It's not the ethenol!!

[Ridgehiker]

not to derail this thread, but what is the main difference between summer and winter fuel mixtures? and when does the transition typically occur?

 

[sean donato]

In a nut shell it has to do with how quickly it vaporizes. Winter faster, sumer slower.
Here in PA the switch is usually in September. Summer gas will come back in May. As far as I understand it's fairly standard across most of the colder states.

 

[benz66]

I like the idea of meat prices going down.

One small problem overlooked: Cost of production. when grain and feed prices go down below cost of production, you lose producers. Same for meat. Some retire, the rest go bankrupt. Farming has had the lowest return on investment of any industry over the past 100 years, perhaps with a brief blip during WWII, more than offset by the depression.
No producers, means no food.

 

[bwalker]

One small problem overlooked: Cost of production. when grain and feed prices go down below cost of production, you lose producers. Same for meat. Some retire, the rest go bankrupt. Farming has had the lowest return on investment of any industry over the past 100 years, perhaps with a brief blip during WWII, more than offset by the depression.
No producers, means no food.

Or they just plant other crops.

 

[alanbaker]

Question for you farmers who use corn silage: I've heard that when you put green corn into a silo, it ferments and makes ethanol. So: Has anybody ever tried distilling the liquid slop that accumulates at the bottom of a silo? Also, do the livestock ever get drunk from the alcohol in the silage you feed them?

To make high quality corn silage, the dry matter at harvest should be about 35%, when the kernel is at black line. The percent dry matter can vary depending on what structure the silage is going in. The end product in good corn silage is lactic acid not ethanol. The faster the lactic acid is produced the sooner the silage is preserved. Harvesting at the correct moisture content, with proper length of cut, filling the silo or bunker quickly, compacting the silage and covering to exclude oxygen will produced good silage.
Often an inoculant is added to speed up the production of lactic acid. The goal is to lower the pH as quickly as possible to keep the silage from rotting.
As kids, we tried collecting the liquid oozing from the bottom of the silo to make alcohol. It didn't work. Probable too many other microbes in the juice that already were reproducing. We thought we going to make moonshine - crazy kids . . .

 

[Bill G]

Wheat, Beans, etc.

Beans are already the off year rotation for corn. In many locations there is no wheat market.

 

[HansFranz]

To make high quality corn silage, the dry matter at harvest should be about 35%, when the kernel is at black line. The percent dry matter can vary depending on what structure the silage is going in. The end product in good corn silage is lactic acid not ethanol. The faster the lactic acid is produced the sooner the silage is preserved. Harvesting at the correct moisture content, with proper length of cut, filling the silo or bunker quickly, compacting the silage and covering to exclude oxygen will produced good silage.
Often an inoculant is added to speed up the production of lactic acid. The goal is to lower the pH as quickly as possible to keep the silage from rotting.
As kids, we tried collecting the liquid oozing from the bottom of the silo to make alcohol. It didn't work. Probable too many other microbes in the juice that already were reproducing. We thought we going to make moonshine - crazy kids . . .

Thank you for your detailed answer. That's interesting stuff.

I've seen farmers who had these huge black plastic things (looked like piles of something, wrapped in black plastic sheeting) lying on the ground, maybe 10 or 15' high, 25' across and I guess 100' long or more. They looked like humongous caterpillars or something, and my hunch was that there was corn silage underneath the black plastic. Is that what those things are used for?

 

[bwalker]

Beans are already the off year rotation for corn. In many locations there is no wheat market.

In many areas they just plant corn every year and don't do the rotation.
Regardless, prior to ethanol being a thing farmers survived and they would continue to do so without it.

 

[smcowboy1974]

Problem with just planting corn and not rotating with soybeans is the beans produce nitrogen naturally, so less or no fertilizer has to be added to the soil.

 

[alanbaker]

Thank you for your detailed answer. That's interesting stuff.

I've seen farmers who had these huge black plastic things (looked like piles of something, wrapped in black plastic sheeting) lying on the ground, maybe 10 or 15' high, 25' across and I guess 100' long or more. They looked like humongous caterpillars or something, and my hunch was that there was corn silage underneath the black plastic. Is that what those things are used for?

If a farm runs out of silage storage structures and needs more storage, putting plastic bunker caps on the ground then silage on top and another plastic silage cap on top and sealing all the edges with sand or soil any thing that will keep the two pieces of plastic together is a quick and inexpensive red neck "silo". Some small farms will seal the edges then "vacuum" out the air, sort of like a seal meal. There are also silage baggers, long tubes "caterpillars" the that a machine blows packs silage into. As the tube fills the machine moves forward. They are usually white and maybe 6' tall 8-10' wide.

 

[bwalker]

Problem with just planting corn and not rotating with soybeans is the beans produce nitrogen naturally, so less or no fertilizer has to be added to the soil.

Well aware of that. Theybdont care and just pour the nitrogen to it.
When you are growing corn, even with a bean rotation the fertilizer use is considerable. Which is another thing that hurts ethanols carbon intensity.