Looking for Soft Dutchman against the Lean Video

[hseII]

If you can't sensibly explain your case, there's no need to rabbit on about it with everything except what has been asked for.
thansk

The case has been sensibly explained more times than I care to count: if you choose not to see what is being explained, well, that's your problem.

If you want to listen, the folks that have posted in this thread will explain.

You do not want to hear anything that defies your understanding.

You ask for a drawing when someone shared a video: how dense can you be?

 

[bitzer]

Reggie- The only reason you want an explanation step by step is to argue with each step. A year ago I gave you pictures of two different trees that I had cut that week with a step by step. The video I posted here was actually for another site, but I wanted to rile you up again because I was bored. I know you'll never try it and you'll never believe me. I actually explain it in the video as well. Is 180 degrees from the lean possible? No. 179 degrees is tho. All you need is that little extra to get it moving in the right direction. The rest is pretty simple. Pre- sawing lean into the tree. If I had cut that tree off the stump it would have went straight back from where I put it. That's a fact only I know for sure.

The soft Dutch is the opposite of wedging really. When lifting with a wedge you move the top so many feet. When the butt compresses the kerf the top moves by so many feet. Each kerf is 3/8". Three kerfs is 1 1/8". How many feet does a top move when wedged up 1 1/8"? There are so many factors involving swinging trees it can not be possibly explained other than in the simplest terms. Anymore than that can change the result because every tree is different. You know all this already because I've told you. It's time for you to experiment now. Your science teacher can only hold your hand for so long in lab. I learned by trying. In fact other than some light reading and a few tips from pros on here I'm self taught. You're ready Reggie. It's time.

 

[northmanlogging]

Part one, sort of showing the cuts and the layout, video really doesn't do real world view much justice, I try to explain, but well, I don't talk real good anyway... and the saw is sorta loud... also dropped the phone and shut the vid off so it necessarily ended up being 2 vids first one shows most of the cuts, second one is just the back cut.

Granted this one only went about 95-100 deg it still shows how it works, gradually change the lean, and walk it around. Its not that difficult to comprehend.



I'll load the second vid after its done processing, takes a little while.

 

[northmanlogging]

and the finale...
enjoy

 

[bnmc98]

If you can't sensibly explain your case, there's no need to rabbit on about it with everything except what has been asked for.
thansk

I used a very sensible analogy
Not my fault if you are a closed book to anything but your way.

I wouldn't say I was that clever, just clever enough to know the difference between magic & reality.
Tanks

Ah yes
The patented "Logical Person" answer
Most times reality has very little to do with what we believe is real, but rather, what really is real.
The cut is real because people do it. It is actually illogical for you to think it can't be done. Unless we have all eaten a weird red pill and found ourselves in a room subconsciously with each other where they brainwashed us by putting similar fake experiences in our minds that we could all come together on AS and share our delusions.
Because you know that there is a conspiracy against the ever so popular site of AS to psych people out of reality.

I think what is more real and not magical is that you are an argumentative un-open person who gets a kick out of strife. That being the case, I will never waste my time (which is money) on providing you an exact diagram and video the exact way you want it. Unless its on your dime.
so show some initiative of your own on figuring it out

 

[Bwildered]

The case has been sensibly explained more times than I care to count: if you choose not to see what is being explained, well, that's your problem.

If you want to listen, the folks that have posted in this thread will explain.

You do not want to hear anything that defies your understanding.

You ask for a drawing when someone shared a video: how dense can you be?

A drawing can & will explain it throughly to anybody, obviously Im not as dense as you to realise it. The only way a video has any more legitimacy is if the tree is straight, evenly weighted & referenced to a plum bob for its lean.
Fanski

 

[Bwildered]

You roosters could have drawn your method ten times over in the time it took you to write all that to avoid it.
Tanks

 

[bnmc98]

You roosters could have drawn your method ten times over in the time it took you to write all that to avoid it.
Tanks

Um... Logger here...
Takes a long time to get something like that on the computer.
But, I can sure run my mouth as well as my saw.

 

[Bwildered]

Um... Logger here...
Takes a long time to get something like that on the computer.
But, I can sure run my mouth as well as my saw.

I remarkably found 2 minutes of my day & a scrap of paper to hand draw the basis for you guys to add in your bits, showing how you make it possible. Is it really that hard or complex that it defies this explaination.
Thansk

 

[Skeans]

I remarkably found 2 minutes of my day & a scrap of paper to hand draw the basis for you guys to add in your bits, showing how you make it possible. Is it really that hard or complex that it defies this explaination.
Thansk

Here you go
Now go and try it like the rest of us have.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

 

[madhatte]

Yo Northman -- well done! I never thought to throw a soft dutch and a siz on the same stump but damned if it didn't work out just right! For those of you not in the know, alders are notoriously brittle and whippy and not easy to swing.

Here's me a few years ago slipping a similar alder into a similar hole but I used a hard dutch rather than a soft dutch and only swung it about half as far. The bore was because I was not at all confident that it wasn't gonna barberchair on me so I put all my effort into the face and hinge and to hell with saving out. I've learned a few things since and wouldn't bore it that way now but the facts are the same -- alder is tricky and you need to be careful with it.

 

[Skeans]

Yo Northman -- well done! I never thought to throw a soft dutch and a siz on the same stump but damned if it didn't work out just right! For those of you not in the know, alders are notoriously brittle and whippy and not easy to swing.

Here's me a few years ago slipping a similar alder into a similar hole but I used a hard dutch rahter than a soft dutch and only swung it a bout half as far. The bore was because I was not at all confident that it wasn't gonna barberchair on me so I put all my effort into the face and hinge and to hell with saving out. I've learned a few things since and wouldn't bore it that way now but the facts are the same -- alder is tricky and you need to be careful with it.

That's half the fun of big heavy alder is the pucker factor and if you look at them wrong they'll come get you.

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[madhatte]

They *are* fun, aren't they?

 

[northmanlogging]

The siz really shines on an alder, whenever possible I'll fall em sideways to their lean anyway, but you tend to loose em about halfway over, put a siz in and it will usually go most of the way to your gun, but be off by how ever far its leaning, and alders just don't grow straight. Throw some soft dutch or even a small dutch in and it will correct it enough to compensate for the lean, then its just a matter of hanging out at the stump and walking it around, I've had a couple of them go much much farther then I intended them to go, luckily its never been near anything real important, but it can break a stick at times or totally **** up yer lay, but its all usually better then hitting what you didn't wan't to hit.

 

[Skeans]

They *are* fun, aren't they?

Love the pay from them but could do without the chair factor on the steep ground sometimes but they will keep your 100 yard dash right there with the high school kids.

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[northmanlogging]

First solo logging job was all alder, and it seems that folks just hate them around here, they are a bit of a weed, so I cut quite a fair bit of alder for a PNW soft wood guy... pays about the same as Doug Fir right now as well.

 

[northmanlogging]

Love the pay from them but could do without the chair factor on the steep ground sometimes but they will keep your 100 yard dash right there with the high school kids.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

One of the few trees I'll consider a bore cut on... them sideways *******s that snake their way through the canopy... Though I prefer a coos for most of em if they are leaning hard I'll bore em or sometimes bore the guts like a reverse Coos

 

[Skeans]

First solo logging job was all alder, and it seems that folks just hate them around here, they are a bit of a weed, so I cut quite a fair bit of alder for a PNW soft wood guy... pays about the same as Doug Fir right now as well.

We don't hate the pay from them but sure hate where they grow and how they grow, we're always wishing it was a fir or a cedar patch.

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[Skeans]

One of the few trees I'll consider a bore cut on... them sideways *******s that snake their way through the canopy... Though I prefer a coos for most of em if they are leaning hard I'll bore em or sometimes bore the guts like a reverse Coos

My least favorite ones are the ones you have to climb up because they have multiple stems and the root tree is going out at an angle, never fails that's when you need a trick like a soft face or a siz.

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[madhatte]

One of the few trees I'll consider a bore cut on... them sideways *******s that snake their way through the canopy... Though I prefer a coos for most of em if they are leaning hard I'll bore em or sometimes bore the guts like a reverse Coos

Yeah, see, that cut there I posted was a hybrid hard dutch/bore/coos because that was what I knew how to do at the time. Gonna hafta try that soft dutch/siz, looks like just the ticket for alders of that size. Ain't too proud to learn a new trick!