Know when to walk away..

[bclure]

I walked away from a job today for the first time. I had bid on a LARGE dead elm tree. The homeowner had assured me that it had been very alive last year. I was under the impression that elms did die very quickly so that it could be completly dead yet sound. I set up to rig the tree, climbed up and found that everything was VERY brittle. anywhere I grabbed stuff in the top, the bark peeled off in big chunks. Small limbs crumbled in my hand.. I climbed back down and talked to the homeowner. Told him that it was too dangerous to rig out and that it would require a crane. I feel bad, like I owe him a removal for what I had bid. I really did apreciate sitting down to dinner with my son last night, safe, happy and whole...

I guess that I am interested in feedback about this. I think that I should have examined the tree more closely, but to truly appreciate how far gone it was, I needed to climb...

Thanks,
Brendan

 

[arbor pro]

You did the smart and professional thing IMO. Your safety and the safety of your crew comes first. The safety of the property owner and others comes next. Thirdly comes your responsibility to try and serve your clients to the best of your ability. By reassessing the job and knowing when to hold em and when to fold em, you did the right thing.

A good rule of thumb that I try to follow is to always plan (and bid) for the worst case scenario. If there is a chance that a tree might be too hazzardous to climb, I like to think ahead - is there a way for me to work on it without climbing it? If not, do I have the equipment and experience to handle the job under this worst case scenario? If I can't say yes, I usually pass on it so as not to risk leaving the customer hanging.

You should be commended for having the brains to get down and not risk your life and your neighbor's property. I'm sure that, even if he doesn't appreciate it, your family does. Being there for your kids is more important than satisfying a customer. My dear wife drills that into my head every time I go out on the job...

 

[046]

good pass!!!

 

[S Mc]

And I will say, good for you. And don't beat yourself up. You did the right thing.

I always tell the customer that we reserve the right to stop the job at any time if a circumstance presents itself that precludes us from safely continuing. And generally we have a "plan B" set up in case.

Yes, you always think you "should have" noticed this or that and with more experience you will see more and more. Sometimes, things aren't obvious until you ascend the tree.

Prof Bob said in another thread that sometimes you learn more from the things you get wrong. Well, put this in your "chock it up to experience" category. I bet the next dead or dicey tree gets a much more thorough inspection.

Sylvia

 

[treemandan]

The homeowner said what? You don't owe nobody nothing unless you are stupid.

 

[toddstreeservic]

You did the right thing. :yourock:

 

[TimberMcPherson]

Good for you mate, nice job. You did the most proffessional and ethical thing you could have in this situation. No one got hurt, nothing got broken.

 

[fireman]

staying alive

You did the right thing you new your limits and you stayed safe I dont think that elm just died. we do alot of elms and that sounds what you described has been dead several years.good job dont think you owe anything to anyone.good job stay safe and keep cuttin.

 

[pdqdl]

I did almost the same thing once: I thought my bucket truck would do all of a job, and I underestimated the height of a tree. There was no way I would use any rigging, and yes, it was a dead elm going snappity-crack on every branch that I cut off. When they hit the ground, they looked like expensive china shattering into every direction.

I called the customer, told them that I made a mistake, and that I could not finish the job. I offered to finish the job if they absorbed the additional cost of the crane, or walk away at no cost.

The customer said yes, I finished the job (not profitably, after messing around for two days on one tree), and the customer was happy. He reported that with the crane expense added, I was about the same as the price quoted by all the other tree services. He still calls me for work occasionally.

 

[bclure]

Thank you!

Thank you all for the feedback. Right or wrong, I would have made the same choice but it's nice to know others would have made the same choice.

Brendan

 

[murphy4trees]

integrity

I think that this is a case of integrity...

Seems like your concern was related to giving your word to take the tree down for a given price... your original post read "I feel bad, like I owe him a removal for what I had bid."

You made a commitment for something you didn't do... Now seems likely that the customer mislead you about the time of tree's death... so that changes the situation and really frees you from the commitment. And even without that stipulation you still did the right thing..

I AM aware of the importance of a man keeping his word... his commitments... ANd it is important to realize that as men, we impy commitments, and are responsible for them as well... So you have a commitment to be a good father, which is far more important than cutting this tree. To have risked your life or safety to cut the tree would have lacked integrity as you risked failing to keep your commitment to your family and yourself.

There is no shame in walking away from a dangerous job. You did the ONLY right thing... Good on ya for sharing it on this forum... It may end up saving a life someday, as someone reading this post may hear that little inner voice that says... "maybe I shouldn't make this cut or do this job" etc... think back to this thread and walk away.. Might even be me...
Thanks

 

[81Bronk36]

You don,t owe them anything... they basically tried to kill you

 

[tomtrees58]

don't feel bad# you did the right thing# tom trees

 

[ATS/TexasTree]

Good for you!

I'm assuming that the tree was an American elm. Around here, an American elm has to be dead for at least 2 full growing seasons (perhaps 3) to shed bark off large limbs.

All the while the parts above ground are falling apart, the parts below ground were rotting away long before the tree above ground appeared dead to the owner.

I had a similar call from a neighbor who wanted me to bid on his 5 year- dead post oak. He was furious when I told him I wouldn't even consider it.

The local "we will bid on anything" tree company put a climber up the tree the following week. When the tree failed with a climber strapped into it, the climber suffered a broken femur, crushed pelvis, and fractured spine.

If this is the first time you've walked away from a job, don't let it be your last. There are lots of jobs out there too dangerous to rig out.

 

[Bermie]

Walk away, and live to work another day!

This probably won't be the last time it happens either.
I had (still have) an avocado to take down on on a large property where I've been doing work for three years. I went up, spikes and all, I passed one spot where a limb had torn out, got higher, then saw another tear out on the other side of the trunk that had been hidden from the ground. They were old tears too, so who knows how much decay had set in. Avocado is weak and snappy, with the amount that had to come off the top first, I was NOT happy to be above two weak points, and it had a lean...
I came down and told my client that the tree would be coming down, but not with me attached to it!
I looked at it again last week, wondering if I had wimped out...decided no I hadn't, it's on the books for next week with a bucket truck...

Stay safe

 

[reachtreeservi]

Anybody that's been in the tree business long enough has done the same thing.

I have a buddy who owns another tree company , they have a crane inhouse.
When I get up in a tree and don't feel good about the rigging, I come down and refer the homeowner to my buddy.

IMO , If I tell the homeowner it's a safety issue and they don't owe me anything, that negates any contract or estimate.

There's not a tree out there worth getting hurt or killed over.

 

[OLD CHIPMONK]

I run from lightning struck, long- dead Pine . They scare me & usually located over houses & concrete driveways. Old guys point of view, " why risk your life, an employees or your insurance being cancelled over something that should halve been removed 2 or 3 yrs. ago. Run for your lives men !!!!

 

[computeruser]

You did the right thing, and any customer who is halfway intelligent should understand and respect your actions. As a customer, I'd have no problem whatsoever with you doing what you did.