cash flow.

 

[2FatGuys]

You screwed up. Your lack of preparation means that the bill is all yours.

:agree2:

If you hadn't been performing your service, or had been better prepared for the normal risks, the line would not have been damaged by YOU. I guess, using your logic, if you were doing a removal for these people, and you dropped a limb through their roof, you would rant and rave about thier house being in the way? The house is a normal obstacle on a removal, just like power lines and sprinkler lines are on stump jobs.

If you don't understand your responsibilities as a service provider, you need to start flipping burgers or standing on a corner holding a sign.

 

[tomtrees58]

well a tooth pop of wen through the rubber and got me in the b:censored: yup ouch

 

[lone wolf]

well a tooth pop of wen through the rubber and got me in the b:censored: yup ouch

translation a tooth came off and hit him in the balls I think?

 

[treemandan]

811, its the law for good reason. I used to make the calls but now I just get the HO to do it and ask if they know of anything else down there.

 

[2FatGuys]

811, its the law for good reason. I used to make the calls but now I just get the HO to do it and ask if they know of anything else down there.

In NC, they will only gurentee location of public utilities. Sprinkler lines aren't included. Getting the HO involved is a GREAT thing to do!

Anyone with stumper experience should carry a ground probe on their truck and be familiar with looking for sprinkler heads and locating probable line directions / locations.

 

[beastmaster]

A little detective work prior to grinding the stump will eliminate most accidents. I always check where the gas meter is, and the water main, it not hard to figure out which way the sprinklers are running most the time. Some times if not sure, carefully digging down or probing with a thin metal rod will give some info. Even being really careful I still sometimes hit a sprinkler line so we carry an assortment of pcv fittings on our truck, the time spent on repair is nothing if it gets you called back or a good referral. I think customer service is as important as doing a good job.
I have a bad temper sometimes my self, and some HO can push you to the brink, but if your in business or running someones business, you have to just choke it up some times(I kick the dog when I get home)
Most tree people I know are experts at fence repair, minor roofing repairs, hard scape repair and of course sprinkler repair. S_ _t happens. Its all part of the job. Beast.

 

[ForTheArborist]

I assume there is an 811 here too. I need to start putting them on that whole pipe finding process before bringing the grinder. That spare part bucket is a good idea. The best idea is the ground probe, so I can find these things myself at very least.

Some of you guys exagerate a lot. None of your comparisions about dropping trees on houses or pulling out washing machines have anything to do with pipes no one could have known about. I here the ding though - the ding bat brigade. :spam:

Asking me to damage the ground around pipes without damaging pipes that the HOs don't have any idea what so ever about is a little bit on the pretender side. If they gave a "piece," they would have remedied this before grinding by informing me of pipe locations like responsible HOs. Instead they only became serious about them after I found them myself. They were jerking me around about it, and that is all there is to it.

I've got a thing about anyone in the world. I treat them like my neighbors because they are all part of the same community. Some neighbors I rub hard, but most I treat very respectfully. These people with the pipes just happened to rub me too hard, so I don't take them like adults headed in the right direction with anybody any more after that. It doesn't matter how old a person is. If they need to be tipped off that they are worthlessly disrespectful, I will deliver that hardened note. Otherwise some people just run around like they have no effect on people when they cut up on people like they do. In an area of 5 million + people, I'm sure I can stand to lose a few clients over disagreements about how a service man should be treated. He seemed to be kind of respectful towards the end of my stint at the property :greenchainsaw: I guess I know what I'm doing after all.

THE MORAL OF THE STORY:

Pipes that close to the stumps were just going to be busted no matter what. In my book I say bust those things, get the stumps out, and repair the pipes, but not for free. If they want it done for free, then I will refuse to do the work.