Forestry Firefighters just a quick question

[bogiemsn]

Shame, shame, shame on RandyMac and Metals406. NEVER denegrate a piece of safety gear! It reduces your confidence during a deployment, maybe to the extent you leave your shelter. As an engine Captain I never allowed that kind of talk to occur esp around new firefighters. Fire shelters have saved hundreds of firefighters from burns or death. Now write yourselves up, this is going in your p-file.

Zackman pm with your address. I will send you a shelter.

+1

http://www.wildfirelessons.net/documents/1976to1999_Entrapments_Part_2.pdf

See figure 3.

It's par for course on AS for someone to post a question rePE and for the boneheads to come out of the woodwork to denigrate the effectiveness of whatever piece of PPE is being discussed. No piece of equipment is going to be 100% effective in very situation. Obviously you don't want to have to rely on your chainbrake, chaps, helmet or fire shelter but they're damn handy when you need one.

It's very generous for 2dogs to offer to send you a fire shelter but without training on how to deploy it it won't do you much good.

If your department isn't helping you with PPE I hope they're at least giving you some training.

PS

LOL... It surely doesn't stop me from believing in shelters, or having fun while doing a deployment class. I know they work (within their design limits), Shake'N'Bake is just a funny-ha-ha term for them here. No need to get your panties in a knot over regional nicknames. We've all seen the video of the shelters working, and we've all seen the video's of them NOT working. I didn't come up with the term--It's probably older than I am.

Like slowp said, if you have to deploy for realz... Someone ####ed up! And you can almost bet on a body count in a firestorm. If a guy is going to feel all insecure about his shelter because of a nickname--his ass shouldn't be on the line in the first place.

OOPS...
Sorry.

 

[2dogs]

+1

http://www.wildfirelessons.net/documents/1976to1999_Entrapments_Part_2.pdf

See figure 3.

It's par for course on AS for someone to post a question rePE and for the boneheads to come out of the woodwork to denigrate the effectiveness of whatever piece of PPE is being discussed. No piece of equipment is going to be 100% effective in very situation. Obviously you don't want to have to rely on your chainbrake, chaps, helmet or fire shelter but they're damn handy when you need one.

It's very generous for 2dogs to offer to send you a fire shelter but without training on how to deploy it it won't do you much good.

If your department isn't helping you with PPE I hope they're at least giving you some training.

PS



OOPS...
Sorry.

Those two guys are not bone heads. We just have fun the way men do. Sometimes we play rough. Besides Metals406 is a metal-head. Phhttt.

 

[slowp]

Shame, shame, shame on RandyMac and Metals406. NEVER denegrate a piece of safety gear! It reduces your confidence during a deployment, maybe to the extent you leave your shelter. As an engine Captain I never allowed that kind of talk to occur esp around new firefighters. Fire shelters have saved hundreds of firefighters from burns or death. Now write yourselves up, this is going in your p-file.

Zackman pm with your address. I will send you a shelter.

Shake and Bake they shall always be in my dinosaurette brain. Crispy or plain?

 

[Metals406]

Shake and Bake they shall always be in my dinosaurette brain. Crispy or plain?

Amen sister!

 

[kbiv]

What regs (if any) does your state fall under for its depts? I know a couple of people who have went through the new NFPA stuff for gear, i don't know if anything was mentioned about wildland. I think the 10 year mark for structural PPE may be more geared towards barriers breaking down. I actually prefer using a jumpsuit for wildland fires over my regular clothes. My VFD has a minimum of cotton clothes, such as jeans and tshirt, and then the issued jumpsuit over it. I have the pants and separate shirt for schools, but for day to day calls, my banana suit is much more convenient. Everything is still in my pockets underneith!!
For a while we were using just Indura suits from refinary safety places. We went to nomex because the schools and grants required it. At the added price of 100$ more a set, but oh well...
Like it was said, get as much training as you can. Too many depts, both career and volly consider grass and brush fires to be no-brainers. Its that kind of attitude that gets you stuck in the middle of the line with fire to the front, fire to the rear, and an empty pump...ah- good times!

 

[kbiv]

Oh yeah a few more thoughts. If you go with the pants, try to get them loose for air circulation. That, and to prevent blowouts... One other thing, I know it is strictly forbidden, etc, etc, but in a pinch you could pull the liners from your structure gear. Bad side, it is using against manufactures guidelines, hence more liability, you screw it up, it is a 1500-2k$ mistake instead of a 250$ one, and you will still have some mobility issues. But it is more protection than blue jeans. I'm not telling you to do it, just mentioning it since I know a lot of depts do this.

 

[mile9socounty]

What kind of gear do you wear now and do you carry a shelter?

Easy Bake Ovens.

Here's what we wear around here for Fire Season. Old FS Nomex issued to me.

 

[slowp]

The new style has cargo pockets and velcro. I can't compare cuz I quit going to fires a while ago.

Where's your web gear, hardhat, gloves, chaps, camera and credit card?:greenchainsaw:

 

[Zackman1801]

we've got the jackets, and hardhats, gloves, boots and what not, just not the pants. We get small fires nothing like any of you might see out west. Out here grass is a big thing that burns, peoples lawns and hay fields catch from time to time, but never usually forests. Most fires last an hour or two and are over. Some members have the pants, most dont. I found a pair on ebay for $43 from a fire service supplier, they are fairly new and talking with the seller have found they have not been issued. They are 100% cotton with some fire retardant, not nomex but would work out better than my jeans in any situation because they have the 3M reflective tape, so people can see me.

 

[bogiemsn]

Too many depts, both career and volly consider grass and brush fires to be no-brainers. Its that kind of attitude that gets you stuck in the middle of the line with fire to the front, fire to the rear, and an empty pump...ah- good times!

:agree2:

http://www.nwcg.gov/pms/pubs/pms841/pms841_pages23-26.pdf

See, Common Denominators of Fire Behavior on Tragedy Fires

Hats off and all due respect to you structural firefighters out there but fire burning through light fuels (grass and brush) can change behavior in the blink of an eye.

Speaking of jumpsuits, you can sometimes find nomex flightsuits on e-bay. I know one guy that wears a flightsuit for prescribed fires.

I haven't tried indura pants but I've worn indura shirts and liked them well enough, but given the choice I think I'd choose nomex for pants.

 

[TKTimbercraft]

As a currant U.S. Forest Circus Station Captain I can tell you what the currant national standards are. (NFPA, USDA, USDI)

1) Nomex or fire resistive shirt and pants
2) All leather 8" tall boots with a Vibram type sole
3) High impact heat resistive hard hat
4) Leather gloves
5) New Generation Fire Shelter
6) Eye protection (saftey glasses or goggles)
7) hearing protection (ear plugs)

These are the minimum required PPE to set foot on a wildland fire.
If your department cannot afford this, contact your state forestry department and ask for assistance to fire department grants.

There is no such thing as a routine fire, Train like you Fight and Fight like you Train.

 

[mile9socounty]

The new style has cargo pockets and velcro. I can't compare cuz I quit going to fires a while ago.

Where's your web gear, hardhat, gloves, chaps, camera and credit card?:greenchainsaw:

I don't like the new velcro type. I wore mine half a day last summer and then broke my leg. EMT's cut them off. Go figure huh? Spend 2 years fighting my bosses to get a pair. Get them, get cut off.

Where's the web gear and all that? In the back of the crummy. Sorry though, no credit card. Can't afford one.

 

[slowp]

I had a pair of pants that I wouldn't turn in. I hand washed them in camp. They were old, and soft like flannel. I like soft fabrics.

 

[bogiemsn]

I had a pair of pants that I wouldn't turn in. I hand washed them in camp. They were old, and soft like flannel. I like soft fabrics.

Awww, they were like your woobie. That's sooo cute!

Slowp, wowp loves his woobie pants.

 

[slowp]

Awww, they were like your woobie. That's sooo cute!

Slowp, wowp loves his woobie pants.

Slowp is not a he. :greenchainsaw:

 

[2dogs]

Awww, they were like your woobie. That's sooo cute!

Slowp, wowp loves his woobie pants.

That's Ms. slowp to you.

 

[Gologit]

Slowp is not a he. :greenchainsaw:

Way to go...ya got another one.