I don't know what to think about this.
http://www.npr.org/sections/13.7/2016/09/23/494989594/a-web-of-trees-and-their-hidden-lives
http://www.npr.org/sections/13.7/2016/09/23/494989594/a-web-of-trees-and-their-hidden-lives
Improving The Public Image Of Loggers and FORESTRY
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I don't either but as we most would agree there is a whole lot more to learn about living things than is known now. That said my initial reaction is:
To the extent it was meant to address wood quality, as you know better than me, there is a balance that must be struck practically and economically involving a multiplicity of factors.
To the extent it used to fuel the adoption of the view that it is wrong to harvest sustainable complex and/or "social" living things, it hastens the possibility that practitioners of that view may face extinction through starvation or exposure; a very sad thought.
As it relates to this thread, it poses another aspect that the profession may need to be prepared to address.
Ron
PS To avoid unnecessary misinterpretation of my third paragraph, let me state that I classify humans as living beings not as living things.
To the extent it was meant to address wood quality, as you know better than me, there is a balance that must be struck practically and economically involving a multiplicity of factors.
To the extent it used to fuel the adoption of the view that it is wrong to harvest sustainable complex and/or "social" living things, it hastens the possibility that practitioners of that view may face extinction through starvation or exposure; a very sad thought.
As it relates to this thread, it poses another aspect that the profession may need to be prepared to address.
Ron
PS To avoid unnecessary misinterpretation of my third paragraph, let me state that I classify humans as living beings not as living things.
plants, animals, microbes all living things
nothing living in this world can survive off minerals alone.
farmers cut wheat, millers make flour, bakers make bread, in this case grass dies by the billions anually, but people eat so its ok
loggers cut trees, sawyers make boards, carpenters make houses, trees die by the millions, but we are sheltered from the rain wind and cold so its ok too
nothing living in this world can survive off minerals alone.
farmers cut wheat, millers make flour, bakers make bread, in this case grass dies by the billions anually, but people eat so its ok
loggers cut trees, sawyers make boards, carpenters make houses, trees die by the millions, but we are sheltered from the rain wind and cold so its ok too
earache
ArboristSite Operative
Log A Load is still very active. It is a great program where the logging contractor, sometimes landowner, donates a "load" or more of wood cut and delivered to the mill, and gives the proceeds to Muscular Distrophy Association. Often it is coordinated on a public sale(state, county, or school forest land). The local school buses classes out to see a live logging demo, with breakouts usually including portable sawmill, forester, biologist, ecologist. Its a great program.
I host students from various schools on my jobsites up to four times a year. I also take my equipment to schools to show them a static display in hopes it will spark enough interest to get folks to come and see a live logging site.
I put out signs roadside as advertising and so passer-bys can see that the contractor is an industry professional like any other contractor that displays his work and signage. I require hi-vis on my jobsites, hazard lights and cones when trucks are loading roadside, and ALWAYS cleaning up any time on a public road, trail, etc.
I know that some contractors frown on my practices and think I'm a "goody two shoe", but I'm hoping some of it rubs off...I know I NEVER look for work.
bitzer
******** Timber Expert
Knowing you Derrick it doesn't surprise me that you pay attention to the details. That's good to have a good name for yourself among the he people selling the wood. The competition will always be the competition. Good to put in time for the kids too.
Has it been wet up there this year? Wettest year I can remember. Im cutting in Kenosha county right on the state line now. Must be the only corner of the state that had a drought. Every where else it rained at least twice a week.
Has it been wet up there this year? Wettest year I can remember. Im cutting in Kenosha county right on the state line now. Must be the only corner of the state that had a drought. Every where else it rained at least twice a week.
earache
ArboristSite Operative
Its not wet where its sandy...I'm busy.
Honestly I believe that the way to win folks over to "forest management" is to get them out into the field with qualified professionals who care about the land and can explain what it is that they do. biggest problems with that are A) getting the cityfolk to go outside and B) getting organizations to invite those cityfolk onto their land. We're at loggerheads here and we're sort of all on the same team, if only there was a way to talk.
It's like herding cats. I've been on many a "field trip". I've always felt a need to get the people off the road and down into a unit, but that was not possible because they don't wear the right clothing and footwear and they don't want to get off the road. Maybe we need to post a table with beer and goodies down in a unit.
I heard some terrible news last night. The former head of The Gifford Pinchot Task Force got herself hired as a district ranger for the USFS on the Gifford Pincho NF. She's the one who on those field trips, would say she wanted the forest restored but could not come up with a definition of restored. I do believe that after it was "restored" her plan was to keep people out. That is all ready the case because roads are not being repaired as they wash out.
I've been on quite a few field trips with various groups. Here's something you will understand, think of herding cats. They do not show up on time and by the time we would leave the office, we'd be an hour or so behind schedule. You cannot meet before 10AM here because it takes a minimum of 2 hours for city people to get here, and they need their sleep. We would end up standing on a road. I'd try to get folks off the road and down where they could see more of a unit, but they do not show up in field going gear and do not want to walk in slash or brush. Maybe a portable bar set up down in the brush would be an incentive. I also wanted them to see active operations, but once again, by the time we would get out, things would be shut down. Logger hours are the opposite of enviro hours.
Speaking of enviros, I heard last night that our local National Forest hired the former head of the Gifford Pinchot Task Force as a district ranger. She is one who went of field trips and would say that her vision for the forest was restoration. She could not define that or what happens after "restoration". However, I think the plan is working because as our forest roads wash out, very few get repaired so people are not able to access a major portion of the woods.
Oh, the GP task force is an environmental group that appeals and threatens to sue the FS when timber sales get beyond a light thinning.
Oh, in all fairness, I will say that it is hard to get quite a few Forest Service people to show up on time and get off the road too.
I'm no friend of the clock, myself. Still, stuff needs to get done, so...
newforest
ArboristSite Operative
"Restoration Ecology" is perhaps another topic for another thread. I have had the unfortunate pleasure of working on many "Restoration" projects and many of them are fuzzy thinking at best, in my not humble opinion. There is a theme behind it all that land conditions before Evil Man came along are automatically best, completely ignoring what 25 Million Natives did with land before Columbus showed up with some European diseases and reduced them to only 1 Million in population. But the USFS is chock full of "-ologists" these days and Timber is not usually on the minds of "-ologists" until they need certain Timber conditions to make their particular "-ology" happy.
The one thing Restoration Ecologists seem to completely reject is the idea that Ecosystems are dynamic and they move on into Change sometimes regardless of what Man does. Restoration always seems to try and force a dynamic system back in to a static condition of the past, that is sometimes no longer even achievable.
The one thing Restoration Ecologists seem to completely reject is the idea that Ecosystems are dynamic and they move on into Change sometimes regardless of what Man does. Restoration always seems to try and force a dynamic system back in to a static condition of the past, that is sometimes no longer even achievable.
Some restoration work is good, like fixing streams that some yahoo covered over and diverted through 2 miles of culvert, fixing that is a good thing, planting a pile of native plants etc reshaping the land to make it look more like a natural stream then a canal all good.
Restoring a forest en mass, seems like a fight yer bound to loose. Its just too big and there just isn't going to be that kind of money to recreate a forest that truly never existed outside of a text book, unless you have the odd half a millennium to wast.
Restoring a forest en mass, seems like a fight yer bound to loose. Its just too big and there just isn't going to be that kind of money to recreate a forest that truly never existed outside of a text book, unless you have the odd half a millennium to wast.
This is a topic near and dear to my heart, and I agree with you 100%. Perhaps you should start this thread.
This is not good. http://www.lewiscountysirens.com/?p=38585&print=1
Friend of a friend. Driver is OK but oddly the owner of the logging outfit is under some scrutiny. Seems odd to me since the owner wasn't driving.
If the truck wasn't mechanically sound, as in brakes, tires, etc. the investigators usually hold the owner responsible to some extent. I don't know if this was the case but I've seen it happen.
Also, if the driver was in violation of his HOS the owner can be held accountable. Again, not saying that this happened.... it's just information.
When the insurance companies and the lawyers get involved everybody gets their feet held to the fire.
From what I hear, this was simply a matter of driving too fast for the conditions. An honest mistake.
The road project is marked, well in advance, with required warning signs. Add to that fact that the paving and striping has been ongoing, I'd say it was a stupid "mistake". But neither of us were there. Highway 12 is a crazy one to drive on. Maybe we need dashboard shrines to deities? Call me paranoid but I'm in the habit of checking behind me and having an escape route when stopped on a highway. Too many distracted drivers out there now.
I got my info from a friend who is also a log truck driver and who passed the scene, with a load on, as it was being cleaned up, and who called in for details. I trust his judgment. He's quick to criticize stupidity and quick to forgive honest errors. Obviously I wan't there but I consider this a solid opinion.
