Log Splitter Engine Problem

[Rookie1]

Id take the float bowl off while carb is on engine. See if the float is free and moves the needle. If so manually lift float to seat needle and see if gas leaks by. If it flooded that bad that fast I'd say the float is stuck on the pivot pin or needle is stuck open.

 

[WoodTick007]

Put it on craigslist and go buy a Chonda. By the time your done dicking around with it your gonna have $200 into an old gas guzzler.
K series Kohlers were one of the best engines ever made, but time and technology has passed them by.

 

[Wood Doctor]

Put it on craigslist and go buy a Chonda. By the time your done dicking around with it your gonna have $200 into an old gas guzzler.

K series Kohlers were one of the best engines ever made, but time and technology has passed them by.

You could very well be right. I have a 6.5 Hp Chonda on another splitter that has run flawlessly for four years. What I intend to do is not buy expensive parts for the Kohler. One or two repair attempts is all that it is going to get, and one has already been used up.

 

[WoodTick007]

You could very well be right. I have a 6.5 Hp Chonda on another splitter that has run flawlessly for four years. What I intend to do is not buy expensive parts for the Kohler. One or two repair attempts is all that it is going to get, and one has already been used up.

I know what your saying. . .I have a 1972 Gilson snowblower with and 8hp briggs. I said... Oh I will just clean the carb and get a new plug..... So I got it running and the muffler blew out.... So I replace the muffler and then thd headgasket fails..... I fix the headgasket and then the carb starts overflowing with fuel. Now the brass float is leaking. I put it back together and the coil quits. So now I have over a $80 into it in parts and all my time and effort trying to start the M.F'r. Oh, and the switch on the electric start fails...... Just STOP and go spend your $99 on the predator and go about your life in happiness.

 

[laynes69]

I know what your saying. . .I have a 1972 Gilson snowblower with and 8hp briggs. I said... Oh I will just clean the carb and get a new plug..... So I got it running and the muffler blew out.... So I replace the muffler and then thd headgasket fails..... I fix the headgasket and then the carb starts overflowing with fuel. Now the brass float is leaking. I put it back together and the coil quits. So now I have over a $80 into it in parts and all my time and effort trying to start the M.F'r. Oh, and the switch on the electric start fails...... Just STOP and go spend your $99 on the predator and go about your life in happiness.

Same thing here. I resurrected an old splitter, and the engine was giving fits. In the end, I spent 90 dollars and got a predator engine. After that it was a breeze. Nothing more frustrating than trying to start an old engine, and fixing it constantly. I put a predator engine on that splitter, and one on a minibike. The minibike gets the crap beat out of it, and it starts first pull everytime.

 

[brenndatomu]

Id take the float bowl off while carb is on engine. See if the float is free and moves the needle. If so manually lift float to seat needle and see if gas leaks by. If it flooded that bad that fast I'd say the float is stuck on the pivot pin or needle is stuck open.

Agreed ^ ^ ^. and if it is accessible, pop the float and needle off and have a look at things...maybe blow a lil carb cleaner down the fuel line to flush out any crud that may be hanging out on top of the needle/seat area. With what you describe, I'd bet 5 minutes of TLC on the carb will solve the problem

 

[WoodTick007]

Agreed ^ ^ ^. and if it is accessible, pop the float and needle off and have a look at things...maybe blow a lil carb cleaner down the fuel line to flush out any crud that may be hanging out on top of the needle/seat area. With what you describe, I'd bet 5 minutes of TLC on the carb will solve the problem

Did you do a compression check and cylinder leakdown test on this motor? You can get it to run and it might not make the rated power. Those engines have not been made or 20 years and the majority of them were put on "garden" tractors that people worked the living snot out of. . . I am not trying to be "negative" just trying to be the voice of reason. It's easy for someone to say oh easy fix.... Your the one who is gonna spend 2 hours messing every time you wanna split wood...and if you have free helpers the last thing they want to do is waste their time while your pulling the cord until your seeing stars.

And if your gonna fix it. . .fix it properly with kohler parts. . .otherwise your just gonna have a cast iron kohler with a hodge-podge of china parts in it.

 

[blades]

Over all what the troops are saying is correct- better off doing the replacement eng. thing. Dang ethanol eats the older equip like a teenager on the refrigerator. Ethanol is corrosive as h on metallics and not any better on rubber compounds, does a pretty good job of destroying the paint job on your method of transportation as well. Even the new plastic fuel lines and tanks are not immune.

 

[olympyk_999]

Agreed ^ ^ ^. and if it is accessible, pop the float and needle off and have a look at things...maybe blow a lil carb cleaner down the fuel line to flush out any crud that may be hanging out on top of the needle/seat area. With what you describe, I'd bet 5 minutes of TLC on the carb will solve the problem

too much thinking for most of these guys around here it seems...
nearly all the people that have seen my splitter ask about the engine I have on it (50-60 year old twin cylinder Wisconsin) wondering why I would ever put something so "unreliable, and hard starting", etc. etc. on it
all the guys that have those kinds of problems either don't know wtf their doing when "fixing" it, or it's been needing a rebuild for quite some time, and they cant figure that out...
my Wisconsin was a basket case when I bought it, (completely apart) all I did was degrease everything, hone the cylinders/valves, new rings, carb kit, and all new gaskets/seals, the jug is original, and was rusted, I only honed the surface rust off of it, but its still pitted in spots, but its got 120psi in both cylinders...and starts before I can even push the start button in all the way.

the thing has been dead reliable for 3 years so far, only thing I need to keep an eye on is the points...5 minute job to replace em and back in business, all together I have about $250 into it...bought it for $100, and have about $150 into it in parts...
guess I just like old unreliable junk? ..................does harbor freight make a 18hp engine putting out 50+ ft. lbs.?

 

[ckr74]

Those old Wisconsin motors are tough as nails. We had one on an old grain elevator and it got nothing but abuse. The elevator rusted out before the motor quit. It had a pull rope and always started on the second pull cold or hot, didn't matter. When we were done it just got a tarp put over it. I don't recall if dad even changed the oil in it.

 

[Old Goat]

I am definitely not opposed to the harbor freight engines. I've replaced them on tillers and have a brand new one, in the box, just sitting there, just in case. With that said, the problem that Wood Doctor is describing is an easy fix. Changing out the motor for this problem would be like buying a new car because your fuel filter was clogged, or the tires were bald. If it was a Briggs or a Tecumseh I might be persuaded into changing out the motor but this is a Kohler folks

 

[Wood Doctor]

too much thinking for most of these guys around here it seems...
nearly all the people that have seen my splitter ask about the engine I have on it (50-60 year old twin cylinder Wisconsin) wondering why I would ever put something so "unreliable, and hard starting", etc. etc. on it
all the guys that have those kinds of problems either don't know wtf their doing when "fixing" it, or it's been needing a rebuild for quite some time, and they cant figure that out...
my Wisconsin was a basket case when I bought it, (completely apart) all I did was degrease everything, hone the cylinders/valves, new rings, carb kit, and all new gaskets/seals, the jug is original, and was rusted, I only honed the surface rust off of it, but its still pitted in spots, but its got 120psi in both cylinders...and starts before I can even push the start button in all the way.

the thing has been dead reliable for 3 years so far, only thing I need to keep an eye on is the points...5 minute job to replace em and back in business, all together I have about $250 into it...bought it for $100, and have about $150 into it in parts...
guess I just like old unreliable junk? ..................does harbor freight make a 18hp engine putting out 50+ ft. lbs.?

If you are getting 50 ft-lb from that engine at 3000 RPM, it's delivering 28.5 HP.

HP = T x N/5252
where T = Torque in ft-lb and N = RPM

 

[olympyk_999]

If you are getting 50 ft-lb from that engine at 3000 RPM, it's delivering 28.5 HP.

HP = T x N/5252
where T = Torque in ft-lb and N = RPM

yeah if it were an electric motor...

those conversions don't work on gas/diesel engines...though they may hold true to todays small engines with their high hp/ low torque...? somewhere along the lines the way HP was calculated has changed, ( 8 hp use to be able to do what now takes 25 "hp")
a long stroke engine is going to be high torque (diesel) and in this case the Wisconsin's are all high torque engines. I use to have the hp/torque curve chart from the factory for it, but I cant seem to find it... its highest torque ~50 ft. lbs. was at around 2000 rpm, while highest HP was between 3200 and 3600 rpm
the long stroke coupled with the huge flywheels (that weigh more than entire engines of today) of these engines give them very high low end torque...they're basically designed like a diesel engine, with the addition of a carb...

 

[Wood Doctor]

yeah if it were an electric motor...

those conversions don't work on gas/diesel engines...though they may hold true to todays small engines with their high hp/ low torque...? somewhere along the lines the way HP was calculated has changed, ( 8 hp use to be able to do what now takes 25 "hp")
a long stroke engine is going to be high torque (diesel) and in this case the Wisconsin's are all high torque engines. I use to have the hp/torque curve chart from the factory for it, but I cant seem to find it... its highest torque ~50 ft. lbs. was at around 2000 rpm, while highest HP was between 3200 and 3600 rpm
the long stroke coupled with the huge flywheels (that weigh more than entire engines of today) of these engines give them very high low end torque...they're basically designed like a diesel engine, with the addition of a carb...

Note that the splitter's pump often needs extra RPM to deliver the required force to the cylinder. Otherwise, it will stall out. In my book, that means it wants more horsepower. So, I rev it up and the log usually gets split after I do that.

When it comes to splitting logs, I think we need to address pump requirements perhaps more than engine torque.

 

[olympyk_999]

Note that the splitter's pump often needs extra RPM to deliver the required force to the cylinder. Otherwise, it will stall out. In my book, that means it wants more horsepower. So, I rev it up and the log usually gets split after I do that.

When it comes to splitting logs, I think we need to address pump requirements perhaps more than engine torque.

Note that the splitter's pump often needs extra RPM to deliver the required force to the cylinder. Otherwise, it will stall out

that's somewhat true but only because the small engines of today are such low torque, they need the extra rpm to overcome the load being applied since they don't have heavy flywheels or torque that old engines had which allowed them to do more work with less "HP"......think of a super split type splitter, its able to use a tiny little engine/ motor only because it has the heavy flywheels there to keep it going, where if it were just the engine it would likely stall out just engaging the rack/pinion. those flywheels provide the torque...the HP has little to do with it...
also hydraulic gear pumps do not require high rpm to operate...the rpm only dictates the flow, it will build the same pressure weather its turning 500 rpm or 3600 rpm, the only difference will be GPM (flow)

I have a 28 gpm 2 stage on mine and I believe the recommended "minimum" HP requirement is 16-18 hp... and mine will build 3000 psi at idle (~500 rpm/~7 HP) and not even change exhaust note, same at any throttle setting... the only time I even hear a change in exhaust note is when I'm running the log lift as it has a flow control on it, basically trying to push too much fluid through a pin hole opening.
it takes torque to keep the pump turning, the more the better!

 

[olympyk_999]

heres another comparison for you...
Farmall "A" (17 HP) 4 cylinder engine.........now I have a Wheel Horse garden tractor with a "17 HP" single cylinder Kawasaki...do you think those engines are anywhere near comparable, or do you think the Kawasaki could do the work that the 4 cylinder Farmall can do?.......NOPE not even close
as I said before the way HP is calculated has changed...

 

[chuckwood]

Over all what the troops are saying is correct- better off doing the replacement eng. thing. Dang ethanol eats the older equip like a teenager on the refrigerator. Ethanol is corrosive as h on metallics and not any better on rubber compounds, does a pretty good job of destroying the paint job on your method of transportation as well. Even the new plastic fuel lines and tanks are not immune.

My small engine problems all went away after using nothing but 100% gas. I've got a tiller and a splitter with predator engines and have had no issues so far. That being said, I've also recently purchased an old 1954 model Simplicity walk behind tractor with the original 5 hp Briggs model 14 engine on it. I'm going to restore this rusty old tractor to mint condition and use it for gardening and mowing. The motor is a massive hunk of black iron, and has a rope starter. It starts on the first pull, and it seems the moving parts in the 14 are so heavy that the thing can idle at an amazingly low rpm. Great compression and no smoke in the exhaust, I'm keeping this one!

 

[Backyard Lumberjack]

I blow carbs out with air all the time. About the only quick and safe way to clear out passages.

using compressed air is safe to do assuming general safety issues, like goggles, etc. from having rebuilt several small engine carbs following engine specific models ie the vids for each on utube... I did follow one rebuilders tip regarding using compressed air:

reduce the line pressure to 30-35 psi MAX! I did that. also, a good carb cleaning with carb cleaner. furthermore, carb cleaner is a good 'preprimer' for starting... wet good air filter... and it will also soften tuff gaskets such as base gaskets on saw cylinders, too... if let soak couple days.

the tip to change the oil is a must do! a stuck float does sound possible.

spewing fuel out the muffler, thru carb... and filled cyl! Gzz.... sounds like a...a.... really BIG leak... as Ed Sullivan mite have said... lol

yes, post pix of it working and what was wrong... good luck!

 

[ChoppyChoppy]

I just use shop air, 150-175 psi.

 

[olympyk_999]

I just use shop air, 150-175 psi.

Yup, 35psi don't do anything except piss me off!