log splitter help

[mlh29]

I am at a loss here. I built my own splitter, a stand alone unit that gets transported via the 3pt hitch of my kubota b2710. It has adjustable legs with pads so I may set near the log pile and use tractor for other stuff.
The specs are
Kubota 6.5 hp'ish diesel engine, electric start .. will run to 3800 rpm.. NEW
13.6 gpm haldex, direct lovejoy coupled to engine New
4x30 x 1.75 ram 3000 psi tie rod cylinder with 1/2 work ports... New
8 gallon tank with northern hyd return spin on filter and an internal suction screen ... NEW( bought on ebay already with suction strainer in it
single wedge ( for now) 10 high x 1.5 wide, x 6 in length ground to a v
prince splitter valve with 3/4 ports ( adjustable releif)
5000PSI guage on inlet to cylinder
1/2 inch hydaulic lines from pump to valve, to cylinder
3/4 return. 1 in suction etc
6 inch 30lb ft h beam with 1/2 x 6 flat laminated to top rail, reinforced inside webs. boxed ends etc

My issue so far is it is slow, I mean very slow. Hydraulic cylinder will occasionally stop when encountering large log ( will develop 3000PSI on guage quickly) and usually will split after repositioning of log. I even added a 16gpm pump to test ( for another project) and it was about the same speed. I am looking for ideas, I am starting to think I have a flow restriction in the tank ( maybe suction screen is to small)
I thought also i may have a bad cylinder ( so i replaced with a new prince without improvement). This was also for my bigger tow behind spplitter project that is on hold....

I am deployed currently( AD MIL to OEF) and need to split wood while on R and R ( next weekish) SO I am looking for ideas as to what to check as I am not a hydraulic expert.... I am wondering what pump adjustments could be made/ ideas to check

Thanks Matthew

 

[mga]

your pump is too small.

go for a 11/22 dual stage or larger.

you'll see a huge difference in speed and power.

i'm using a haldex 11/22 with a 12.5 kohler, complete cycle time is 12 to 14 seconds. nothing so far puts the gauge over 2000 lbs. when that second stage kicks in, it's a bear.

 

[Oldtimer]

A 13.6 GPM isn't big enough? A 16 GPM isn't enough? Malarkey.

You have something amuck in the gizzard of the thing.
Hose collapsed?
You have a flow restriction if the thing hits 3000 PSI but won't split...that pressure isn't reaching the ram.

 

[Iron man]

I would have to agree there is a flow restriction or improper flow because 3000 psi on a properly working machine will tear through just about anything cylinder size permitting but a 4in bore at 3000 is just below 20 tons of pressure.Doesn't sound like a pump problem from what you did so far.Its about 5 seconds to pump 1 gallon with a 13.6 pump so you can start removing hoses and check flow one at a time to see if one is internally restrictive.I wouldn't bother checking the return line because it would blow off with pressures like that just the high pressure hoses.If they check out its a valve or cylinder problem.

 

[mlh29]

your pump is too small.

go for a 11/22 dual stage or larger.

you'll see a huge difference in speed and power.

i'm using a haldex 11/22 with a 12.5 kohler, complete cycle time is 12 to 14 seconds. nothing so far puts the gauge over 2000 lbs. when that second stage kicks in, it's a bear.

I wish to keep this in the smaller configuration I have, may even swith to a 4x20 cylinder for easier mobility without a 7 ft long item haging form my 3pt.


Also I fully understand the 13.6 or 16 should be plenty, I am thinking it is a flow restriction, or a pump adjustment, Maybe only stays in low flow mode.. I plan on making a tester resevoir with a 5 gallon pail of hydro fluid and some hoses to see if the suction strainer is the culprit.. Otherwise maybe could be the suction hose collapsing? It is heavy duty 1 inch braided and steel reinforced Hydraulic hose though.. Hopefully I get this figured out quick as I am aboutto sa y heck with wood this year and just pay the $4 plus per gallon for fuel oil... SO I can spend time with my family

Thanks for the suggestions

 

[Iron man]

I'm done with oil for now unless it gets cheaper.Just installed a small 40 gal electric water heater and I don't use the oil furnace for heat because I burn wood so its turned off fully now.To switch back all I need to do is turn 2 valves and turn one off and the other on and I can still use the oil furnace for heat if needed but don't plan on it.

 

[redheadwoodshed]

Are you sure about the rpms of your pto?

 

[redheadwoodshed]

Most likely if the suction hose was collapsed, the pump would be cavitating and making an ugly noise.

 

[redheadwoodshed]

It doesn't matter if you have 10,000 psi, if the ram is moving slow that's a gpm problem.Don't give up, you'll get it.

 

[redheadwoodshed]

Last bit of advise.Get rid of the suction strainer, a spin on filter in your return is really all you need.

 

[A.S.Woodchucker]

I had a similar problem with the splitter I built, I ended up replacing the hyd. valve, I would definately check hoses for restriction.
good luck!

 

[mlh29]

Last bit of advise.Get rid of the suction strainer, a spin on filter in your return is really all you need.

I am also leaning towards the flow issue, the pumps are quiet and seem to run fine... I honestly intended to remove the suction strainer but at the time had evrythjing mocked up. During the day while I was at work , My wifes step brother was visiting and " helped me out by filling the tank up" So I test ran and split a few cords that way.. it was just slow going..

I understand hydraulic basics, as well as other mechanical basics... ( ASE certified on mulitiple and been a US ARMY lt wheel mech for 14yrs, last 8 or so as a sneior mech/ supervisor)
Just I know there are some people that are VERY good at this type stuff on here and honestly I never have really played with th ehaldex pumps, or prince valves...

ALSO This is not ran off the pto, it is ran by a kubota single cylinder diesel small engine with a haldex 13.6 gpm pump coupled with lovejoy connectors

Thanks for the tips, anxiously awaiting my trip home to tear into this so I can hopefully save a few bucks on heating this year...

 

[redheadwoodshed]

I am also leaning towards the flow issue, the pumps are quiet and seem to run fine... I honestly intended to remove the suction strainer but at the time had evrythjing mocked up. During the day while I was at work , My wifes step brother was visiting and " helped me out by filling the tank up" So I test ran and split a few cords that way.. it was just slow going..

I understand hydraulic basics, as well as other mechanical basics... ( ASE certified on mulitiple and been a US ARMY lt wheel mech for 14yrs, last 8 or so as a sneior mech/ supervisor)
Just I know there are some people that are VERY good at this type stuff on here and honestly I never have really played with th ehaldex pumps, or prince valves...

ALSO This is not ran off the pto, it is ran by a kubota single cylinder diesel small engine with a haldex 13.6 gpm pump coupled with lovejoy connectors

Thanks for the tips, anxiously awaiting my trip home to tear into this so I can hopefully save a few bucks on heating this year...

Yea, I read it kinda fast, I saw Kubota and tractor in there together and got confused.It's been a hot day.
You are most welcome for the tips, I hope you get it figured out, maybe you won't have so much help this time.If all your parts are new, I would start at the strainer.Prince and haldex both are good brands in hydraulics.I am not a hudraulics expert either, but a lowly welder, but I end up working with the mechanics a lot and we have a lot of hydraulics where I work.

 

[mlh29]

Yea, I read it kinda fast, I saw Kubota and tractor in there together and got confused.It's been a hot day.
You are most welcome for the tips, I hope you get it figured out, maybe you won't have so much help this time.If all your parts are new, I would start at the strainer.Prince and haldex both are good brands in hydraulics.I am not a hudraulics expert either, but a lowly welder, but I end up working with the mechanics a lot and we have a lot of hydraulics where I work.

I wish I could weld, right now I can get 2 pieces of metal to stick together BUT.. intend to learn and do it. Right now I have a deal with a local welder, I cut,prep, have the fab work/ design done mark it by numbers in chalk.. he will weld it in his down time/ leisure for a reduced hourly fee, sometimes just beer.. Otherwise I occasionally go to parents when on vacation and have family weld for me..
Once I get a garage built it will have 220 and I will have a mig and auto darkening helmet to work with... Right now cant justify the cash outlay for projects that usually cost less than 250 to have a pro do it on their time..

Thanks for the help. I wil get this figured out and post some pics of the splitter when i get stateside

 

[CJ1]

OK lets take all the guessing out. Time your cylinder out and back then post it. With what you listed you should be in the 13 second range out and back in. If it is considerably more than your pump maybe stuck in high pressure/low flow mode. Start there. CJ

 

[CJ1]

Oh just to add if you are developing 3k and can't split the round you either need a bigger bore cyl or a sharper wedge. The only other thing that could be messing with you is the shoe binding on the beam. 3000psi is all you are going to get out of that set up. CJ

 

[Oldtimer]

If the RPM is right, the pump and piston are both new, then it should split anvils.
If it were stuck on "low" it would never even hessitate to split. Sounds like a restriction between the pump and the piston...= valve.

 

[CJ1]

If you have a restriction between the pump and valve you have pressure all the time and if it is enough of a restriction you won't be able to start the engine. CJ

 

[mlh29]

Hopefully in the next week I will be at home to check this out. So far yes I either have a flow restriction or a pump stuck in low. I there a way to adjust the pump? I was told that it is possible to adjust the pressure of it like form 600-1000 on th high side and if that is out the pump may only stay in the low flow side as the high flow has pressure set too high. Anyway Thanks for the ideas

 

[mga]

Hopefully in the next week I will be at home to check this out. So far yes I either have a flow restriction or a pump stuck in low. I there a way to adjust the pump? I was told that it is possible to adjust the pressure of it like form 600-1000 on th high side and if that is out the pump may only stay in the low flow side as the high flow has pressure set too high. Anyway Thanks for the ideas

if you have a 13gpm single stage pump, there is no "low" side to it. it pumps exactly that: 13gpm at max rpm's. the only change in the GPM flow would be a reduced rpm from your engine. only a two stage pump does hi and low.

you said in your OP you are building 3000lbs "quickly". that means the pump is working, and therefore getting oil. unless this is an old unit, it doesn't sound like you have any debris floating around, but, i'd either adjust or replace the control valve.

and, as some one suggested, get rid of the suction line strainer. a log splitter is the simplest thing to build and should not be over-engineered or complicated. the oil system is a closed system, it's not like you're going to pick up dirt inside of it every time you use it. i've seen some many years old without filters that still run like a bear.