superjunior
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wow. I just ordered some green lids with our company logo on them and I thought the green might be a little over the top. But after seeing that I reckon not
hard hats
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wow. I just ordered some green lids with our company logo on them and I thought the green might be a little over the top. But after seeing that I reckon not
mattmattmatt
New Member
A guy with 40+ years experience I have been doing some contract climbing for insists that all chainsaw helmets must have a brim for kickback hazard, which seems reasonable, but Z133.1 & Z89.1 are silent on this topic as far as I can tell (I don't have access to the latest standards). They are also silent on the topic of chin straps for climbers, where the helmet itself becomes the struck-by hazard to groundies. I never have any problems with my helmet falling off (photo attached). I zip-tied the muffs to the helmet to make sure the muffs could not fall off and hazard anyone below because the Peltor clips are not secure enough. The muffs hold the helmet on my head really well and I can flick them up to communicate below. I tried a chin-strap system once but it interferes with the muff seal. The brim is good because it protects from the sun and the euro-style helmets look gay (am I allowed to write that?), the groundies or I will never wear them.
rymancm
ArboristSite Operative
Did you drill those holes along the crest? Just curious.
Grouchy old man
ArboristSite Operative
Good idea but is there a little OCD going on there? I would think only two ties in the lower holes on each side would do it. Matter of fact those holes in the clips must be there for some purpose. I wonder if you could drill holes and put machine screws through from the inside of the helmet with washers and nuts on the clip side? I'll have to look at mine, I have the same setup but my muff clips are nice and tight.
mattmattmatt
New Member
Agreed, there is some OCD here. It is the government, you see they will change the law here in QLD in the new year 2012, failure to comply with the duty of care will become a criminal offence in the first instance, whereas previously there was some latitude for Dept of Industrial Relations or the Dept of Health, OH&S etc to apply discretion, the way it is going now the Police will be forced to investigate and knowing them they will look for anything to use against you to support their case, if there was an incident. The fines are huge and you would definitely lose your business licence, no more tree climbing. So I have been researching this topic of hard hats because I was always unsure of the requirements (ANSI standards are the defacto Australian standard) and I figure 4 holes show more duty of care than leaving two holes empty. As for machine screws, a mate of mine got struck-by with this same setup on his head and he got the peltor wires, that is the solid steel bits that hold the muffs, he got one of those through his cheek and into his upper jaw, so I am looking to eliminate as much steel as possible there you see. I had to drill holes into the top to dissipate heat, it is very hot and humid here and the holes definitely help. I figure the holes can only compromise my safety, if at all, and they don't diminish my duty of care to others so my professional integrity is intact there. It is all a bit OCD for sure but good to know that I can defend my position if audited, now I can relax and carry on making money out of trees!
For the Queenslanders, here I've attached the QLD WHS-2011 guide, page 36 is the new stuff, comes into effect January 1st. Note this is not specific to arboriculture, it's general to all workplaces so hopefully they will leave us alone.
For the Queenslanders, here I've attached the QLD WHS-2011 guide, page 36 is the new stuff, comes into effect January 1st. Note this is not specific to arboriculture, it's general to all workplaces so hopefully they will leave us alone.
Jumper
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I have heard every excuse in the book why PPE is not being worn(it is too hot, it is too cold, it hurts, it is uncomfortable, I work in the office etc etc) and my answer is along the lines of yours, wear it or look for a new job. Most places in Alberta are really good about enforcing the law, and the Labour Ministry is on a spin fining and closing down businesses who choose to ignore it......there were dozens of issued stop work orders for lack of fall protection equipment alone in the weeks leading up to Xmas.....Would you free climb a tree and work without a saddle???
As for hard hats wear what works for you and to hell with what it looks like.....I look like a dork in a warehouse wearing a bump cap but I am tired of having items fall off shelves onto my head when I am trying to pull something else to ship. And one of the reasons I left where I was temping before Xmas was the total lack of safety awareness of the managers in the place.....I am not going to swing for their stupidity...no safety footwear, riding forklift tines to access shelves 30 feet off the ground with no fall arrest, and a condemned forklift still being used for starters.
Jumper
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wow. I just ordered some green lids with our company logo on them and I thought the green might be a little over the top. But after seeing that I reckon not
Green lids on a lot of sites in Alberta indicates newbie ie new employees.....and I recently bought a new light blue one for when I work for Habitat.......indicates volunteer(not my colour normally!)
superjunior
Addicted to ArboristSite
Why this fine young lad does. Notice the precision, the accuracy and professionalism.
James the narcoleptic tree cutter - YouTube
TreEmergencyB
ArboristSite Guru
I wear the petzel aleavo (sp?) the other guys on the crew have the vertex. Both nice and comfy mine fits a lil bit nicer and is lighter. The real difference is the vents dont close on mine but you can adjust the way it sits on your head better.
Nemus Talea
ArboristSite Operative
Different shape heads effect fit and no one can be wrong about what they like and works. A buddy of mine, who works concrete, has a large head that's absolutely vertical in the back. He can tighten a ratchet till he gets a headache and it still slips.
What is the life span of these Kasks? Manufacturer advised disposal due to age and UV exposure that is. A $15 hat, replaced every couple years and after any moderate strike or other abuse, is probably better protection than an old, abused, sun beaten brittle $100+ lid. Of course the Kevlars do good with the UV but you cook in summer.
Regarding groundies loosing their hats while looking up, get some elastic from a sewing supply and tie it to the suspensions of the ppe offenders. if you want something more refined, bullard has a strap that I know will work with the venerable Husky forestry helmet. I got one from Spur or Sherrill for 3 bucks if i recall correctly.
What is the life span of these Kasks? Manufacturer advised disposal due to age and UV exposure that is. A $15 hat, replaced every couple years and after any moderate strike or other abuse, is probably better protection than an old, abused, sun beaten brittle $100+ lid. Of course the Kevlars do good with the UV but you cook in summer.
Regarding groundies loosing their hats while looking up, get some elastic from a sewing supply and tie it to the suspensions of the ppe offenders. if you want something more refined, bullard has a strap that I know will work with the venerable Husky forestry helmet. I got one from Spur or Sherrill for 3 bucks if i recall correctly.
superjunior
Addicted to ArboristSite
I ended up getting the groundies and myself rockman forestry helmets. They're light, comfortable, vented and have a very nice 4 point chinstrap set up. For 30$ a pop I thought it was a great buy. Also got myself a decent climbing lid from rock helmets, it's comfy, light and vented and was only 60$ Since I spent a lot less on hard hats then I was anticipating I got our company logo on them and they look sweet!
beastmaster
Addicted to ArboristSite
I was feeling hurt no one liked the rockman's beside me. I love my rockman, it's light, it looks kind of cool, it approved to work around
HV. I wear my helmet all day, and it never gets uncomfortable or hot. I agree with who ever said that a brim can protect you from saw kick back.
Just because their only 30 bucks don't mean their cheap. Plus a helmet with out the chin strap doesn't offer the protection of one that does, and rockman has one of the best chinstraps around IMHO. Rockman Rocks
Riddle me this then, I be interested on why ocean race yachts men can work under swingin booms and sails and climb rigging and masts without even basic height harness gear or safety helmet. Its a odd hypocrisy that some high end dangerous endeavours ones can operate without a helmet. But ride ya bicycle or go on any OZ work site and bang you got a lid on or else.
Ha, check out the sun hat hard hat non invert safe harness and swingin boom at head height that with a rope wrapped around ya legs.
superjunior
Addicted to ArboristSite
Your original post was the reason I checked them out in the first place. Thanks BM.
Also the locking adjustable dial is one of the nicest I've seen on any lid. If anyone has to outfit their crew with some new hard hats the rockman is an excellent value
Iustinian
ArboristSite Operative
I like my vertex vent, its very adjustable and light. as a previous poster said, the sweat band pretty much sucks, but I wear a Halo headband underneath which is really nice for keeping sweat out of the eyes. Alveo and Vertex both cover your temples, which is a point no ones brought up yet, which most other lids do not. Also want to point out that vented lids are not approved as "non-conductive" gear so they shouldn't be used in line clearing.
Blakesmaster
Addicted to ArboristSite
I saw that it wasn't approved when I bought mine a few years back. Doesn't really make a difference to me as I don't do much powerline work but does anyone know why it's not approved? Just curious.
deevo
Addicted to ArboristSite
It's the vent openings, but really, if you keep your MAD and know your limits wearing a vertex or normal helmet if you getting zapped, I highly doubt the outcome won't be the same. I have been looking around and for the most part never really came across any incidents about people contacting conductors head first. I'll admit I do have a another helmet for line clearing but usually wear my Vertex vent. Same with a lot of guys around here (that don't work for Hydro) they said the same as well. :redface:
Youngbuck20
ArboristSite Guru
The petzl best is what most guys in my program have chosen to pick up, I'll be doing the same.
ROPECLIMBER
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These rock climbing helments are one time impact, (starophome liner) like bike helments and they don't have ansi z133 rating so are not OSAH approved
I checked when stayed up all night trying to buy just the suspension for my older petzel vertex vent
worldtravelin
New Member
no brainer
This was a funny thread to read over.
Petzl needs to get with the program and offer both billed & full brimmed helmets to fit on their suspension/chin strap designs. I've used the Ecrin since first rock climbing 20 yrs ago, and without second thought used it during my years as an arborist. Now that I work at heights in industrial settings, the Vertex is the obvious choice and I have one for work currently. Problem being, I have to make the choice when I go to industrial sites around the world if I'm going to spare myself the good ole boy ridicule while wearing the Vertex or take some cheap PoS rachet HH that falls of this long-haired reformed hippy's head. Until I grow a 3rd arm to keep my industry standard hh in place as I maneuver & use tools on towers or stacks, I guess I'll keep wearing the Vertex and get asked continually if " plan on jumping/skydiving off the tower," because as mentioned the "Space Ranger" mentality prevails in the US industrial worksite arena.
Overseas the Vertex or similar is becoming standard issue, not just for tower, arborists or heights workers, but general industrial applications, so it is not like these are only being sold to niche/low volume customers like arborists or S&R, and I'm not asking Petzl to make the cowboy hat variety, just something that is needed out there.
The chin strap add-ons to common HHs are crap, and why should there be any surprise no one uses them? A company like Petzl designs a quality helmet with great adjustment & chin strap allowing for ear muffs to be used, and also adds in clip-in attachment points, yet won't add a bill or full brim option is quite absurd. Some sites require bills or full brims for "fall from above" hazards, yet these Petzl or similar helmets go slimline on the sides, so those fall from aboves rip off your ears, etc.
After searching, to no avail, I finally just went & bought a full brim HH, intending to change out the suspension with my Vertex.... silly me, Petzl's got a 7 point attachment system, not the industry standard 4??? Uggg, rather annoying.
It's ironic, in the industry where working at heights often requires 100% tie-off (D-Ring on the back of full body harness, double deceleration lanyards), that notes falls will often hurt (and you'd get bounced around), positioning lanyards do not have standards (they are optional) that there is no chin strap requirement. Bounce around on your fall..... hmmm what happens? your standard HH falls off and you hit your noggin compounding the issue 10 fold.
it's just a frustrating scenario, that I can't comprehend... :bang:
Vertex "Sunscreen" model in full dork mode!
View attachment 236804
"Petzl Sponsored" Space Ranger 300ft up
View attachment 236805
Space Ranger GoProing a 400ft stack climb
View attachment 236806
This was a funny thread to read over.
Petzl needs to get with the program and offer both billed & full brimmed helmets to fit on their suspension/chin strap designs. I've used the Ecrin since first rock climbing 20 yrs ago, and without second thought used it during my years as an arborist. Now that I work at heights in industrial settings, the Vertex is the obvious choice and I have one for work currently. Problem being, I have to make the choice when I go to industrial sites around the world if I'm going to spare myself the good ole boy ridicule while wearing the Vertex or take some cheap PoS rachet HH that falls of this long-haired reformed hippy's head. Until I grow a 3rd arm to keep my industry standard hh in place as I maneuver & use tools on towers or stacks, I guess I'll keep wearing the Vertex and get asked continually if " plan on jumping/skydiving off the tower," because as mentioned the "Space Ranger" mentality prevails in the US industrial worksite arena.
Overseas the Vertex or similar is becoming standard issue, not just for tower, arborists or heights workers, but general industrial applications, so it is not like these are only being sold to niche/low volume customers like arborists or S&R, and I'm not asking Petzl to make the cowboy hat variety, just something that is needed out there.
The chin strap add-ons to common HHs are crap, and why should there be any surprise no one uses them? A company like Petzl designs a quality helmet with great adjustment & chin strap allowing for ear muffs to be used, and also adds in clip-in attachment points, yet won't add a bill or full brim option is quite absurd. Some sites require bills or full brims for "fall from above" hazards, yet these Petzl or similar helmets go slimline on the sides, so those fall from aboves rip off your ears, etc.
After searching, to no avail, I finally just went & bought a full brim HH, intending to change out the suspension with my Vertex.... silly me, Petzl's got a 7 point attachment system, not the industry standard 4??? Uggg, rather annoying.
It's ironic, in the industry where working at heights often requires 100% tie-off (D-Ring on the back of full body harness, double deceleration lanyards), that notes falls will often hurt (and you'd get bounced around), positioning lanyards do not have standards (they are optional) that there is no chin strap requirement. Bounce around on your fall..... hmmm what happens? your standard HH falls off and you hit your noggin compounding the issue 10 fold.
it's just a frustrating scenario, that I can't comprehend... :bang:
Vertex "Sunscreen" model in full dork mode!
View attachment 236804
"Petzl Sponsored" Space Ranger 300ft up
View attachment 236805
Space Ranger GoProing a 400ft stack climb
View attachment 236806
