Huztl / Farmertec ms 440

[Ozhoo]

I wouldn't run it anymore until you figure it out Tim. What you're describing is classic air leak symptoms.

With hard to find leaks, I pull 7psi vacuum and start rotating/twisting/pushing/flexing everything. If that fails to find it, I pressurize to 7psi and lower the saw into a 5 gallon bucket of water.

 

[TimTaylor]

I pressure tested every thing again, all good, most of my saws started out as someone else's basket case, and I have a couple of 048s that I have managed to get reliable so its not my first rodeo, but I will fess up and say I haven't used the bucket of water trick yet. But this is exactly what my neighbors 064 was doing and the new ft carb fixed it........think I might just get a new carb with that 25" bar....can always use the spares.....might do the pressure test yet again in the water though, just in case.Thank you for your experience and advice

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[jd548esco72]

on my china 372 build the first carb i used was a bit screwy , sounded a bit like your 440-- i had a coiple spares --the next one fixed the problem.

these china made carbs are a bit of a grab bag.

 

[TimTaylor]

Well the carb arrived. And it didn't look like the original one. It does look more like the pictures of a Stihl carb. I wonder if they have been updated or did I get the wrong carb originally?
No biggie because with this new carb it fired on the first pull and idles like a real saw. Plus I have a couple of 25" bars and chains from farmertec to try out. Fire wood time!

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[TimTaylor]

Two more tanks and both times it ran lean before the tank was three quarters empty. So I pulled the fuel line and checked it. changed the filter for a smaller heavier one and put the fuel line in back to front because the filter seems to sit in the bottom of the tank better. Ran two more tanks through it cutting big dry fallen timber and it ran the tank dry. I have it very rich at the moment and it loads down when it's idling but it's good. So light.

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[Bedford T]

Two more tanks and both times it ran lean before the tank was three quarters empty. So I pulled the fuel line and checked it. changed the filter for a smaller heavier one and put the fuel line in back to front because the filter seems to sit in the bottom of the tank better. Ran two more tanks through it cutting big dry fallen timber and it ran the tank dry. I have it very rich at the moment and it loads down when it's idling but it's good. So light.

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We know generally that the 660 gets lean as the tank runs low on fuel, I refill at just under a half.

I have yet taken time but will, to look at a setup like the br600 has in tank with two filters.

Changing the filters parts could cause you trouble. Maybe at least consider it could in the filter element is too small and if you are using an ester based oil it might be to thick.

 

[TimTaylor]

We know generally that the 660 gets lean as the tank runs low on fuel, I refill at just under a half.

I have yet taken time but will, to look at a setup like the br600 has in tank with two filters.

Changing the filters parts could cause you trouble. Maybe at least consider it could in the filter element is too small and if you are using an ester based oil it might be to thick.

The saw leaned out when it was on one side on half a tank and ran rich on the other side, like it had a bad seal on one side of the tank, but I knew that wasn't the case. But when I looked in the tank I could see that the filter was staying halfway up the tank on one side, and not following the fuel. Plus the filter was so big it was half out of the fuel whenever the fuel level was much below full. So I found a genuine Stihl 660 filter, which is half the size and much heavier so it should follow the fuel and I figure even a big bore 440 should still get enough fuel through a filter designed for a bigger saw. Then I pulled the fuel line and turned it around so that the bends in it tend to hold the filter horizontal at the bottom of the tank, hopefully where the fuel is. And it seems at this stage to work....Maybe when I build the 660 the same mods might help there too?

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[TimTaylor]

It should read "like it had a bad seal on one side of the crank"

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[Bedford T]

You learn a lot working with the kits. Views and perspectives most never get.

 

[TimTaylor]

Yes it's been fun and if I get a firewood saw that I can use and get a grin from then that is almost a bonus.

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[TimTaylor]

Well it's a good thing I have a few saws that always go when I need them, because now it seems that the flywheel side bearing has collapsed. Was cutting through a series of foot thick branches, not full throttle , sharp chain, not leaning, not even full revs, and it stopped like it had seized. Or picked up the bore, which is what I thought had happened. Pulled the muffler and the piston looked mint. Pulled the barrel and there are bits of ball bearing in there. No real damage that I can see so far but I'm a bit worried about the case's because the cage is jammed between the crank and the case bottom. Think that's what stopped it.

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[TimTaylor]

It's actually getting quite funny. In a way. Maybe the raw fuel and the paint off the piston from the last escapade damaged the bearing? Maybe it was a dud? Maybe I harmed it in some way putting the case's together but that has never happened to me before, I'm pretty careful. So the question is, will I get to the stage of having a copy saw that is useable on a day to day basis? It seems not. But I'm building a Husqvana 2100cd from old bits and there is a big old Jonsered in parts under the bench, and I still might have a go at a 660 copy, but maybe with a damaged old doner to build on

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[Bedford T]

Photos when possible please

 

[TimTaylor]

Will do. I'll split the cases tomorrow hopefully

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[TimTaylor]

Not really much to see. Except that you can see it's been running rich and the piston has no scores or damage from running lean etc.But the oil in the case is black like diesel oil and the other side bearing and the big end bearing have obviously been chewing on whatever metal came out of the failed bearing. So the big end bearing and rod look toast, have to assume the crank is also toast, plus the bearings obviously. Little end and piston and jug look great. Cases look ok. So... better and worse than I hoped. Other things to play with today so it can wait till the bench is clean and I've decided what to do. There is a road kill 440 locally that I'm going to bid on, I might just put the tank and plastics etc from this on it if I get it.

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[TimTaylor]

I will pull it down and photograph the damage no matter what I do. Apologies for the dirty engine I would normally clean things first but in this case I didn't see the point.

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[tbohn]

Not really much to see. Except that you can see it's been running rich and the piston has no scores or damage from running lean etc.But the oil in the case is black like diesel oil and the other side bearing and the big end bearing have obviously been chewing on whatever metal came out of the failed bearing. So the big end bearing and rod look toast, have to assume the crank is also toast, plus the bearings obviously. Little end and piston and jug look great. Cases look ok. So... better and worse than I hoped. Other things to play with today so it can wait till the bench is clean and I've decided what to do. There is a road kill 440 locally that I'm going to bid on, I might just put the tank and plastics etc from this on it if I get it.

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It looks like your piston is in backwards. The arrow should point towards the exhaust.

 

[TimTaylor]

Good spotting, but I took the piston off the con rod to look at it and just slipped out back on to keep it all together. And got it backwards. Won't be running it like that. Can't run it with that con rod or crank again anyway

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[TimTaylor]

But actually, looking again, the clean part of the piston should be the intake side and its not ,so maybe I did have the piston in backwards. That would be a duh moment but I can't see how that could be related to the crank bearing....?

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[tbohn]

But actually, looking again, the clean part of the piston should be the intake side and its not ,so maybe I did have the piston in backwards. That would be a duh moment but I can't see how that could be related to the crank bearing....?

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Agreed. Shouldn't impact the bearing. Any signs the rings snagged on the exhaust port? This is the first I've seen a bearing failure reported on the Huztl kits.