Log splitter kinetic or hydraulic??

[sirbuildalot]

I love my ss. I agree to fully utilize it to its full potential 3 guys is the magic number. One getting rounds ready, one splitting and one taking the splits away. For being by myself I would love to have a conveyor.

 

[Ryan'smilling]

I dont know, 12 pieces in 6 or 7 sec seems pretty fast to me. Cant get there I dont think with a kinetic

That may very well be true. For me, a big part the appeal of the super split is that they come in an electric model. Yes, a heavy, expensive hydraulic model can probably be more productive, and they usually have a hydraulic log lift as well, which eliminates the noodling and heavy lifting. But, they're loud and stinky. Different strokes for different folks. Nothing wrong with them for getting the job done, but I think a fast, quiet, powerful, electric splitter is pretty awesome.

 

[muddstopper]

I noodle a little every now and then, but its only because the rounds are so big I cant fit them on the beam using my boom. Even quartering those rounds they are still to big to lift by hand. A lot can be said for the speed of the SS on wood you can just pickup and throw on it, but if you have to noodle everything before you can split it, have you really saved any time. A lot is mentioned about the amount of waste and splinters using multisplit wedges, then you look at all the noodles made sawing wood just so the SS can handle it, is there really anymore waste using a big hyd splitter and a multisplit wedge. I think if I was looking for small size splits, or making bundles, A SS would be a must have tool. I can throw some pretty good size splits in my stove, and my hydraulic works just fine making those.

I also like the ideal of a electric splitter, you can put a electric motor on a hydraulic splitter too. Since I dont have power lines following me around in the woods, I would have to carry a gas generator to power the electric splitter, and I dont have power where I process my wood, so a electric powered splitter isnt in my future. I can see where if I had a fire wood lot and splitting a lot of wood everyday for resale, a little quiet running splitter would be pretty nice.

 

[Ryan'smilling]

@muddstopper, just a quick reply. I'm sure you could put an electric motor on a hydraulic splitter, but if you want to put one on something that'll compete with a super split, that's gonna be some serious juice. I don't really know, but I'd assume three phase. That would be a cool unit, though, if you had a place for it!

I noodle the occasional piece too. Actually, I don't have a splitter of any kind right now. I borrow the neighbor's hydraulic one every couple of years, but otherwise I do about 12-15 cords by hand. So, I guess I should have mentioned that my case, I could always whack a piece into slabs, or in half, quarters, etc with my maul. That's quite a bit faster than noodling, doesn't waste wood, and doesn't use fuel. Still would have to noodle the oddball, though.

Anyway, for now, I'll just keep dreaming about a splitter. I'm pretty good splitting by hand, and I love doing it. I want to do it for a long time, though, which means that I want to spread out the 5,000 (or however many) cords I can do by hand over my lifetime rather than over work myself in the next decade.

 

[GVS]

From my experince, you can't beat a SS for speed and lasting value, If cost was no issue I would have one.
Instead I have a fast hydraulic, which really is all I need for 6 plus cords a year.
with two of us running the splitter, one feeding and stacking, the predator is all I need. With just me I can split and stack a cord in a couple hours.
I ran the SS with a few other guys, it took three young guys to keep it fed and the splits pile from getting too big.

I noodle a little every now and then, but its only because the rounds are so big I cant fit them on the beam using my boom. Even quartering those rounds they are still to big to lift by hand. A lot can be said for the speed of the SS on wood you can just pickup and throw on it, but if you have to noodle everything before you can split it, have you really saved any time. A lot is mentioned about the amount of waste and splinters using multisplit wedges, then you look at all the noodles made sawing wood just so the SS can handle it, is there really anymore waste using a big hyd splitter and a multisplit wedge. I think if I was looking for small size splits, or making bundles, A SS would be a must have tool. I can throw some pretty good size splits in my stove, and my hydraulic works just fine making those.

I also like the ideal of a electric splitter, you can put a electric motor on a hydraulic splitter too. Since I dont have power lines following me around in the woods, I would have to carry a gas generator to power the electric splitter, and I dont have power where I process my wood, so a electric powered splitter isnt in my future. I can see where if I had a fire wood lot and splitting a lot of wood everyday for resale, a little quiet running splitter would be pretty nice.

Speaking of noodleing,I don't recall doing any noodleing since I bought my V/H splitter 5 years ago.Couldn't use an elec. powered unit because I split at the landing and it's a long way from elec. power.I don't like the idea of tandem towing a splitter and generator to the landing.

 

[muddstopper]

@muddstopper, just a quick reply. I'm sure you could put an electric motor on a hydraulic splitter, but if you want to put one on something that'll compete with a super split, that's gonna be some serious juice. I don't really know, but I'd assume three phase. That would be a cool unit, though, if you had a place for it!

For a single split like a SS, with similar splitting capability, I suspect it would be hard to do with a electric/hyd setup. Big motor, big pump, big cost. I spent about 5 sec thinking about it and think its possible if someone really wants one. When you throw in multiple splits per stroke, is where it could be more feasible to produce a electric/hyd splitter that could compete with a electric/kinetic splitter. Either way, a electric power splitter of any kind is going to be a site specific operation, meaning, if electricity isnt available, you wont be using the machine to split any wood.

Many people like their SS splitters, and just as many like their hyd splitters. Different needs for different folks, I dont need a elect/over anything type of splitter, it wont work where I split wood. Now a gas over kinetic, I could find very useful, but I already have the hyd splitter and I only split enough wood for my needs, so unless a kinetic splitter falls off someones truck in my drive way, I aint likely to own one any time soon.

 

[muddstopper]

Speaking of noodleing,I don't recall doing any noodleing since I bought my V/H splitter 5 years ago.Couldn't use an elec. powered unit because I split at the landing and it's a long way from elec. power.I don't like the idea of tandem towing a splitter and generator to the landing.

I use a boom with winch to pick up the big rounds, Its only when rounds start reaching 4ft dia that I have to noodle anything. The only reason then is because the distance between the boom and the beam wont allow a 4ft round to fit between them. I can pick the round up, but I cant swing it on the beam. I have used the fel to load bigger rounds, but even with a 6way wedge, the pieces are still to big handle by hand. Its just easier to noodle and use the boom to load the smaller pieces.

 

[Ryan'smilling]

For a single split like a SS, with similar splitting capability, I suspect it would be hard to do with a electric/hyd setup. Big motor, big pump, big cost. I spent about 5 sec thinking about it and think its possible if someone really wants one. When you throw in multiple splits per stroke, is where it could be more feasible to produce a electric/hyd splitter that could compete with a electric/kinetic splitter. Either way, a electric power splitter of any kind is going to be a site specific operation, meaning, if electricity isnt available, you wont be using the machine to split any wood.

Many people like their SS splitters, and just as many like their hyd splitters. Different needs for different folks, I dont need a elect/over anything type of splitter, it wont work where I split wood. Now a gas over kinetic, I could find very useful, but I already have the hyd splitter and I only split enough wood for my needs, so unless a kinetic splitter falls off someones truck in my drive way, I aint likely to own one any time soon.

Exactly. I particularly like how well the expression "different strokes for different folks" applies to this situation. I can dream about a lovely empty warehouse with a functioning waste oil burner and a couple of big three phase splitters, hell throw in a three phase woodmizer too! I can run a forklift around in there and have room galore. I'd also love a fallen-off-the-truck SS. Anyway, just dreams for now, though. I'm in it about $225 for a Gransfors Bruks splitting maul and an X27, so maybe if I set aside $10 every time I split a cord by hand someday I'll be able to afford a decent splitter.

 

[ChoppyChoppy]

Not really that much waste with a multi-wedge unless you reject anything that isn't a "perfect" size. I have a 6 way.

If I adjusted the wedge height constantly I guess it could be "better" but that would slow things down. The smaller popsicle stick pieces go in the stack too. Make good kindling or pieces to stuff into a packed stove to fill the cracks.
On a nice load of logs (stuff with no rot, loose bark, etc I might end with with 1/2 a wheelbarrow of snow and "junk" out of a 2 cord pickup load. (8x12ft bed)

The big stuff (over about 24") we either sell or toss it in a pile and wheel out "old smokey", which is a beat up Iron & Oak with a slow, worn out, oil burning, no muffler splitter and bust the pieces up and then toss them onto the processors.

 

[muddstopper]

Yea. I dont worry much about the waste. I fill 5gal buckets for kindling. bigger pieces get thrown on top of the stacks, and carried to the stove with good wood a gator load at a time. They are great for keeping a bed of coals when you dont need a lot of heat, but dont want to run the furnace either. I use a fel to scoop the split wood for stacking in the shed, once I get down to the point I endup with more dirt and trash than firewood, I dump it in a pile and let turn to dirt. Probably dump a bucket or two a year and its mostly dirt. Not many rejects in my wood pile, if it burns, it goes in my stove. The thing I see about selling wood is customer expectations. They expect to see all nice even sized splits, every piece the exact same lenght and dia, stacked nice and neat inside their sheds or close to the door as possible. A processor spits out what it spits out, with a normal splitter, you can turn the wood this way and that to get similar size wood. Got a Knot, turn the round so the knot splits in half instead of wadding up and breaking in a ball of splinters. If I was selling firewood, I would be looking at splitting every piece of wood I could possibly sell, as fast as I could split it. I aint got time to sort uglies or do a ton of resplitting. As a homeowner, I want my wood work done in as short of time period, with the least amount of labor, as possible. I burn about 4 cords a year, not a lot when compared to others in colder climates. I can take my time and scrounge one weekend, buck on another, and split when I get around to it. Or I can bust butt, buy a load of logs, buck and split it in one day and go fishing on those other weekends when I would normally do firewood. I choose/want to get done as quick as possible and spend the rest of my time doing things I enjoy.

 

[ChoppyChoppy]

That's more wood than I burn in my house. Burn around 3 cords, about 1/2 cord a month.

 

[Guswhit]

My brother and uncle have their own log splitters at their house but this one would be at the farm we all hunt where most of the splitting happens. My brother and uncle heat their houses with wood. We heat our hunting cabin with wood and I burn a couple two tree chords in the fireplace at my house.

I am not sure if it will get split 4 ways, I am just tired of the slow ass splitter we have so was going to buy a new one myself and surprise everyone. It all comes out in wash so not worried about it.

Would be cool to bring one of the kinetic out there and surprise everyone with the speed. I dont think they even know they kinetic exist. Would back fire on me if it wont split the oak and red elm. My uncle is especially hard on equipment.

Thanks for the input. I am gonna see if I can find a SS around here to try.

I'm a little over 2 hrs away if you want to try it out. I have enough cut stacked in a pile that you could do a real good test on. Just let me know.

 

[muddstopper]

Wish there was one somewhere close to me. Probably is, I just havent seen or heard of one.

 

[Whitbread]

8 years ago in ohio I built a huge hydraulic splitter with an 6"x36" ram with an adjustable 4 way and a 24gpm pump. At that time I was getting 2-4' rounds from a friend's tree business. Worked great, but it was loud and I noticed that I was waiting on the hydraulics quite a bit. 4 years ago, I moved to metro Detroit and sold the big hydraulic. I ended up moving up to the woods in northern MI this spring and installed an indoor wood boiler to heat 7500sqft. I tried a few different types of splitters including a SS. That sold me on the spot and I just recieved mine last week and put a 6.5hp diesel on it. I've done about 6 cords with it since Saturday and Im blown away. Even doing the big 2'-4' rounds on my hydraulic with a 4 way I couldn't fill a trailer as fast as I can doing 8"-2' rounds on the SS. I don't remotely miss dealing with wood that big anyway though. It's nice to take the SS out into the woods and not have to bring a tractor out to handle/lift chunks.

So having had both its my experience that if you know you're going to deal with massive rounds 95% of the time, get a big hydraulic with a multi way wedge and log lift. If you're selectively cutting stuff ~2.5' and under, then you can't beat the SS for speed of production. If you know you're going to get lots of stuff on the bigger side, then the log lift from split second would be a very wise investment.

 

[KiwiBro]

Quite a hike to NZ, sorry fellas. But you could play with a tweaked SS AND a Bilke, and marvel at the latter mowing through small stuff that only the mentally deranged, and the Zogsta, seem to enjoy messing with. Still haven't got a big wood solution. Got ideas but no $.

 

[sirbuildalot]

I've thought about the split second log lift. It's rated at 180 lbs. that would translate to a 20-22" or so diameter round for me. I process to 20" length. Figuring my numbers off of something heavy like oak or hickory at 55-60 lbs/sq. ft. green. Not really that big of a round. Then again as log lifts go it's inexpensive and light duty so to be expected. It would be cool though and would make a nice staging holder for small rounds. Still waiting for Paul to come out with a slightly better and beefier version.

 

[muddstopper]

I watched the Bilke video. Most of what they where splitting would fit in my stove unsplit.
I am not surprised a 8x36 ram with 24gpm seemed slow, it was probably really slow. You cant make a decent comparison between that splitter and a SS and judge them by speed. To get decent speed out of a splitting ram that size, you would need a 60-70gpm size pump. I will agree, those big rounds are a pain to process, which is why I push them to the side until everything else is split, then take my time getting to them.

 

[Whitbread]

I am not surprised a 8x36 ram with 24gpm seemed slow, it was probably really slow. You cant make a decent comparison between that splitter and a SS and judge them by speed. To get decent speed out of a splitting ram that size, you would need a 60-70gpm size pump. I will agree, those big rounds are a pain to process, which is why I push them to the side until everything else is split, then take my time getting to them.

I went back and found the receipt in ancient email history for when I had the ram rebuilt and it says 6"x36" so I need to make a correction there. I normally only ran the ram about 20-24" and the cycle time for 24" was right about 11 or 12 secs. The 36" stroke was way overkill for what I needed, but got the cylinder for free so I couldn't complain. I just found that I spent alot of time running the ram back and forth on stuff that would cleanly split after 8" of pushing or had a waste a full cycle time to cut a few strings. That's where the SS is nice that it's a full cycle every time you pull the handle in 3 seconds. Any strings are cut and wood pushed off the end automatically.

 

[KiwiBro]

I watched the Bilke video. Most of what they where splitting would fit in my stove unsplit.

Can you cut it faster than the Bilke? I haven't found a faster way, but I'm always keen to learn.

 

[Kevin in Ohio]

Perhaps it is not actually the lifting, but rather working bent over without straitening up, or most likely a combination of both. A higher beam might be beneficial, and possibly an auxiliary table next to the beam. Pulp hooks help as well in handling wood in many situations. This is an old splitter raised up. The bench was built of repurposed 4" x 4"s, and some 2" x material bolted up. It can be used on either side of the beam. Note the bench is quite long so it catches one half of a big round after being split, and there is still room to work up the half closest to you. Another benefit is that the bench keeps the split pile away from the splitter a bit. When done the splitter is still easily moved.View attachment 541182 View attachment 541183

BINGO! That is one of the biggest factors, fatigue wise, that I have found. We used to run a 3 point splitter on the ground in the woods and roll the big ones in. It wasn't rolling the big stuff that got my back. It was leaning over holding the lever to split. I'm 6'5" and when I built mine I made the beam at 38". It's PERFECT for me and at the end of the day I'm not even remotely sore and I've done 3 times as much. Big difference to move something around while standing straight as opposed to leaning over. That includes days when doing smaller stuff, meaning stuff I could lift, and not using the winch. That's the same reason Verticles are bad for me. It's the leaning that will get you. My back would want to spasm when leaning but upright I was fine. Constant pressure at unnatural position I guess.