In a bad storm, who you gonna' call?

[spike60]

Can't resist stiring the pot a bit here...............

I've been reading the couple of threads concerning that nasty storm up in the northwest and it got me to thinking. When something like that happens, and people need saws, generators, and snowblowers, who's REALLY there to help them? Internet sellers, the box stores, or dealers? The online guys are obviously nowhere to be found. The box stores might be able to sell a bunch of new equipment, but what about all of the stuff that they have sold in the past? What can they do to help those people? Answer: NOTHING!

The reality is that only dealers can step up and fill the void in these emergencies. Parts, chains, oil, etc. And all of the equipment that has been sitting and won't start. Only dealers can solve these problems, and help people dig out and clean up. We have been in this situation a few times ourselves, and have put in the extra hours necessary to help folks. As corny as it sounds, a dealer has some civic responsibility in times like this, not unlike the police, fireman, and utility and highway crews.

In would be nice if people would consider who is going to be there for them in emergencies when purchasing equipment.

So hat's off to guys like Andy, who in addition to putting in the time at his shop, also found time to help cut out some of his neighbors.

But by far the best part of the threads is the genuine concern of AS members from all over, for those of you in the storm area. It was real, and you could feel it. It's a bit like a family, isn't it?

My own wish to you guys up there, is to stay warm and most of all, stay safe. Don't try to clean up the whole mess at once; put the saws down and get some rest now and then. Accidents happen when your tired.

Last note: The storm is on the news as I write this, they just showed a guy cutting with a McCulloch. I'll bet all kinds of saws are coming out to play.

Good luck folks!

 

[STIHL-KID]

NW Residents Unite!

I thought it was great how many AS members got together and checked on the guys who were NW residents concerning the recent wind storm. I was glad that everyone was ok and no one had severe damage to their homes/property.

It still amazes me how many folks in the Northwest (who live out in the sticks) were not prepared for the storm. Some folks seem to only have a simple buck saw and hatchet in the garage, but live 15 miles from the nearest town. I think it's great how some people out there with good chainsaws helped out their neighbors.

As I stated on a different post, it's interesting how many jumped at the opportunity to help with down trees and general storm cleanup. Some people came out with a simple saw and truck to help, while others marketed their professional tree services locally. It's all about helping others

 

[adkranger]

It is nice to see neighbors helping neighbors in situations like this. It is not FEMA or like agencies that are in a position help people immediately after a major event like this, it's your family, friends and neighbors.(and people like Lake, Rob, Jeff, Gas and other AS'ers )

Spike you are exactly right 'bout local dealerships which is why that's who I use for my power tool needs. It's nice that you guys feel civil responsibility to balance your likely sales boom from an incident like that. Afterall you guys are a part of the community. It all works out. But it still means long hours for everyone........... Maybe a little less with a brand new Stihl and a sharp chain.:greenchainsaw:

Good luck and godspeed to our Northwestern brothers and sisters out there.

 

[vapnut257]

Can't resist stiring the pot a bit here...............

I've been reading the couple of threads concerning that nasty storm up in the northwest and it got me to thinking. When something like that happens, and people need saws, generators, and snowblowers, who's REALLY there to help them? Internet sellers, the box stores, or dealers? The online guys are obviously nowhere to be found. The box stores might be able to sell a bunch of new equipment, but what about all of the stuff that they have sold in the past? What can they do to help those people? Answer: NOTHING!

Well I have to disagree with you on this one. I got my Husky 359 after hurricane Isabel left my area devastated. The local Sthil and Husky dealers quickly sold their small stock of saws if they were even open at all. Most were not because of no power. FEMA... that worthless government agency bought all the available generators and chainsaws and locked them away in transfer trucks. They were only to be made available to the paid "public service" people only if they requested them. Sthil... which has a factory just down the road from me refused to increase production to meet the soaring demand in our devastated area. As most know, you can only buy a sthil from a dealer. My neighbors had trees down on top of their homes and the only recourse was to rely on storm chasers with their inflated prices to remove the trees. Three weeks later I bought the first saw available from none other than my local Lowe's "big box" store. They were the only ones that could fulfill my needs albeit at an inflated price.

As corny as it sounds, a dealer has some civic responsibility in times like this, not unlike the police, fireman, and utility and highway crews.

I agree... that is a corny statement to make given that the police, firemen, utility and highway crews where I live are all well paid professionals. Not one was allowed on the streets until the storm had subsided and they were all paid overtime. I have nothing against these people, but they were just doing what they get paid to do. And nothing on private property. In closing, the civic responsibility you speak about lies within us all to help one another as neighbors... not the government, it's agencies (FEMA) or it's well paid employees.

 

[adkranger]

I agree... that is a corny statement to make given that the police, firemen, utility and highway crews where I live are all well paid professionals. Not one was allowed on the streets until the storm had subsided and they were all paid overtime. I have nothing against these people, but they were just doing what they get paid to do. And nothing on private property. In closing, the civic responsibility you speak about lies within us all to help one another as neighbors... not the government, it's agencies (FEMA) or it's well paid employees.

What good can be done to have firemen, police and DPW crews out driving the streets, risking their lives during a hurricane, microburst, tornado or similar catastraphic event? If the rescuer is injured or killed prior to the need for service what good can he/she do for the victims needing assistance? Usually, first responders are put in-service in a standby mode for a major incident. Yes, this means if they are professionals that they are in work status and thus they get paid for the inconveinence. Don't you think they'd rather be home protecting, sheltering their own family in a crisis? Just something to think about.... Not trying to start an argument, just shed some light on this particular part of your post.

As to FEMA, that is a hugely abused agency of late and few even understand it's intended mission. They were never tasked with, nor intended to be first responders to a major incident. That is for local services, fire, police & municipal. Not defending them per se, just explaining their functions. And you are 100% correct, we should all take care of our own in an emergency; self, family & community. The big agencies are supposed to be there for the aftermath, cleanup, rebuild and such. I understand your frustration with supplies and assistance, that's natural and probably not unfounded. When we had our big ice storm you could not touch a new chainsaw for almost two hundred miles. They were just gone, out of stock. Most sold out for list price, though there is always gouging somewhere. Pitiful. The big boxes have the distribution networks to get the product in faster for the most part. During our ice storm the state actually arranged contracts to get things like generators and chainsaws direct from the manufacters to the stricken areas. Of course that takes time....

 

[stihl025]

I am glad to hear that our fellow friends in the Pacific Northwest were all okay. As a volunteer firefighter for the past 15 years (16 in December), the two thing that we rely on in our small town when disaster strikes are friends helping friends, and neighbors helping neighbors. Here where I live, we are not a large department in a large town. Our budgets our low, our resources are sometimes limited. Our hours are long and our pay is low. We rely on the support of the community, whether it be in the way of people dropping off bottled water and coffee to us on scene or prepared food left at the station for when we return home.

Looking at the situation there on the west coast, I have one suggestion that I can offer to those here at AS. Firemen, utility workers, and public works are working around the clock trying to clear downed trees, power lines, debris, etc. Their saws take a literal beating, I know ours do. The saws are running hard, running long, and the junk that we are clearing is not always "clean". If you really want to help out, offer your expertise and services to us. If you have a chain grinder, offer to sharpen all of the chains. Inspect the saws for us. Help identify anything that could possibly prevent us from finishing our task. It is the small things that make a huge difference in a terrible situation, and it doesn't always have to come from dealers. Individuals with the knowledge and tools are just as useful to us. Don't be afraid to offer your knowledge. As prepared as we want to be for something like that, we specialize in firefighting, not tree work. Our equipment is maintained to the best of our knowledge, but sometimes we need that outside help...

Just some food for thought.

 

[SRT-Tech]

Can't resist stiring the pot a bit here...............

I've been reading the couple of threads concerning that nasty storm up in the northwest and it got me to thinking. When something like that happens, and people need saws, generators, and snowblowers, who's REALLY there to help them? Answer: NOTHING!

ouy, isn't it?



Good luck folks!

people like me, who take a perverse delight in storing away 55 gallon drums of food, fuel, oil, water (got 1000 liters) , spare parts etc... THATS WHO! :biggrinbounce2: :biggrinbounce2: :biggrinbounce2:

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in other words YOU have to be self suffiecent, BEFORE the proverbial waste hits the fan.

 

[spike60]

Vapnut257;

Sorry that your dealers dropped the ball down there, but I think that the only thing that we really disagree on is that I maintain that the box stores are impotent in a crisis. I'm sure I have more saws in stock at any time than the local Slowes and Home Cheapo combined. I think that the only advantage they may have is the ability to transfer product in from stores outside the storm area.

It wouldn't take me 3 weeks to get some saws. We had a blizzard a few years back and sold out of blowers. Rented a truck and went upstate to get some more. (it was a coastal storm) Didn't last long since my partner had them sold before I even got back. Stayed there til 11:00 putting them together.

We were open for 2 days without power after hurricane Floyd. Did what we could.

You need to realize 2 things. First, it's more than sales of new products. It's also parts and service, and only dealers are in a position to provide that. In a major storm, everything that even looks like a saw is going to come out and half of them probably won't start. Lowes isn't going to help those people. Second, that parts and service capeability is all the more important after a major storm, because as you found out, supplies of new saws are very quickly exhausted.

You are certainly right that saws and generators locked up in trucks aren't of much help to anyone. That's almost a sin.

Your best line is your last, about neighbors helping neighbors, and that was the spirit I meant when I posted about a dealers' civic responsibility. And we certainly don't get paid overtime! Good point also about municipal guys being no help on private property. We do have to rely on each other, not the Govt. Although I do think that our local volunteer fireguys would help individual people, as they are always doing things like pumping out basements and such.

 

[SRT-Tech]

As I stated on a different post, it's interesting how many jumped at the opportunity to help with down trees and general storm cleanup. Some people came out with a simple saw and truck to help, while others marketed their professional tree services locally. It's all about helping others

I was there, clearing roads and driveways, HOWEVER the municipalities take a very dim view of people helping out, even companies.....I got yelled at by a parks crew for clearing a lousy 8" tree frrm a road...apparently i was taking away union jobs....I told them, look, you guys have over 500 trees to clear from the HWY 1 causeway, a major route......im here clearing a little tree so that Fire Truck there can respond to their calls...im hardly taking away any work for you...

made me frikking sick the attitudes of the union city workers. :bang:

 

[spike60]

I was there, clearing roads and driveways, HOWEVER the municipalities take a very dim view of people helping out, even companies.....I got yelled at by a parks crew for clearing a lousy 8" tree frrm a road...apparently i was taking away union jobs....I told them, look, you guys have over 500 trees to clear from the HWY 1 causeway, a major route......im here clearing a little tree so that Fire Truck there can respond to their calls...im hardly taking away any work for you...

made me frikking sick the attitudes of the union city workers. :bang:

I guess if the public helps out, it cuts into their overtime. What a bunch of jerks! I'm sure that wouldn't happen in my town. They'd be glad for the help.

 

[adkranger]

Good post Stihl025. All assistance rendered goes a long way to making the response go smoother. More people helped faster. During our ice storm in '98 there was a logging crew that followed us with their utility rig. It was like a rolling saw maintenance shop. They would grind and make chains, clean saws, debur and gap close bars, basically anything to keep the clearing crews working efficiently. They never asked for compensation or recognition, but they did eat really well at any local firehouse.

Spike you are right on point again. With this same ice storm mentioned above, even though the saw shops were completely out of stock they were still a valuable resource with parts, chains and bars. I can personally remember going into one with an order for twenty chain loops ASAP and leaving him with nothing but a promise to settle up later. No questions asked, because he knew we were assisting his community, possibly his family. This response went on for weeks, not a typical ice storm. But he, and several others made out well in the end because the state arranged contracts for saws, generators and the like went through many of these local dealers. On of these guys I still use to this day for all my personal and work business.

 

[adkranger]

I guess if the public helps out, it cuts into their overtime. What a bunch of jerks! I'm sure that wouldn't happen in my town. They'd be glad for the help.

Not in my area either. My town has five employees in the hwy dept that takes care of everything in the town. Only other town employees are desk jockys. Of course everyone owns a saw 'round here so help is not far off or hard coming.:hmm3grin2orange:

 

[oldsaw]

We had an ice storm about 4 years ago in Kansas City. 6 inches of ice. My boss prides himself on his "connections"...an Italian thing I guess. After the storm he had some pretty good tree damage in his yard. I offered to help, but he said he would call his "buddy", and get him there that week. Turns out his "buddy" was booked for 6 weeks, funny, that was the number I told him. The Super XL got a really good workout that week. Between him, and 4 other people, we cut some branches and stacked some wood. I had my son help, was good for him. Plenty of exercise.

Yep, that was before the "multi-saw days"...at one point, I only had one saw...hard to believe, I know, but it happens to all of us.

Mark

 

[Sprig]

Well I have to disagree with you on this one. I got my Husky 359 after hurricane Isabel left my area devastated. The local Sthil and Husky dealers quickly sold their small stock of saws if they were even open at all. Most were not because of no power. FEMA... that worthless government agency bought all the available generators and chainsaws and locked them away in transfer trucks. They were only to be made available to the paid "public service" people only if they requested them. Sthil... which has a factory just down the road from me refused to increase production to meet the soaring demand in our devastated area. As most know, you can only buy a sthil from a dealer. My neighbors had trees down on top of their homes and the only recourse was to rely on storm chasers with their inflated prices to remove the trees. Three weeks later I bought the first saw available from none other than my local Lowe's "big box" store. They were the only ones that could fulfill my needs albeit at an inflated price.



I agree... that is a corny statement to make given that the police, firemen, utility and highway crews where I live are all well paid professionals. Not one was allowed on the streets until the storm had subsided and they were all paid overtime. I have nothing against these people, but they were just doing what they get paid to do. And nothing on private property. In closing, the civic responsibility you speak about lies within us all to help one another as neighbors... not the government, it's agencies (FEMA) or it's well paid employees.

Don't know why you'd disagree, it is neighbors who'll be there first. Being this is our 3rd storm so far, the last being sortta anti-claimatic here (120km sustained winds recorded at Race Rocks just south of Victoria and a peak of 158KMH (!) recorded, cooooool stuff, just being a storm junkie lol ), I find myself being the guy peolpe run to. I have water, I have food, I have heat, and can twist a wrench if need be, all else is crap till the boys plow the road, get the ????e offa da roads,to get the crews in to get the power running. Lot to be said about self sufficiency, but even more about being prepared. I spent over 12 yrs on a mountain, not a big one mindja, but enough of a difference where having good relations with your next door neighbours was really important. Same goes for everywhere though, pretty much no matter where you are, ???? happens, natural disasters from A-Z, and when things go sideways whatcha gonna do? Let your neighbors starve? Let 'em freeze? Drive by them evunnnn....
Nope, ain't happening here.

My 0,02$ worth fer da evening.

to one and all, where-ever you are, to your families and friends, the most best of holiday season to you all!



Serge

 

[STIHL-KID]

Checked out some storm damage yesterday evening....

Yesterday evening I drove around my town to see the extent of the wind damage. While driving past a local cemetary, I noticed five or six large pine trees that had toppled over within the graveyard. Some headstones were smashed/crushed by trees. The local city workers had put cones around the downed trees next to roadways and around the trees that were down in the local wooded parks. I'm not sure if the city or parks department would let any "average Joe" haul away the logs without dispute? Last year I visited a State Park nearby and asked if I could help clear trails that were blocked by down trees. The park ranger immediately said, "Thanks for your offer, but we can take care of the park with the equipment we have". I suppose that they viewed me as a risk if I were to injure myself in the State Park. Legalities, etc, etc....... I'm just the type of guy who doesn't mind spending my own time to help out and preserve the parks. Afterall, these are the places that me and my family enjoy visiting.......why not chip-in and help keep it nice.

 

[spike60]

I think that the larger the municipality, the less likely the guys are going to be willing to accept help from Joe Citizen. And liability is probably the main reason. They really have no way of knowing if you know what you are doing, or if you've had a few beers, or whatever. In small towns like ours, where most people know each other, they are willing to accept some help.

But in a park, they may feel that the trees belong to the town/city, (in other words, the city guys take the wood home). Around here, the towns leave the wood by the side of the road with the intention that local people will grab it. I've grabbed a couple of truckloads that way myself.

In the 2 towns that we primarily deal with, the workers are all local dudes, and grew up around saws, so they know what they are doing. I'll bet that in some of the bigger burgs, the workers aren't all that experienced with saws, and would be far better off letting AS members help as much as they can.

 

[turnkey4099]

BAck when I was dispatching for the county, me and another senior dispatcher suggested that a 'local resource' volunteers list be maintained with contacts of people willing, able and with the proper equipment, to help out in such emergency situations. My name would have been on the top of a list for anyone needing help with down trees. The suggestion went nowhere.

Harry K

 

[SRT-Tech]

I think that the larger the municipality, the less likely the guys are going to be willing to accept help from Joe Citizen. And liability is probably the main reason. They really have no way of knowing if you know what you are doing, or if you've had a few beers, or whatever. In small towns like ours, where most people know each other, they are willing to accept some help.

But in a park, they may feel that the trees belong to the town/city, (in other words, the city guys take the wood home). Around here, the towns leave the wood by the side of the road with the intention that local people will grab it. I've grabbed a couple of truckloads that way myself.

In the 2 towns that we primarily deal with, the workers are all local dudes, and grew up around saws, so they know what they are doing. I'll bet that in some of the bigger burgs, the workers aren't all that experienced with saws, and would be far better off letting AS members help as much as they can.

Good post, and very true.

In Vancouver that seems to be the attitude, no outside help (even though they figure it will take them OVER a year to clean Stanley Park up).

But i went to North Van today to buck up a big hemlock across a dead end street, and the NV district guys came by, drove up, nodded at me and drove off. I have a hunch its because I blocked off the area with cones and tape, was professional in appearance, and did'nt make a mess. I stacked all the limbs in a pile, stacked up the wood i could'nt carry in a pile, and marked any hazards with orange spray paint. They actually seemed happy that they did'nt have to work that location.

 

[Logger's Wife]

Hey SRT-Tech,

Actually, the District of North Vancouver DOES hire out to private companies. They actually hold contracts with a couple of companies. I know because my FIL held the district contracts for over 20 years until he gave them up to the business partner he split with who holds them now. Even I've spent a night dragging branches after a huge storm for them.

The reason the NV guys didn't give you a hard time is probably because they thought you were them. I wouldn't worry too much about the city's reaction to you helping out. I'd worry more about an exhausted crew of tree guys pulling up to a job they were called on to do and finding you there, wondering what you were doing with their job they were supposed to get paid for doing.

Good on you for wanting to help out though.

 

[SRT-Tech]

good to know Loggers Wife, i might put a bid in for the small stuff! anybody in particular that i should contact? (you can email or PM)

I actually ran across a crew (NV) today, on my way out...they saw the wood, asked where i cut and then said "ah good, less work for us, lets go to the bar boys!!!"