It's not the ethenol!!

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well, it's from plant and animal matter (carbon-based life) compressed over millions of years, so there will be some dinosaurs in some deposits. remember Sinclair gasoline? :)
This is mostly accurate.
Stabil does help somewhat with preventing oxidation. It won't prevent loss of volatility.
Seafoam, marvel mystery oil and the like don't do a damn thing.
 
Steve is a nut, but he has a point.
Why is ethanol in there?
To add oxygen to the fuel. Cleaner emissions.
Gentlemen, we are running a 2 cycle engine. emissions really should be pretty low on the list of concerns.
Yeah, they put some odd stuff in the gasoline. I am pleased that some folks are having success with stabil
I run the expensive stuff from an airport, and have not had issues with carburetor diaphrams (yet).
"To add oxygen to the fuel. Cleaner emissions." Supposedly. After requiring the use of oxygenated fuels in the USA the EPA later dropped it, after little to no evidence that it actually reduced emissions. Refineries continued using ethanol as an as adjunct anyway since the distilleries were in place and the govt subsidies for corn based ethanol made it a cheaper fuel to produce in the end.
 
Actually, your info is at least 30 years out of date. When the first ethanol-from-corn plants were built, it did indeed take more energy to produce the ethanol that would be yielded by burning it. But the technology has improved. Today's ethanol plants produce roughly 5 times as much energy as they take to produce it. They also yield a protein-rich byproduct that is better for cattle feed than straight corn. Sugar cane ethanol produces even more energy. Cellulosic ethanol produces about 13 times as much energy as it takes to produce it. Farming technology has also improved, such that today's yield is so high that the available corn after ethanol production has actually increased dramatically. Ethanol may not be an ideal fuel for some engines, but we know how to design for it now. I hope to see more ethanol production from waste products, making it both renewable and a net reduction in waste. Petroleum has higher energy density but may not last forever, and it is definitely a dirtier fuel to burn. And I am not talking about CO2. I don't really care about carbon footprint, as human greenhouse gas emissions only account for about 0.28% of total greenhouses gasses in the atmosphere. But I do care about renewable energy sources and not sending money to middle east nations who want to kill us.
"Today's ethanol plants produce roughly 5 times as much energy as they take to produce it."

Not unless they are employing Nuclear Fusion in the process, and even then, the statement above violates the basic laws of thermodynamics. It ain't happening.
 
"To add oxygen to the fuel. Cleaner emissions." Supposedly. After requiring the use of oxygenated fuels in the USA the EPA later dropped it, after little to no evidence that it actually reduced emissions. Refineries continued using ethanol as an as adjunct anyway since the distilleries were in place and the govt subsidies for corn based ethanol made it a cheaper fuel to produce in the end.
The EPA requires ethanol be blended into the fuel via the RFS mandate.
Refineries would stop using it ASAP if they didn't have to. Including the refiner I work for who also owns ethanol plants.
 
Maybe he should have said "refine" instead of produce. It is possible get more energy out of a refinement process per unit than it take per unit to refine.
 
I always thought e10 or whatever amount was mandated in our fuel for consumer use was because corn grows every year and dinosaurs don’t.
We now or may have to decide do we fill our gas tank or our bellies with food-lol
Not being political in this comment
At this point, there is not really a battle of food vs fuel. Corn yield has increased so much that the net corn yield after ethanol production has increased dramatically. Moreover, only the starch portion of the corn kernel is converted to sugar and then to ethanol. The rest is used to make high-protein feed supplements, which are actually more nutritious than ground corn. We could actually develop biotechnology to make petroleum, by the way. An organism has been discovered which actually makes petroleum. It was found near oil wells and was able to make petroleum in a laboratory setting. The problem is that the natural organism did so very slowly. But microbiologists are very good at modifying organisms to make them do what they do much faster. But they need funding for that, and no one seems to want to fund such research.
 
And just so everyone is aware ... the brainwashing we've all received that petroleum is from "dead dinosaurs" is absolutely ludicrous.

Stop and think for a minute how many TRILLIONS of gallons have been pumped from the earth since that day the Rockerfellers struck gold in PA back in the 1800's. There is no logical way that stuff is from dinosaurs, lol. We'd have run out 95 years ago!
I am sure it was not all from dead dinosaurs. But they were around for more than 100 million years, amounting to trillions of tons of dead dinosaur mass, and we have been using petroleum for less than 200 years. I don't think we could have used all that up. In any case, we know that petroleum is still being made by natural microorganisms.
 
At this point, there is not really a battle of food vs fuel. Corn yield has increased so much that the net corn yield after ethanol production has increased dramatically. Moreover, only the starch portion of the corn kernel is converted to sugar and then to ethanol. The rest is used to make high-protein feed supplements, which are actually more nutritious than ground corn. We could actually develop biotechnology to make petroleum, by the way. An organism has been discovered which actually makes petroleum. It was found near oil wells and was able to make petroleum in a laboratory setting. The problem is that the natural organism did so very slowly. But microbiologists are very good at modifying organisms to make them do what they do much faster. But they need funding for that, and no one seems to want to fund such research.
great idea, let's bio engineer another organism and turn it loose on the world.
 
In the UK, we no longer have ethanol free pump fuel. I use alkylate in two stroke machines that I use infrequently. On my two year old chainsaw and brushcutter, I made my own mix. I use fresh fuel and run them dry before storage. or make sure they are used frequently.
 
I'm personally baffled by the scarcity of talk on making synthetic petroleum using sun and CO2. Wouldn't this be killing several birds with one stone?

It should get as much or more resources as fusion research. No matter what Exxon says
 
I'm personally baffled by the scarcity of talk on making synthetic petroleum using sun and CO2. Wouldn't this be killing several birds with one stone?

It should get as much or more resources as fusion research. No matter what Exxon says
People are trying to do that. But plants produce biomass quite cheaply, so it is not clear that there would be an economic advantage. Biomass can be converted to many different organic products, including fuel, with current technology. The best hope for that is near high-CO2 emission sources, such as power plants. Atmospheric CO2 is too dilute to be practical, IMHO.
 
At this point, there is not really a battle of food vs fuel. Corn yield has increased so much that the net corn yield after ethanol production has increased dramatically. Moreover, only the starch portion of the corn kernel is converted to sugar and then to ethanol. The rest is used to make high-protein feed supplements, which are actually more nutritious than ground corn. We could actually develop biotechnology to make petroleum, by the way. An organism has been discovered which actually makes petroleum. It was found near oil wells and was able to make petroleum in a laboratory setting. The problem is that the natural organism did so very slowly. But microbiologists are very good at modifying organisms to make them do what they do much faster. But they need funding for that, and no one seems to want to fund such research.
You can only feed cattle so much distillers as it causes issues with sulfur and phosphorus and starch is very beneficial for fattening cattle.
Corn production being dedicated to ethanol absolutely does increase food prices. There is a finite amount of farm land and without ethanol corn prices would fall for certain.
 
You can only feed cattle so much distillers and starch is beneficial for fattening cattle.
Corn production being dedicated to ethanol absolutely does increase food prices.
I refer you to these sources of data. It is hard to make a case that ethanol has actually increased food prices. In fact, a great deal of our corn in exported, which is more likely to impact food prices. https://www.macrotrends.net/2532/corn-prices-historical-chart-data https://www.indexmundi.com/agriculture/?country=us&commodity=corn&graph=production
 
Yep, I have 14 years turning wrenches full time in a shop I owned doing small engines (even longer for myself and as a side gig) that says that YouTuber is dead wrong.

Used to be that if you let equipment sit for 7-10 years, depending on the climate, you'd get black to tan varnish or goo stuck all over the jets and passageways, and float & bowl. Back then we also had good carb cleaners that would eat right through that crap in no time flat. These days, with EPA watering down of all our chemicals, you can use carb or brake cleaner as an eye wash ...

Ethanol has sped the clogging process up by 1,000x. Not only that, but it's propensity for water DESTROYS carburetors if left long enough. I've seen unrepairable carburetors just completely eaten away by corrosive water/ethanol mixtures, plus all the other crap in fuel these days. That NEVER happened back in the day! Unless you sunk it in the ocean for 10 years and decided to restore it!
I do not know, but impression in first photo is steel gas tank/ piping rust; I have seen plenty of bad from ethanol, but nothing ever looked like that? I have found white crystals, white paste, had corrosion to aluminum bowl and had a bright, shiny new brass float turn black and sink after 90-days from a teaspoon of acidic water/ fuel remaining in a float bowl.
 
The EPA requires ethanol be blended into the fuel via the RFS mandate.
Refineries would stop using it ASAP if they didn't have to. Including the refiner I work for who also owns ethanol plants.
If you don't mind disclosing it, who do you work for? It is possible I have consulted to them, as I have consulted to several ethanol producers.
 
"Today's ethanol plants produce roughly 5 times as much energy as they take to produce it."

Not unless they are employing Nuclear Fusion in the process, and even then, the statement above violates the basic laws of thermodynamics. It ain't happening.
No, it doesn't. The energy locked up in ethanol ultimately comes from the sun. The current processes use many technologies to avoid losses. Some of these include mechanical vapor recompression, pressure swing absorption, vapor scavenging, etc. Do some research.
 
Yep, I have 14 years turning wrenches full time in a shop I owned doing small engines (even longer for myself and as a side gig) that says that YouTuber is dead wrong.

Used to be that if you let equipment sit for 7-10 years, depending on the climate, you'd get black to tan varnish or goo stuck all over the jets and passageways, and float & bowl. Back then we also had good carb cleaners that would eat right through that crap in no time flat. These days, with EPA watering down of all our chemicals, you can use carb or brake cleaner as an eye wash ...

Ethanol has sped the clogging process up by 1,000x. Not only that, but it's propensity for water DESTROYS carburetors if left long enough. I've seen unrepairable carburetors just completely eaten away by corrosive water/ethanol mixtures, plus all the other crap in fuel these days. That NEVER happened back in the day! Unless you sunk it in the ocean for 10 years and decided to restore it!
Well, if you dare, you can buy such solvents as toluene, acetone and MEK in relatively pure form at your local Lowe's store. They will dissolve the goo. But they will probably also dissolve all your gaskets and O-rings.
 
I refer you to these sources of data. It is hard to make a case that ethanol has actually increased food prices. In fact, a great deal of our corn in exported, which is more likely to impact food prices. https://www.macrotrends.net/2532/corn-prices-historical-chart-data https://www.indexmundi.com/agriculture/?country=us&commodity=corn&graph=production
I get all that, but supply and demand is a thing. Wether the corn is exported or not matters little. Corn is a globally traded commodity like oil.
Let's say ethanol went away over night. What you would see is corn prices plummet, then stabilize. Wheat and soybean production would increase on acres formerly planted in corn, which would cause their prices to lower. Meat prices would then also go down. And so on.
 

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