felling a leaner

[Adkpk]

Red oak in the center

The anchor point is right behind me where I am taking the pic.

Reason for take down. Plus the top doesn't have much left to it.

I will put a snatch block at the tree saver and connect the end of the cable to the winch on my car (4 Runner). Put a shallow notch on the face and a shallow back cut and pull with the winch until I get the lean on my side or it falls over.
Now, I don't want to go to either side so I need a bull rope tied around the trunk 30' up where the cable is and anchored to trees on either side.
It would be done already but since it's only 20' from the house I want to make sure I have it right. Also I don't have any bull rope. I could use my half inch Arbor Plex or my True Blue and upgrade my climbing line. Or buy a bull rope. Any advise? Thanks.

 

[Nailsbeats]

I am not sure I completely understand your set up, so I will tell you how I would do it from scratch.

Set the pull line all the way up in the crotch about 4' from where the top is broken out. Maximum pulling power.

Use an open face notch so the hinge stays intact and doesn't break off and go to one side.

I would very slightly pretension the line, face it, bore it, drop 2 wedges in it, and trip the strap low. Walk over to the come along and pull it over.

This is what it looks like to me, of course it could look different in person. Like where I would put the rope not actually being strong enough, or a weak hinge.

As far as rope, 1/2" True Blue is a very strong 1/2" line. Let me know what you think.

 

[Groundman One]

We've done trees like that where the climber ties off in another tree, if possible, and then climbs the leaner (or swings to it), attaching ropes at different heights to secure the leaner. Then he tops it and as he comes down we leapfrog the securing ropes, he sections it all the way down.

 

[Adkpk]

I am not sure I completely understand your set up, so I will tell you how I would do it from scratch.

Set the pull line all the way up in the crotch about 4' from where the top is broken out. Maximum pulling power.

Use an open face notch so the hinge stays intact and doesn't break off and go to one side.

I would very slightly pretension the line, face it, bore it, drop 2 wedges in it, and trip the strap low. Walk over to the come along and pull it over.

This is what it looks like to me, of course it could look different in person. Like where I would put the rope not actually being strong enough, or a weak hinge.
As far as rope, 1/2" True Blue is a very strong 1/2" line. Let me know what you think.

"Trip the strap low", gonna need an explanation for that one.
I think the cable is set high enough. I would climb it to take out the top but don't think the tree is stable. There's a widow maker up there too.

 

[Adkpk]

We've done trees like that where the climber ties off in another tree, if possible, and then climbs the leaner (or swings to it), attaching ropes at different heights to secure the leaner. Then he tops it and as he comes down we leapfrog the securing ropes, he sections it all the way down.

Sounds like more work than I need to do on this tree. Not much going on in the top.

 

[Adkpk]

In the first pic you can see the cable on the left side of the pic. It is set 3/4 up in the tree.

 

[Groundman One]

Sounds like more work than I need to do on this tree. Not much going on in the top.

Possibly. But we're stuck on our methods. I'm not saying it's better the way we do it, only that it's better for us. It's what we're used to.

 

[Nailsbeats]

"Trip the strap low", gonna need an explanation for that one.
I think the cable is set high enough. I would climb it to take out the top but don't think the tree is stable. There's a widow maker up there too.

I just mean to cut the holding strap below your bore cut that has the wedges in it.

 

[Adkpk]

My bad

Forgot the most important pic.

Nails, I was picturing a different bore cut when I read your post. So I looked it up. I am thinking after you see the lean on this tree towards the house you might change your mind on the bore cut.

Imo I need to get the tree to come over some before releasing the hinge. Hence the need to anchor either side to keep it from going to the right (bridge hazard) or the left (hanger) into the lean (house).

Climbing it seems a risk because I really don't know why it is in decline. Just know most of the branches are dead and seemingly died slowly and progressively over a long period of time. Doesn't help that the roots are rotting either. :bang:

Climbing it form another tree is a possibility. There is beach within reach but it would need some work to clear some branches. There are only two live branches left in the top of the oak and don't see them as hanging up. The path I chose for it to come down is clear and puts it where I won't have to move it if the wood is good enough to slab.

This is my opinion, I posted to get advice from the pro's. Both on the stability of the tree and the fall.

 

[masiman]

I just did two similar to this last week.

In both cases I set up a 2:1 with my tree puller. I climbed and set a block. I tied the pulling rope to a tree, ran it to the block in the tree being pulled and back down to a redirect block (to get us out of the way of where we were pulling the tree to. The puller was set up on another tree. I climbed about 2/3 up on each tree, but depending on how much tree there is and the limit of your pulling system you can vary that.

We put some tension on the tree but not a whole lot to avoid splitting. I cut my notch. I then did a plunge cut, again to reduce the chance of a barber chair. I also left a fairly thick hinge to ensure I had stability of the butt. On one of the trees I also stuck in wedges on the plunge as a backup to the puller. We took a little more tension before releasing the strap and then I released it.

In both cases, there were no problems or things that I could think of to do different.

The only part I did not like was that my block and whoopie were coming down with the tree and could be damaged. I did have the advantage in that I was falling toward the uphill, so the fall was not as far or fast.

The 2:1 made pulling it over slower, but alot easier to do. When they start to get vertical pulling becomes alot easier.

 

[Nailsbeats]

The lean to the house will not matter if you leave a good hinge, pretension the line and put in some wedges. When the strap is tripped the tree should not move, until you go to pull on it.

Wait a minute here, are you pulling directly opposite the lean or 90 degrees to the lean?

 

[Adkpk]

Directly opposite the lean.

 

[Nailsbeats]

Then I stand by my advice.

 

[pdqdl]

Then I stand by my advice.

It's good advice, take it.

I personally would not work quite so hard on the setup. 3/4 up the tree gives a HUGE mechanical advantage to pull a tree over with. 1000 lbs of force 30' up a tree puts 30,000 lbs of torque to work in the direction you want the tree to go. A car pulling a tree over is usually overkill or poorly planned.

I usually just rig similar to Nails suggestions, tension the rope pretty good, notch to about 1/2, then back cut until the tree goes the right direction. His directions are probably the right way to do a really large tree, but that doesn't look that big a tree.

It does look like you will strip some branches on neighboring trees when it comes down. Are you ready for that to happen ?

 

[Adkpk]

How much of a hinge for that size tree.

This is the cut you mean?
http://www.metacafe.com/watch/278681/tree_felling_with_chain_saw_bore_cut_demo/

And when you say cut the strap low. I don't get the low part either. You mean cut right below the bore and leave some holding wood so the tree has something to sit on while I walk to the come along?

 

[Adkpk]

It does look like you will strip some branches on neighboring trees when it comes down. Are you ready for that to happen ?

The dead man is directly behind me. Meaning the tree will fall right to where I am taking the picture. It looks pretty clear to me. The beach is in front or the oak. Plus I don't have spikes. I can't see taking out those branches without them not to mention the other dead branches and the widow maker. I just need to get him on the ground, I'll beat on him there. :greenchainsaw:

 

[Nailsbeats]

Yes, the cut in the video is mostly correct. Don't do the shallow face bore he does, you want your hinge as strong as you can get it to fight side weight pulling on the hinge during the fall. He just did that so he wouldn't have fiber pull on a saleable butt log.

The low trip is standard practice on a bore cut. You will want to trip it lower than your bore cut ,I would suggest 1-4", so you are under your wedges. The tree will be sitting on your wedges, also being held up by the slightly pretensioned line, and the strap will not break until you pull on the tree, the break will be vertical, end grain is what I call it. Make sure your strap cut is deep enough to allow the end grain break, I go a little bit past my bore cut. Your end result should look like this, not quite those proportions though.

l
>-_
l

Oh, BTW, unlike the guy in the video, make sure you sharpen your chain before going to work, lol.

 

[Adkpk]

Yes, the cut in the video is mostly correct. Don't do the shallow face bore he does, you want your hinge as strong as you can get it to fight side weight pulling on the hinge during the fall. He just did that so he wouldn't have fiber pull on a saleable butt log.

The low trip is standard practice on a bore cut. You will want to trip it lower than your bore cut ,I would suggest 1-4", so you are under your wedges. The tree will be sitting on your wedges, also being held up by the slightly pretensioned line, and the strap will not break until you pull on the tree, the break will be vertical, end grain is what I call it. Make sure your strap cut is deep enough to allow the end grain break, I go a little bit past my bore cut. Your end result should look like this, not quite those proportions though.

l
>-_
l

Oh, BTW, unlike the guy in the video, make sure you sharpen your chain before going to work, lol.

I'm gonna nail this sucka! Got ya Nails. I won't be back there with a saw until at least next week. I am not sure if I have anything but milling chain for my 66, might have to order one.
I am still debating whether to climb and limb it for extra insurance.

Oh, BTW, unlike the guy in the video, make sure you sharpen your chain before going to work, lol.

Right.:hmm3grin2orange:

 

[Nailsbeats]

Sounds good, just let me know how you do.

 

[Adkpk]

No biggy

Had nothing to do Friday so I climbed the oak and lightened the top up a bit and removed any wood that might get hung up. Sad excuse for a treeguy but I would have chunked it down some but only had my 191 with me. The second pic is what I do during the day. Terracing and general outdoor beautification. :kilt: