Good Replacement for Dying Hemlock?

[Guy Meilleur]

Re: Identification

Originally posted by Stephen Wiley
I do not recommend or advocate the use of mycorrizae to a tree in severe decline.

Why not? It has worked on some here, and unlike fert can do no harm.
Good points tho about diagnosing decline before treating or replacing. Just call your friendly local forensic arborist, or take samples yourself to ag ext or U clinic.

 

[TREETX]

Taxodium

Taxodium distichum is deciduous in TX. The only one that can be an exception is Taxodium mucronatum - Montezuma Cypress

 

[Dan F]

Originally posted by M.D. Vaden
How do you tell the two apart?

That's easy....

We don't have Costal redwoods around here.

Chris,
If it is a bald cypress, it will drop it's leaves. However, they will turn brown and slowly drop.

We put up holiday lighting for clients at work, and last year we were knocking brown needles/leaves out of a tall bald cypress the weekend before Thanksgiving. It still had quite a bit on it at the time too....

If you like the shape and want it for screening, why not plant one with some other evergreens? Arborvitae's might work for some partial screening, or plant a spruce or pine (don't use an Austrian, it's not blight resistant, and won't live an extended life) to give some partial screening. Some screening is better than none, right?

If you can put up with some browning from windblown salt in the late winter/early spring, a regular white pine might work for you. A Norway spruce might work too, it grows faster than a Colorado, but slower than a white pine.... And not quite as dense as a Colorado...


Dan

 

[crcurrie]

Dan, actually we *don't* want screening. The tree would go right in front of our house, which is a pretty Victorian that we recently spent a bunch of money restoring the original German lap siding on. That's why we're looking for an evergreen with open habit. But we just wanted a little bit of color year round. In the winter, the gray branches in front of the house would look a little bleak (I know, because that's the effect we have right now with the dying hemlock). Also, we have some azaleas and grass underneath the tree, and so we don't want dense shade. We would want to prune the tree to that one could walk underneath it, as well -- so that the tree doesn't eat up our small front yard.

However, if the bald cypress doesn't lose all its needles until Thanksgiving, maybe we could live with the bare branches for 1/3 of the year. As long as it's the right tree for our needs in other ways. Definitely want something that won't die on us!

Anyone know how fast those trees grow?

Thanks again for all the education, folks!

Chris

 

[Guy Meilleur]

Originally posted by crcurrie
Thanks again for all the education, folks!

Baldcypress will grow .5-2 feet per year, depending on sun soil water etc.

The best education is waiting for you at the Natl Arb; excellent conifer garden and former curator there--Sally somebody?--really knows her trees. Stop on in there and put your tax dollars to work!

Outlaw Larch guy

 

[crcurrie]

I'll definitely do that -- the Arboretum is only a couple miles away and we go there from time to time just to enjoy the gardens.

Chris

 

[M.D. Vaden]

When you go to the Arboretum, ask about your previous tree treatment.

The reason I posted the link in an earlier post -

Its probably better to get organic matter and beneficial fungi in, rather than fertilize.

The article I added the link to, explained how fertilizers, even organic, produce salts. It continued about how salts dehydrate and kill microorganisms, like those that increase the water and nutrient uptake from 10 to 1000 times.

Fertilizing trees can be like giving a person an oxygen tank, and wrapping their head in a plastic bag at the same time.

Is the same person that fertilized, your source for the opinion that the tree is in severe decline?

Are you still reserved to loosing the tree, if you could order a few products yourself for under $100? Especially if you would benefit to have those $100 worth of products in the soil should you plant another tree anyway.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Chris,
Can you get a photo of the declining tree up so we can try to save the darned thing.

 

[crcurrie]

Thanks for offering and asking, Mike! I'd be happy to take a photo tomorrow morning and post it here. I hadn't bothered before because it seemed rather hopeless and because when I sent a photo to Cooperative Extension 15 months ago the reply was that it wasn't possible to do much diagnostically from a photo. Then the hard part was finding a certified arborist who would come to our County (we're one mile from the District of Columbia but considered 'the other side of the tracks'). The arborist I finally enticed (for $150) to do a site visit wasn't sure whether the tree would survive or not, but thought it was worth a try with the spraying and feeding program that year. Possible problems included wooly adelgids (mild infestation -- he thought it was a secondary condition because the tree was already weakened), soil compaction (the lot is 100 years old), and possibly injury from trenching (several feet away) for an irrigation system that was installed four years ago.

The tree looks worse this year than last year. I'll send a photo and I'd appreciate advice or a post mortem. Thanks again!

Chris

 

[Guy Meilleur]

Originally posted by crcurrie
it wasn't possible to do much diagnostically from a photo.
True, but worth a shot
The arborist I finally enticed (for $150) to do a site visit
1. Note to self--Review Rate Structure!!
worth a try with the spraying and feeding program that year.
did this arborist take a soil sample and measure density? That's Job #1 imo, and it costs $5.00 to get the sample analyzed by the state here in NC.
Possible problems included , soil compaction
A $150. site visit should have bought you more than "possibles". Compaction can be measured and should be corrected before any nitrogen is squirted in.
possibly injury from trenching (several feet away) for an irrigation system that was installed four years ago.
This is typical--the worst problem is mentioned last, almost as an afterthought. Trenching for sprinklers is the biggest problem; how many feet is "several"?. Look at your tree's rootzone--which is way beyond the branchtips--and tell us what % of it was cut off. That may make all the other info moot.

[/B]

 

[crcurrie]

Thanks for the add'l suggestions, Guy!

If you want to review your rate structure, you might also wish to consider relocation to Washington, D.C. Professional service rates are out of this world due to the incredible government-generated wealth here as well as the shortage of folks who provide such services. With all the money flying around, it's understandable that arborists won't service my county, where median income is "only" at the 80th percentile relative to national norms (compared to the 99th percentile in several other jurisdictions here). Most folks where I live can't -- or won't -- pay $150 to look at their trees (and $1000 or more to spray and fertilize them afterward). So the arborists won't waste their time here. Spurred by your comments, I called the guy who condescended to service my tree last year, and a recorded message informed me that he has retired. So I guess you guys are my only hope!

Question: How do I calculate the root zone of the tree? If I know that I can estimate roughly where the trenching was done and thereby calculate the percentage that was cut off.

Thanks again!

Chris

 

[Guy Meilleur]

Originally posted by crcurrie
How do I calculate the root zone of the tree?

Roughly speaking, draw a cxircle around the trunk that is =twice as wide as the lenth of the branches.

Or, you cna mesure the trunk diameter, then mesure the distance form the trunk to the trench. A general rule is that trees die 3-5 years after heavy root loss, so yours may be right on schedule...

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Here's where a picture is important.
It's not as simple as Guy's formula. Roots grow where conditions are best, so if there is a street on one side, you'll have fewer roots there, for example.
As you go farther from the tree there are fewer roots, but studies have found roots 5 times the height of the tree away.
Every situation is a little different.
The trench dug for a lawn sprinkler is less catastrophic than other trenches because they are quite shallow.
How far away from the tree was the trench, and what is the tree's trunk diameter at chest height?

 

[crcurrie]

Okay, here are the measurements:

diameter of trunk at chest height: 13-15" (not completely round because trunk divides in two not far above this point)

shortest distance to trunk from trench: 7-8'

spread of branches (radius): 13-15'

I've attached several photos I took this morning. One shows the lower part of the trunk with a grassy strip between it and a stone walk. The trench was dug just to the left of the narrow bed adjacent to the stone path.

The first photo (or the one with the lowest number in its file name) is a photo taken of the tree last year, before treatment.

I suspect the hemlock and Japanese maple were planted at the same time, although what year I don't know. You can see the maple is almost the same height as the hemlock, which makes me think this tree was *never* very healthy. My landscaper pointed that out when he told me that it was a poor site for hemlocks. (On a couple of much quieter streets nearby, however, there are a few gigantic, healthy-looking specimens.)

The wooly adelgids seem to be gone -- no white spots on the branches. But the tree seems worse this year than last -- even in spite of the end of the four-year drought with this year's record rains.

I have a related root-severance question that developed suddenly yesterday when a sinkhole opened up not far from a silver maple in another part of the front yard. I'm just not having a good tree year! The photo shows the hole and the tree in back of it. There are at least a couple of large roots that you can see severed in the whole. That tree always seems a little stressed, anyway -- it is the first of several maples to lose its leaves every Autumn, and you can see it's almost defoliated already while surrounding trees are only starting to shed. It also has a dual trunk (a bunch of our trees are almost certainly volunteers -- sprouted during a long period of neglect in our historic district when nobody wanted those old houses). Is this tree also likely a goner (albeit in 3-5 years)?

Your diagnoses, doctors??

P.S. It looks like I can only attach one image at a time, so I'll do this in a series of postings. First one is last year's photo ...

 

[crcurrie]

second photo ...

 

[crcurrie]

third photo ...

 

[crcurrie]

fourth photo ...

 

[crcurrie]

fifth photo ...

 

[crcurrie]

last one!

 

[M.D. Vaden]

That sure is sparse looking.

Is the climate moist there? The trunk looks green with algae almost like tree trunks appear in many of our western Oregon areas, due to the moist cool season, especially in the coast range.

I've seen a golf course superintendent pull a white fir to life after 100% defoliation before due to an insect infestation.

But I don't think the bugs are what's ailing your tree as much as the below ground issue, or the below ground followed by the bug infestation.

Was hoping your tree may have been a bit greener.