Trx250r180
Saw polisher
looks like 2x8 doug fir from lumber yard ,not the quarter sawn rough like iv'e been watching for ,i find lots of wood with frowns in the end
only quarter sawn iv'e come up with is about 6 inches clean tight grain so far
HEY BOB! What's steel, sharp. . .
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looks like 2x8 doug fir from lumber yard ,not the quarter sawn rough like iv'e been watching for ,i find lots of wood with frowns in the end
only quarter sawn iv'e come up with is about 6 inches clean tight grain so far
Metals406
Granfodder Runningsaw
Them are too dang purdy to use now!! :msp_w00t: :msp_thumbup:
I like the orange!!
We need some action shots!
FYI fellas, in any give small town, there are probably a dozen or more guys with a band mill offering their services. I can think of three within 7 miles of me, and more as you go further out. A lot of them will mill for share.
A guy just has to wait on a couple 30" fir, and drag them in. Worst case, freehand mill them with the saw, and have a local cabinet shop run them through their big planer or Timesaver sander. My dad used to do that all the time for jobs/projects where he needed the width of a commercial sander/planer. It was $1.00 per pass -- so not a deal breaker for us common folks.
DF. Lumber yard 2X10. Took a 12 footer and cut it in half.
Them are too dang purdy to use now!! :msp_w00t: :msp_thumbup:
I like the orange!!
We need some action shots!
FYI fellas, in any give small town, there are probably a dozen or more guys with a band mill offering their services. I can think of three within 7 miles of me, and more as you go further out. A lot of them will mill for share.
A guy just has to wait on a couple 30" fir, and drag them in. Worst case, freehand mill them with the saw, and have a local cabinet shop run them through their big planer or Timesaver sander. My dad used to do that all the time for jobs/projects where he needed the width of a commercial sander/planer. It was $1.00 per pass -- so not a deal breaker for us common folks.
The orange is so I can find them after I leave them at that stump or was it this one.
Do you have a pic of what a piece of 1/4 saw'n DF looks like. If I go a little northwest of here I can find plenty of spruce bud worm killed DF. There is a lot of it on the down hill side of the roads. It is 30 inch plus and east slope tight grained too.
I like that stripe on the back. I've never walked completely off a board but I've come close. I wear glasses and after awhile the alternating layers of dust, oil, sweat, and general gunk combined with dust in the air and sun glare make it tough to see the end of the board. Or anything else.
I think I'll be painting a stripe on mine, too. If anybody laughs I'll hit them with my bottle of Geritol.
OlympicYJ
ArboristSite Guru
Luckily the old man has a band mill :biggrin: He informed me he has an antique shoe sittin on the forge I can board up! I didn't go diggin this weekend. Had my first lazy sleep in weekend in months lol
Metals406
Granfodder Runningsaw
I love lazy sleep!! It's my favorite kind! :drool:
OlympicYJ
ArboristSite Guru
Unfortunately highly unproductive! LMAO
Metals406
Granfodder Runningsaw
The orange is so I can find them after I leave them at that stump or was it this one.
This is a good video, it's not too in depth, but gives a guy a pretty good understanding about basic milling procedure, and grain orientation.
Thinking of growth rings as you would a 2x6, we know that standing a 2x6 on edge, can take a greater load than one laid on it's side. So then, 1/4 sawn with vertical annular rings, would give a board laid in it's side greater strength, as opposed to flat sawn where the rings run parallel to the boards width.
<iframe width="640" height="480" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/sVBsA1KbfY8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Trx250r180
Saw polisher
great explanation ,i was just getting 2 slabs from center of log that were quarter looking ,never thought of flipping it to get more
Thanks Nate.:msp_smile: I should be able to get four boards out of one tree. I'm thinking about 7 feet long ruffed out. 12 inches wide and 3 inches thick. What do you think?
strangersfaces
ArboristSite Operative
What is said and shown in the video was mostly right...
He shows one so-called "Modern" method of quartersawing. Note first pic below from the Stephan Woodworking site. Both the vid dude (at about 5:30) AND the pic below are WRONG in identifying "Rift sawn" lumber...
Traditional Plain (aka "Flat"), Quarter and (REAL) Rift sawn, courtesy of Advantage Lumber:
Real Rift sawn is the most time consuming and most wasteful method of milling (see graphic above), produces the most dimensionally stable and strongest product (when used flat, as in springboards, as the grain of each board is perpendicular ("on edge") throughout) and also results in the most expensive product. Quartersawn is a close second in strength, stability and cost.
I've purchased loads of finish lumber and custom milling through the years, and of late there seems some oft repeated misinformation being regurgitated as fact... For some reason, several years back I began to notice some "talking heads" describing Rift as having grain angle further away from 90* than Quartersawn. Bunk! Nowadays, it seems most popular "experts" AND many lumber sources repeat the same BS information. I STRONGLY suspect this false view is the product of Large Lumber Manufacturers, who want maximum recovery and highest profits without having to mess with the involved process of TRUE Rift sawing. It's a case of so-called Experts spitting out falsehoods to please these Large Budget ADVERTISERS. Simply untrue. Pisses me off.
Note in pic below (courtesy of Bart Moyers) that when lumber is plain sawn, the first board or two from center of log are "accidentally" Quartersawn! Savvy mill operators pull these to stack in their "Premium Lumber" pile to sell at higher prices. Softwoods such as Fir, Spruce, Pine, etc. are not regularly quartersawn except for specialty markets. Fortunately many mills don't take the time to separate out quartersawn softwood. SO, if one is looking for quartersawn at their local lumber yard, forget checking faces to find straight grain, instead, sight the boards from the ends. You'll likely see boards with grain running near perpendicular from top to bottom of some boards, and THOSE are the ones which will be strongest for springboards...., and will cost no more than the more run of the mill stuff.
He shows one so-called "Modern" method of quartersawing. Note first pic below from the Stephan Woodworking site. Both the vid dude (at about 5:30) AND the pic below are WRONG in identifying "Rift sawn" lumber...
Traditional Plain (aka "Flat"), Quarter and (REAL) Rift sawn, courtesy of Advantage Lumber:
Real Rift sawn is the most time consuming and most wasteful method of milling (see graphic above), produces the most dimensionally stable and strongest product (when used flat, as in springboards, as the grain of each board is perpendicular ("on edge") throughout) and also results in the most expensive product. Quartersawn is a close second in strength, stability and cost.
I've purchased loads of finish lumber and custom milling through the years, and of late there seems some oft repeated misinformation being regurgitated as fact... For some reason, several years back I began to notice some "talking heads" describing Rift as having grain angle further away from 90* than Quartersawn. Bunk! Nowadays, it seems most popular "experts" AND many lumber sources repeat the same BS information. I STRONGLY suspect this false view is the product of Large Lumber Manufacturers, who want maximum recovery and highest profits without having to mess with the involved process of TRUE Rift sawing. It's a case of so-called Experts spitting out falsehoods to please these Large Budget ADVERTISERS. Simply untrue. Pisses me off.
Note in pic below (courtesy of Bart Moyers) that when lumber is plain sawn, the first board or two from center of log are "accidentally" Quartersawn! Savvy mill operators pull these to stack in their "Premium Lumber" pile to sell at higher prices. Softwoods such as Fir, Spruce, Pine, etc. are not regularly quartersawn except for specialty markets. Fortunately many mills don't take the time to separate out quartersawn softwood. SO, if one is looking for quartersawn at their local lumber yard, forget checking faces to find straight grain, instead, sight the boards from the ends. You'll likely see boards with grain running near perpendicular from top to bottom of some boards, and THOSE are the ones which will be strongest for springboards...., and will cost no more than the more run of the mill stuff.
Metals406
Granfodder Runningsaw
What is said and shown in the video was mostly right...
He shows one so-called "Modern" method of quartersawing. Note first pic below from the Stephan Woodworking site. Both the vid dude (at about 5:30) AND the pic below are WRONG in identifying "Rift sawn" lumber...
Traditional Plain (aka "Flat"), Quarter and (REAL) Rift sawn, courtesy of Advantage Lumber:
Real Rift sawn is the most time consuming and most wasteful method of milling (see graphic above), produces the most dimensionally stable and strongest product (when used flat, as in springboards, as the grain of each board is perpendicular ("on edge") throughout) and also results in the most expensive product. Quartersawn is a close second in strength, stability and cost.
I've purchased loads of finish lumber and custom milling through the years, and of late there seems some oft repeated misinformation being regurgitated as fact... For some reason, several years back I began to notice some "talking heads" describing Rift as having grain angle further away from 90* than Quartersawn. Bunk! Nowadays, it seems most popular "experts" AND many lumber sources repeat the same BS information. I STRONGLY suspect this false view is the product of Large Lumber Manufacturers, who want maximum recovery and highest profits without having to mess with the involved process of TRUE Rift sawing. It's a case of so-called Experts spitting out falsehoods to please these Large Budget ADVERTISERS. Simply untrue. Pisses me off.
Note in pic below (courtesy of Bart Moyers) that when lumber is plain sawn, the first board or two from center of log are "accidentally" Quartersawn! Savvy mill operators pull these to stack in their "Premium Lumber" pile to sell at higher prices. Softwoods such as Fir, Spruce, Pine, etc. are not regularly quartersawn except for specialty markets. Fortunately many mills don't take the time to separate out quartersawn softwood. SO, if one is looking for quartersawn at their local lumber yard, forget checking faces to find straight grain, instead, sight the boards from the ends. You'll likely see boards with grain running near perpendicular from top to bottom of some boards, and THOSE are the ones which will be strongest for springboards...., and will cost no more than the more run of the mill stuff.
You are correct. . . The changes in milling verbiage comes from modern 3rd growth timber now in the dimensional market. It's much smaller in diameter than what was available in the past -- so there's been a shift to less waste. The same shift has come over the years for what is classified as actual and nominal definitions in lumber. A far cry difference from today, back to 100 years ago. 1/4, 2/4, 3/4, 4/4, 5/4, etc -- all meant something in reference to actual board dimension.
The modern "quartersawn" method will produce a good product, based on where in the log the board was cut. Also evident in my description of Brian's board a few pages back, as well as your description of "accidental 1/4 sawn". In the end, it's the responsibility of the contractor or end-user to be able to look at a board and somewhat quickly ascertain where in a log a board was milled.
You can cull your way through a pile (in some places) and take exactly what you need from it based on how it was milled. sometimes they tell you to bugger off.
Heart check and end-check are considerations, along with cup, warp, wane, timber-bind, etc. some lumber should never be left plain (flat) sawn with the heart running the length of the board, when two smaller, yet higher quality boards could be cut from the sides.
When trees averaged 3' in diameter, more logs could be sawn from each side, and you might find heartwood only on an edge. Today, you will find that it's almost always centered on a board.
Rift-sawn is the bees knees -- but super rare these days -- really only a specialty cut. As you stated, the terms have less to do with what grain orientation you might get in a couple boards, but more about the way it was milled.
There's definitely something to be said for having access to, or being able to mill your own stuff. That way, you know what you want, you know what you get, and there is no hunting and pecking for it.
Metals406
Granfodder Runningsaw
Sounds good to me! If you're 3" thick, that's where you might study old pictures for a taper. I'm seeing some now, where it was actually a compound taper. I'm sure it was done for weight reduction, but also could add to strenght.
Meaning, not only was it tapered to the tail, but also radiused along the underside on the boards width. I would think that would be super strong, as you've now created two intersecting arches (way strong!).
Nate, tried the boards today. I need to move the shoe back, so their is wood under the shoe. I found some 30"+ DF but it has been dead awhile. How long should it last before you wouldn't use it? I bored a few of them and it was a mixture of dust and chips.
Metals406
Granfodder Runningsaw
Good to know! You're certainly the guinea pig as far as I'm concerned. I've never mounted one before.
That fir sounds sketchy, and pithy. You could rough out a 2' board on the end and inspect the grain. It may be that it's just the live-edge and 2" inside that is getting bad, and the rest could be sound?
You could also call Pyramid in Seeley and pick someones brain -- they may have some rough cut you could grab right off the head saw (not sure if they have a scrag there?) -- and the drive wouldn't be so bad for ya. Or you might find a small mill closer to ya?
Really, for bigger fir, the closer you get to the Swan, the better your chances of snagging one. I reckon Pondy might actually make a decent board as well -- you and I both know how stringy that crap is when ya try and split it.
Springboard revision #1 View attachment 298608
How is this for some tight grained 1/4 saw Doug Fir?:hmm3grin2orange: View attachment 298609
I bet you can't cut any of that on the coast.:msp_wink:
How is this for some tight grained 1/4 saw Doug Fir?:hmm3grin2orange: View attachment 298609
I bet you can't cut any of that on the coast.:msp_wink:
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jrcat
Guest
Cfaller your attachments are invalid
Metals406
Granfodder Runningsaw
That's some good looking fir! If a guy has to have some heart in it, better to have it on one edge like ya got too.
Now to hand shape it eh? :msp_wink:
Now to hand shape it eh? :msp_wink:
