Figuring log weight?

[lwmibc]

Thanks, fellas; we're getting some meat on this topic now. The OP will have to realize, I hope he has the humility, that indeed there are lots of us who handle 30% grades routinely. We don't overheat, we don't overload--we just do it day after day and go home for supper; up at 4 the next morning to pre-trip the truck and do it again. We're testimony that it can be done safely--but not by everyone.

You will all know that if you make a mistake on 30% at over 100,000 lbs that your fate is sealed within a second or two; there's no recovery once something goes wrong. It's just got to be done right and you have to know how before you start down or you'll just not be here to post replies to someone who asks others to tell him how heavy his load is over the phone.

I got to thinking today while digging out stumps for our building site with a backhoe--I have my trip logs from the last 6 years before I retired a decade ago. I hauled 3,500 loads at 49,100 kg gross, 15,500 kg tare with full fuel; been over scales obviously 'thousands of times'; that's 33,600 kg or 73,020 lbs of logs per load, times 3500 loads--just shy of 260 million pounds of logs in 6 years, from landing to sort in coast mountains--and I knew what every single one of those loads weighed before I started down.

Someone who didn't calculate the weight of even one load, and didn't know how, called ME the BS'er for giving him a drumming for doing something irresponsible. Ever wonder what's wrong with America?

(BTW nml, did you REALLY think you were the only one who had headaches with scales??)

 

[Stoneguy]

View attachment 994647
One and a half ton log this time

I'll assume that's not displaying pounds?

 

[rogue60]

You guys are weird... down here we only put a tonne (1000kg) of firewood in our 4x4 Utes they are rated for that..yeah we don't call our 4x4 Utes trucks lol

As for carting logs that's what log trucks are for.

 

[rogue60]

Over heating problems 3 different "trucks" how or why is this even a mystery? its pretty obvious why lol

 

[Campbellcontractlogging]

You guys are weird... down here we only put a tonne (1000kg) of firewood in our 4x4 Utes they are rated for that..yeah we don't call our 4x4 Utes trucks lol

As for carting logs that's what log trucks are for.
View attachment 996417View attachment 996418

That a good jag on that truck pretty timber thems dandy’s to cut right there.

 

[northmanlogging]

I'd never identify the victim of Colorado Clown as a clueless yokel; could be my wife or yours. If my age, maybe a grandkid. Someone asking a question like that should be taken off the road; setting out without knowing how heavy your load is is, or should be, criminal. How and why did he get a license without knowing that proper loading IS his responsibility?

In all that driving--NOT ONE citation or ticket for anything so I too have respect for what we call CVSE up here. I did all my own maintenance--why would you let someone else touch your brakes?--and there was never a flaw found. That's simple proof that it can be done.

Ever done a horsepower calculation for how much energy is required for a panic stop with 100,000 lbs?--it's up around 150,000 horsepower IIRC. I did that while sitting in an airbrake course lecture years ago; forgot about engine being my number one concern as I stared down at the calculation I'd just done. Then engine became #3 just as soon as I thought about steering tire failure with a load--granted that you can mitigate that with trailer brakes if you're quick enough and your hand isn't shattered.

And I'm one person you would never see with my thumb inside the steering wheel, despite being years retired. Habit.

So if Colorado Clown had overheat indications on power train--just imagine how far above braking capacity he was. And he didn't even know enough to not come on a site like this and ask the question that he did. Like I said--

Good Grief.

bought a very used disService truck last year, tires were sketchy at best, but it was also 6 hours from home....
long story short blowing steer tires SUCKS like a lot... and I wasn't loaded at the time.
luckily I have pretty good OH **** reflexes, and it was a ditch side tire with a wide shoulder... so I was able to keep it upright and not run into on coming traffic But holy S was that a ride.
Little later after I'd gotten it loaded with tools, and fuel etc, lost 2 duals on one side.... that was probably a worse ride because it was a narrower road with more traffic, but also not the instant swerve into death as the steer tires were, it also took considerably longer to find a spot to get off and be safe to repair.

All that said, losing a tire with a dual is fairly common with the dumb truck, and self laother, they get drove into and drug out of some pretty sketchy trails (not roads... barely trails) littered with all sorts of who knows what, so a cut tire is fairly common. But again, losing a dual isn't so bad, a guy can limp it to a tire shop with some bit a of safety, the DOT don't like to hear that of course lol, one of the main reasons you won't see me running super singles.

 

[northmanlogging]

Just a quick question: You are looking at going down an ugly, gravel covered slope. If you try going down it in a very slow gear and subsequently break traction on your drivers, you will be obliged to either push the clutch or risk a jack-knife. There will be no way to keep your driveline helping out if gravity overcomes your traction.

Do you go into that slope "mostly brakes" with your tranny in what you hope is the correct exiting speed, or do you just push the clutch and max out the braking when your driver traction breaks loose, steering for your life?

find the gear you need at the top, turn the jakes on before you start down, the jakes will do most of the work, and the brakes augment those, on a really bad day the jakes will cause the drive tires to "lock up" but usually only one wheel or axles so you still have some control, when it happens you can rest your foot on the clutch peddle and the jakes "should" turn off, or the throttle, both are wired into the system so if either is depressed the jakes shut off, at least they should be, not all trucks are set up correctly though. Biggest thing is to find the gear that will keep you in control before you start down, generally the gear you can climb the hill in is the gear to go down the hill in, but not always.

Despite having massive engines with high compression, using the motor alone to slow down is pretty much pointless, even in lower gears, the weight and gearing is enough to overrev the engine in a hurry, the jakes turn it into a giant air compressor, making every stoke a compression stroke... kind of... but not really, very effective for slowing you down though.
Better still is a hydraulic retarder, not many have those anymore as they had leakage issues but they combined with jakes will bring the truck to a stop without ever touching the brakes... assuming you don't skid, which is again solved by touching the peddles... the retarder is wired similar to the jakes but also has a hand valve... use mine all the time.

Thanks, fellas; we're getting some meat on this topic now. The OP will have to realize, I hope he has the humility, that indeed there are lots of us who handle 30% grades routinely. We don't overheat, we don't overload--we just do it day after day and go home for supper; up at 4 the next morning to pre-trip the truck and do it again. We're testimony that it can be done safely--but not by everyone.

You will all know that if you make a mistake on 30% at over 100,000 lbs that your fate is sealed within a second or two; there's no recovery once something goes wrong. It's just got to be done right and you have to know how before you start down or you'll just not be here to post replies to someone who asks others to tell him how heavy his load is over the phone.

I got to thinking today while digging out stumps for our building site with a backhoe--I have my trip logs from the last 6 years before I retired a decade ago. I hauled 3,500 loads at 49,100 kg gross, 15,500 kg tare with full fuel; been over scales obviously 'thousands of times'; that's 33,600 kg or 73,020 lbs of logs per load, times 3500 loads--just shy of 260 million pounds of logs in 6 years, from landing to sort in coast mountains--and I knew what every single one of those loads weighed before I started down.

Someone who didn't calculate the weight of even one load, and didn't know how, called ME the BS'er for giving him a drumming for doing something irresponsible. Ever wonder what's wrong with America?

(BTW nml, did you REALLY think you were the only one who had headaches with scales??)

Yeah, but the OP has a way of ignoring everything but what he already firmly believes, hence the inspiration for my tag line...
(no I didn't think I was the only one, I was just hoping newer trucks had less issues... at least thats what everyone trying to sell newer trucks keeps insisting)

 

[pdqdl]

I have a related steep slope problem that happened to me once. I was mowing a very steep hill with my 2wd tractor. Having made it to the top, turned sideways, and then turned downhill again, my traction wheels lost their ability to hold the slope. This was rather alarming, because one wheel began spinning backwards as the tractor started racing uncontrollably down the hill. Stomping on the right brake to stop the back-spinning right wheel only caused the left wheel to start spinning backwards. You see, all that gravity was making one wheel spin backwards through the differential while the other wheel scampered down the hill with no backpressure from the engine.

With very little engine back-pressure translating into slowing down, the tractor was going down the hill at a pretty fast clip. I pushed the clutch, both wheels started going in the right direction, and the brakes slowed me right on down at that point. Besides, I had a nice run-out at the bottom of the hill, so the only problem I had was that the clutch had exploded inside the tractor when I pushed it.
Bottom line: If you break traction on a steep hill in a lower gear and then push the clutch, you will likely cause the clutch to over-speed and explode. They usually sieze up and cannot release at that point.

(After that happened, it couldn't be stopped unless it taken out of gear or the engine was killed. I drove it "no clutch" about 10 miles to the dealership for repairs)

 

[lwmibc]

I can call your losing both tires of a dual set and raise you having both axle U-bolts snap that connected the rear axle of a tandem pair to a trailer walking beam--in a corner shooting for a hill. And it was the beam on the outside of the turn. Managed to keep control, stayed in my lane to get it stopped.

The duals blowing was from a hard braking when some high school girls with (melting) chocolate motors for brains stepped out off a curb into my lane just as I was approaching. The spacer ring between Dayton wheels chose that moment to end its life and rolled/crushed its rim like a Tim Horton's cup; that allowed both Dayton wheels to rotate on the spokes, shearing both valve stems off. By the time I got to where I could pull off both tire liners were destroyed; those girls caused a lot of expense. Steering axle of a 3-axle self-steer wagon trailer.

The U-bolts on the walking beam had rusted up inside the casting that holds them in place on the underside of the axle; not visible during an inspection. That made an impression on me--no matter how fastidious you are on maintenance, there are some things that are just hidden from inspection; I admit I didn't like that. The other side was okay because the walking beam itself on that side broke right on a landing while getting loaded a year or so previously; that was all new. But I did then replace the bolts for the other end of the walking beam too, but at my leisure in the shop this time.

BTW that axle bolt venture happened about 2:30 in the afternoon. I radioed the cut block, new U bolts were ordered by phone immediately from the shop that did the trailer work, they knew the specs. Foreman arrived half an hour later with tools and jack, and by the time his wife arrived with the bolts we had everything apart ready for the new ones. Bolted up and I still made the sort before closing at 4:30, about another 20 minutes drive from where this happened. Loggers are resourceful folks.

All that is every-day run-of-the-mill stuff. If you want to feel sorry for me--both the old Kenworth and the Western Star: Hendrickson rubber-block suspension. On logging roads. Gotta admit--nothing ever busted or wore out on either of them (well, excepting for the seat and some of my unmentionable anatomical parts of course).

 

[northmanlogging]

I can call your losing both tires of a dual set and raise you having both axle U-bolts snap that connected the rear axle of a tandem pair to a trailer walking beam--in a corner shooting for a hill. And it was the beam on the outside of the turn. Managed to keep control, stayed in my lane to get it stopped.

The duals blowing was from a hard braking when some high school girls with (melting) chocolate motors for brains stepped out off a curb into my lane just as I was approaching. The spacer ring between Dayton wheels chose that moment to end its life and rolled/crushed its rim like a Tim Horton's cup; that allowed both Dayton wheels to rotate on the spokes, shearing both valve stems off. By the time I got to where I could pull off both tire liners were destroyed; those girls caused a lot of expense. Steering axle of a 3-axle self-steer wagon trailer.

The U-bolts on the walking beam had rusted up inside the casting that holds them in place on the underside of the axle; not visible during an inspection. That made an impression on me--no matter how fastidious you are on maintenance, there are some things that are just hidden from inspection; I admit I didn't like that. The other side was okay because the walking beam itself on that side broke right on a landing while getting loaded a year or so previously; that was all new. But I did then replace the bolts for the other end of the walking beam too, but at my leisure in the shop this time.

BTW that axle bolt venture happened about 2:30 in the afternoon. I radioed the cut block, new U bolts were ordered by phone immediately from the shop that did the trailer work, they knew the specs. Foreman arrived half an hour later with tools and jack, and by the time his wife arrived with the bolts we had everything apart ready for the new ones. Bolted up and I still made the sort before closing at 4:30, about another 20 minutes drive from where this happened. Loggers are resourceful folks.

All that is every-day run-of-the-mill stuff. If you want to feel sorry for me--both the old Kenworth and the Western Star: Hendrickson rubber-block suspension. On logging roads. Gotta admit--nothing ever busted or wore out on either of them (well, excepting for the seat and some of my unmentionable anatomical parts of course).

my new to me DumB truck has air ride suspension.. but to be honest I kind of like the hendrix walking beam pad mount stuff for a dumB truck, go a lot more places with a lot less drama... even though the seat and the sensitive bits get a little tired at the end of the day.
The Self LoaTHer has spring over walking beam, and its not too bad, though the bushings are just about worn out out so it acts up a little now and then, the walking beam never heard of shock absorbers and as they wear they like to start a hip hop group... which kind of ruins yer coffee in the morning.

 

[softdown]

Went with smaller tires to help with gear ratio and tire weight. Motorhome tires for many. Installing lockers, air shocks, finned rear diff cover and a new track bar - if all goes well.
Mods in past 1/2 year(more coming):
New brakes with cooling slots in rotors
New tires
4 core radiator
Premium transmission cooler
Oversized trannie pan with cooling fins and temp gauge
Engine chip set on moderate power boost - trannie is unmodified

It does OK. But I would buy a small semi if I had it to do over again. Still pretty likely to do that if funding and opportunity etc.

On the other hand, would not have had to do hardly anything if not operating near a Colorado pass.

When youtube vids want to highlight heavy trucks they seem to default to logging trucks. But I would not be surprised if hay loads are competitive. I've seen a couple hay carrying semi's on their sides. Some carry two high - no problem. But some go for three largish bales high.

 

[softdown]

You and others sure seem to be jumping to conclusions without knowing some pertinent missing facts. Doesn't a moderator have all the facts before coming to a conclusion?

He's just a bit of a jerk. Nothing to do with the perk that he can't be put on ignore.

 

[softdown]

You guys are weird... down here we only put a tonne (1000kg) of firewood in our 4x4 Utes they are rated for that..yeah we don't call our 4x4 Utes trucks lol

As for carting logs that's what log trucks are for.
View attachment 996417View attachment 996418

Three axle logging truck would be a bit better.

 

[softdown]

Canton Ave in Pittsburgh is considered the steepest road in America. The grade is 32% for a pretty short time.

 

[softdown]

Now my head gasket leaks oil. I always shut it down within a minute of engine temp light coming on. That was clearly not enough. The head gasket was done before I bought the truck. Looks to be a pretty big job. 2001 Cummins 5.9.

If a four core radiator doesn't do the job - not much will. Easy loads in Kansas are killers in the mountains of Colorado.

 

[robo nixon]

I just used three separate trailers and two different trucks to haul five different goods. At the conclusion of every excursion, I get a hot engine or transmission warning light. that includes an upgraded transmission cooler with a deeper pan and cooling fins and a four core radiator.

 

[pdqdl]

You might consider backing off the throttle a bit.

I've got a heavy combination I haul every now and then with my F-450 diesel. Another driver that works for me cannot drive it, as he always overheats the engine. I have even been called to rescue him, and continue the drive. Yep. I can drive it away, letting the engine cool as I go.

Go slower up hills, put it in a lower gear, do what you should do to not overheat. It can be done.
As a test someday after a normal trip: Get out of your truck and check how hot each of your wheels and hubs are when you park. If your brakes are warming up the wheels, you are probably driving far too hard and fast. If the sidewalls of the tires are nice and warm, it's a good sign that you are loaded close to maximum weight and speed. If they are hot, then you need to slow down a lot.

 

[thenne1713]

re: Weights, NORWOOD has excellent phone APP for log weights, board feet, etc..= FREE

 

[Old-Feller]

Now my head gasket leaks oil. I always shut it down within a minute of engine temp light coming on. That was clearly not enough. The head gasket was done before I bought the truck. Looks to be a pretty big job. 2001 Cummins 5.9.

If a four core radiator doesn't do the job - not much will. Easy loads in Kansas are killers in the mountains of Colorado.

It's not that bad of a job really, When you get to the rear head bolts, There are 2 rubber plugs in the body that you pull out to be able to get those bolts out. Turn the engine until you get #1 cylinder at top dead center before you go back on with the head, Remove injector nozzles before you pull the head because they stick down below the cylinder head and are easily damaged, If you remember those few things it should go pretty easy. I replaced the head on my Dad's 99 several years ago, We pulled it off thinking it was just going to need a head gasket, I sent it in for magna-fluxing to check for cracks, It had several of them and it was recommended by the machine shop to just by a new one and that's what we did.

Edit to add:

It's also a good idea to replace all of the little coolant hoses etc. There are some on the oil cooler that would be pretty hard to get to if they started leaking, But are easier to get to when you have the head/turbo off. I replaced all of them

 

[robo nixon]

Additionally, all of the tiny coolant tubes and other components should be replaced. Some of the oil cooler's components would be challenging to access if they began to leak, but when the head or turbo are removed, they are simpler to access. All of them were changed.