Mismatch cut for blocking down wood

[Rickytree]

I use the mismatch cut for blocking down wood that I can push off but what about having a pull rope on a much larger piece. Just wondering if anyone here has done this or does this method on a continuous basis. I am also wondering if the piece tends to land flat rather than on the top.

 

[ozzy42]

There are too many other variables to answer your question yet.
Depends on dia. of log,height you are cutting at,type of wood,lenghts you are cutting,and other factors.
I usually cut pcs small enough to just cut straight thru and shove them off with one hand when done.But not allways.As i said,there are many variables.

 

[MonkeyMan_812]

There are mathmatical equasions that you can use to get your peices to land flat. (length of the peice, and distance to the ground. G.F. Baraneck covers this in his book "The Fundamentals of General Tree Work". Its a lot simpler than it sounds. It doesnt work ever time but if your good enough you can get it to work most of the time. And I use the "Snap Cut" all the time too. Its very useful.

 

[tree md]

I use the mismatch cut for blocking down wood that I can push off but what about having a pull rope on a much larger piece. Just wondering if anyone here has done this or does this method on a continuous basis. I am also wondering if the piece tends to land flat rather than on the top.

I do on big wood. If I'm blocking I usually cut them small enough to push off with a snap cut but if there is a little back lean or I have to block a particularly large chunk that maybe has a knot or something that makes me take a really heavy piece I will put a line on the top of the chunk. I do it more with the chunks that I am bombing out as I tend to take them a little bigger. This kind of ties in to the using the felling wedge in the tree post I made. I was curious if anyone uses a wedge instead of a tag line.

I learned my lesson on this many moons ago when I was chunking out a huge Beech tree. I cut an 8' chunk that was around 42" and couldn't push it over. I played hell getting a rope around it so I could pull it off the spar. Last time I ever made that mistake.

 

[Mapleman]

I used mismatch cuts a lot on big removals, under cutting severely so pieces would break off when I rocked them. I've also used the Humboldt cut to push pieces over. If you cut it right, you can get pieces to land flat instead of tumblesaulting.

For bigger pieces and hardwood a climbing wedge is handy, but if there's any doubt at all, then put a pull line in the critter. Trying to wedge over 6 feet of oak or maple without a line is the pits. I've had to use the hook of my pole saw to gain some leverage when I wasn't able to secure a line on a piece after cutting it.

 

[southsoundtree]

use a humboldt face cut that is over one-half of the diameter of a dead vertical piece and you will have undercut the center of gravity. Use relief cuts below what will be the hinge, to prevent the bark from tearing down into your climbing system, and backcut. They will tumble off without a pullrope, and your will have more directional control.

By using a humboldt instead of a conventional facecut, you will allow the wedge to slide out. It doesn't have to be a very large, wide angle facecut.

I have done this on large Doug-fir mostly, dropping wood that I had to double cut with a 20" bar, 10'+ sections. Works a lot easier than a snap cut. Saves hauling up a pull rope and occupying a groundie.

I wouldn't want to try to use a snapcut and a pull rope. When the piece breaks free, it is just perched, without any directional commitment.


As mentioned about, length of piece in relation to height above ground of cut will dictate part of whether it falls flat or on end.
I imagine that the angle of facecut, and type of facecut will play into this as well.

 

[tree md]

use a humboldt face cut that is over one-half of the diameter of a dead vertical piece and you will have undercut the center of gravity. Use relief cuts below what will be the hinge, to prevent the bark from tearing down into your climbing system, and backcut. They will tumble off without a pullrope, and your will have more directional control.

By using a humboldt instead of a conventional facecut, you will allow the wedge to slide out. It doesn't have to be a very large, wide angle facecut.

I have done this on large Doug-fir mostly, dropping wood that I had to double cut with a 20" bar, 10'+ sections. Works a lot easier than a snap cut. Saves hauling up a pull rope and occupying a groundie.

I wouldn't want to try to use a snapcut and a pull rope. When the piece breaks free, it is just perched, without any directional commitment.


As mentioned about, length of piece in relation to height above ground of cut will dictate part of whether it falls flat or on end.
I imagine that the angle of facecut, and type of facecut will play into this as well.

I am going to try that next time I have to chunk out some big wood. Makes sense. I have used the humboldt on the ground but never thought about using it on the spar. Great tip.

 

[StihlRockin']

I guess I have my ways that have worked for me since the early 80's, but I just use a conventional face cut and works good about every time. Big pieces just cut off without a face cut have a tendency to have a lack of accuracy of where you want it... having seen pieces that fall off as much as 80 degrees left or right.

Giving the big pieces a face cut gives it direction along with being much easier to push over. I usually cut the face about 40 to 50% the diameter of the stump. It's also easier and quicker to give up the smaller arborist saw and pull out something with more power to get it done quicker.

There's also the time element and how good you are with a saw. I know some guys can make a face cut on a longer piece of big wood and push it off.... BUT some guys can make 3 straight cuts with 3 smaller pieces of wood and get it done just as quick.

StihlRockin'

 

[Mapleman]

Yeah, it really gets down to what you comfortable with. The biggest thing is to make sure you're not holding wood where you don't want it.

I was sharpshooting a big Bishop pine down in the Pt. Reyes area. Got all my chunks lined up on the ground like ducks. Got those babies falling flat by varying the size of the humboldt. One more piece before the trunk comes down. It was summer and the tree was pretty sappy. Last piece pulled off a strip of sapwood and spun 50 degress off center, smashing the fiberglass cover of an underground water tank. I had $240 into the job at $30/hr. That was the cost for a new cover.

 

[Rickytree]

$30 /hr? For tree work and this was your job or someone's?

 

[MonkeyMan_812]

There are mathmatical equasions that you can use to get your peices to land flat. (length of the peice, and distance to the ground. G.F. Baraneck covers this in his book "The Fundamentals of General Tree Work". Its a lot simpler than it sounds. It doesnt work ever time but if your good enough you can get it to work most of the time. And I use the "Snap Cut" all the time too. Its very useful.

I looked it up. The ratio is at 18%. If youre on a totem 100ft tall and your chunking peices down, you would cut them 18ft long to get them to land flat. This changes when your not on level ground. If your on a totem 50ft tall, you would cut them 9 ft long, 25 feet up cut them 4 1/2 feet long ..........

 

[TDunk]

I looked it up. The ratio is at 18%. If youre on a totem 100ft tall and your chunking peices down, you would cut them 18ft long to get them to land flat. This changes when your not on level ground. If your on a totem 50ft tall, you would cut them 9 ft long, 25 feet up cut them 4 1/2 feet long ..........

So basically as you get closer to the ground you need to make your lengths shorter right ? To keep the 18 percent of the total height of the spar ?

 

[MonkeyMan_812]

So basically as you get closer to the ground you need to make your lengths shorter right ? To keep the 18 percent of the total height of the spar ?

Exactly my tree brother!:rockn:

 

[treemandan]

yes, lots of variables but one constant; land it flat or stay on the porch. Naw, I wish I could everytime but that is the goal. I knew there was a formula but it don't really matter as long as you keep practicing and keep aware it becomes a good game to play, like horsehoes. Anyone who routinely lands things all haphazzard certainly isn't trying. The sound of the " land flat" is the sound of sucess.

 

[TDunk]

I was topping a Tulip tree Saturday (yeah i know, but things are starting to slow down and i have to take what i can get) and we laid down 4 sheets of 3/4 ply-wood so we didn't crater his yard and fill it full of irrigation holes. And the yard had a down hill slope going towards the chipper. When the smaller branches would hit the ply wood, the butt would kick out and be pointed down hill right at the chipper. SWEET, makes Jeffs job alot easier. Well the bigger pieces from the spar would hit the ply wood and take off like a shot towards the chipper and Jeff. Didn't matter if the piece was 1 ft. or 4 ft. long, landed flat or angled. The only way to get them not to shoot down hill was to try and get the pieces to go straight down butt first. Any body have any ideas ?

 

[treemandan]

I was topping a Tulip tree Saturday (yeah i know, but things are starting to slow down and i have to take what i can get) and we laid down 4 sheets of 3/4 ply-wood so we didn't crater his yard and fill it full of irrigation holes. And the yard had a down hill slope going towards the chipper. When the smaller branches would hit the ply wood, the butt would kick out and be pointed down hill right at the chipper. SWEET, makes Jeffs job alot easier. Well the bigger pieces from the spar would hit the ply wood and take off like a shot towards the chipper and Jeff. Didn't matter if the piece was 1 ft. or 4 ft. long, landed flat or angled. The only way to get them not to shoot down hill was to try and get the pieces to go straight down butt first. Any body have any ideas ?

Uhh, don't kill the groundy? That's an idea.

I use 3/8 ply, it gives a little more but that is why the land flat is important. You need the cushion of the soil but don't want to do to much damaged. I make holes all the time, with the small loader on the job it makes it easier. It will flatten the hills and fill the valleys, sprinkle some seed and I am gone. Its a shame you can't get away with leaving the mess.

 

[southsoundtree]

I was topping a Tulip tree Saturday (yeah i know, but things are starting to slow down and i have to take what i can get) and we laid down 4 sheets of 3/4 ply-wood so we didn't crater his yard and fill it full of irrigation holes. And the yard had a down hill slope going towards the chipper. When the smaller branches would hit the ply wood, the butt would kick out and be pointed down hill right at the chipper. SWEET, makes Jeffs job alot easier. Well the bigger pieces from the spar would hit the ply wood and take off like a shot towards the chipper and Jeff. Didn't matter if the piece was 1 ft. or 4 ft. long, landed flat or angled. The only way to get them not to shoot down hill was to try and get the pieces to go straight down butt first. Any body have any ideas ?

You can use a vertical speedline.
Anchor the speedline at the top and bottom of the tree. sling work pieces with appropriate sized sling and carabiner. Let 'er rip. The speedline only really experiences force when the work piece tries to bounce away, after hitting the ground.

Ekka has a great video of this where the rounds are having to stay tight to the trunk, with one bouncing within about 6" of a large plate glass floor to ceiling window. Fancy trick.


I've thought about buying a stall mat for horses from the local farm supply store. Seems like I could cut it in half to get (2) 4'x4' pieces that can have brush sandwiched between. Seems like it would dampen the bounce, and prevent significant craters.

 

[TDunk]

Normally i don't think the ply wood would have made that big of a difference, but with the moderate down hill slope, the ply wood acted like a "slip-n-slide" for the bigger pieces. If the HO wasn't so picky about his yard i would have just told Jeff to just get the ply wood out of there and we'll deal with the craters when were done. Really didn't want anyone getting hurt.

 

[TDunk]

You can use a vertical speedline.
Anchor the speedline at the top and bottom of the tree. sling work pieces with appropriate sized sling and carabiner. Let 'er rip. The speedline only really experiences force when the work piece tries to bounce away, after hitting the ground.

Ekka has a great video of this where the rounds are having to stay tight to the trunk, with one bouncing within about 6" of a large plate glass floor to ceiling window. Fancy trick.


I've thought about buying a stall mat for horses from the local farm supply store. Seems like I could cut it in half to get (2) 4'x4' pieces that can have brush sandwiched between. Seems like it would dampen the bounce, and prevent significant craters.

For the vertical speed line, do you just use loop runners or rope chokers and a biner to attach it to the speed line ?

 

[tree md]

I am halfway decent at getting them to land flat but I will often have my guys pile brush in the landing zone to soften the blow. If I've got a picky HO who doesn't want a blade of grass harmed I'll just go ahead and block everything down. If I am going to bomb it out I make sure to let the HO know there will be some divits. I usually try to drop the spar as long as I can, drop it on a log to minimize ground damage and raise the indention with a pitch fork.