Logology: How Did They Do That?

[slowp]

I've been tromping around in the woods, trying to figure out how to log areas that were originally cut in the 1970s. It was a lot easier then, or was it?
I do remember and not fondly of having to find ways down through rock bluffs in the 1980s, but this looks like it may have had to come downhill. I will admit, every once in a while we would watch a faller launch a tree off the rocks. The tree usually did not end up in very good shape. This unit is not one that is ready. I was just walking by and remembering similar layouts.

Here is how the road was closed. I think it was done in the 1990s.

And, a cheery picture of my assistant.

We and others all figured that the old roads that were built and well rocked could be used again. Times and rules have changed. Gotta refigure it out.:greenchainsaw:

 

[RPM]

I'd guess the big ole pipes (Skagits..etc) did those? Poor deflection made better with a tall spar to drag turns in with. We use to slack line some pretty marginal stuff. What you couldn't get - got left. Ground lead whats that ...

 

[slowp]

I'd guess the big ole pipes (Skagits..etc) did those? Poor deflection made better with a tall spar to drag turns in with. We use to slack line some pretty marginal stuff. What you couldn't get - got left. Ground lead whats that ...

Yes. The big yarders were all over here. They were moved at night. Sometimes by day with the leading pickup frantically waving at the oncoming traffic to get over. It was a bit exciting on one of the main roads that had heavy traffic due to the eruption of Mt St Helens. Some of the tourii got an additional attraction.

That's why the old roads are so wide and do not have as sharp of turns, they had to get those machines around. Often, some additional road work had to take place--shaving off the cutbank so the tube could clear to get to the unit. It was an interesting time.

 

[Humptulips]

Lift,LIft,Lift!!!!!!!!

You can do a lot of things with lift and part of it is the big yarders with tall tubes. Also you can hang way across over there. Yea, way over there. Plus you take a big log, you can bounce it around, drag it for aways and spend a little time geting it out. You end up with a nice log. Try that with bean poles and you get chunks and cats askks.
I know you know all this but that's how a lot of it was done.
A few things you have at your disposal that we didn't have; motorized carriages, wider corridors and even side corridors. If you don't get carried away the chokerman may even not cuss you too much (expect a little). Support trees, you can get some lift with them but the timber has to be big enough to make good support trees.
I would look at the timber and think how much wood will there be to come out for the amount of labor rigging up for it. Too much and it is not economical.
Don't forget good stumps. I think I heard you mention this before so you're probably one step ahead of most foresters.
And the one thing you have me worried about. When you are thinking down hill logging think BAD, BAD, BAD

 

[slowp]

You can do a lot of things with lift and part of it is the big yarders with tall tubes. Also you can hang way across over there. Yea, way over there. Plus you take a big log, you can bounce it around, drag it for aways and spend a little time geting it out. You end up with a nice log. Try that with bean poles and you get chunks and cats askks.
I know you know all this but that's how a lot of it was done.
A few things you have at your disposal that we didn't have; motorized carriages, wider corridors and even side corridors. If you don't get carried away the chokerman may even not cuss you too much (expect a little). Support trees, you can get some lift with them but the timber has to be big enough to make good support trees.
I would look at the timber and think how much wood will there be to come out for the amount of labor rigging up for it. Too much and it is not economical.
Don't forget good stumps. I think I heard you mention this before so you're probably one step ahead of most foresters.
And the one thing you have me worried about. When you are thinking down hill logging think BAD, BAD, BAD

One thing we don't have that was done then was the ability to shove in a road or even reuse the old ones if they cross creeks. That is considered to be BAD BAD BAD by the 'ologists and makes things harder.

The size of the timber in the units makes me very depressed. I think it will be a do it anyway and see if anybody buys it project. Not a good use of tax dollars, but I'm not in charge.

 

[madhatte]

I think it will be a do it anyway and see if anybody buys it project. Not a good use of tax dollars, but I'm not in charge.

I sure do know that feeling.

 

[RPM]

Well if the wood is iffy then not being able to get it all isn't such a big deal. Grab what you can with the equipment of the day. Too bad you have to partial cut everything (do you have any root rot issues with partial cutting in Doug-fir?)

We end up doing lots of small 1 - 5 ha (2.5 - 12.5 acre) clear cut openings ... irregular edges, narrow 2-3 tree lengths wide - no squares. Keeps the locals happy where things are visible, special critters- caribou. We leave birch, aspen and anything big and rotten standing (Hemrot - some cedar)

Pain the asz logging wise, logistics, roads, long skids, short yarding, etc.... but hey you do what you have to do to get the wood out. Now if the wood is sh*t.....then :monkey:

 

[floyd]

I would say the days of a 40 ac square CC are severely numbered.

Those irregular units mimic the natural odd shaped openings. The more edge one has the better the birds n bees like it. Depends on the mgmt objectives.

 

[slowp]

At last, some decent sized timber. This one should not be as it is. It is growing in an old skid trail. According to the soils experts, trees won't grow well in old skid trails. There are old, well located trails all through this unit.

The most scenic lunch spot of the week. It was a foggy day on the west side, looked clear to the east.

And something we don't see too much around here. A self loader.

I'll try to get a picture of the shovel logging taking place in our suburbs. Today is too cloudy.

 

[Rounder]

Self loaders are about all we see around here anymore, everything's small scale anymore, with the pathetic mill situation. Why the lack of self loaders over there? - Sam

 

[slowp]

Self loaders are about all we see around here anymore, everything's small scale anymore, with the pathetic mill situation. Why the lack of self loaders over there? - Sam

They can't haul as much as a regular truck, and most jobs are big enough to justify moving in a shovel for loading. The few that are here are busy, but most all the logs get trucked via shovel loaded trucks.

You don't see those front end loaders either. Our landings are too small. Steep ground makes for small landings.

 

[forestryworks]

Nice pictures Slowp. How are they gonna log that unit?

 

[RPM]

I would say the days of a 40 ac square CC are severely numbered.

Those irregular units mimic the natural odd shaped openings. The more edge one has the better the birds n bees like it. Depends on the mgmt objectives.

40 acres / 16 ha is becoming more the norm. The range is anywhere from 1 ha - 60ha (2.5 - 15 acres) but the average is 15-20 ha. Lots of irregular shapes - probably most by chance and becoming more by design. We have alot of variables to account for and find a balance for all. Fortunately, we are not dictatedt to by the lawyers and Starbuck enviro types.

The end result is challenging logging and coming up with good log plans and being "cost effective" and "creative" (favorite management phrases used at the weekly planning meetings)

 

[slowp]

Nice pictures Slowp. How are they gonna log that unit?

Most likely they'll skid it out by skidder or cat again. The old trails were located well. If the bottom part stays in the unit, it has some steep ground that will need a yarder to get at. But that's OK as there are guyline stumps and big enough tail trees, and uphill yarding to a road. These units seem to be rare, but are nice and reassuring. Now to see how the suburban shovel logging photos turned out.

 

[slowp]

Suburban Logging

This is the shovel logging that can be seen from the highway and an "industrial park" The old yarder is just parked there for a long time. It probably has sentimental value.

 

[floyd]

Self loaders keep small 1 person logging outfits going. They are an important part of the 5 ac suburbs where there may only be 3 loads on a job.

I have made lands with self loaders in mind. Less footprint. Depends on mgmt objectives.

 

[BC_Logger]

just finished laying out a few second growth blocks up here in squamish BC 35 to 60 ha some hoe chuck and maybe skid but mostly cable grapple

all the deflection lines were designed for a 18 meter ( 59 feet ) tall tower