Not too much longer in the private sector, for me.

[Sunrise Guy]

I am getting ready to get my utility certification and then I think I may leave the residential gig scene. While I like the challenges of different types of tree work situations at different times, the general work slow-down in my area is starting to get very old and very frustrating. I am starting to feel very negative towards homeowners who wait until their trees have rotted out and/or fallen on their homes before calling me. I do understand that many folks are now out of work or operating on a drastically reduced budget, but that doesn't put any money in my pocket. Early on, Asplundh and Davey discovered the value in utility clearance work, and I think I now have done the same: Utility wires ALWAYS need to be kept clear. The public may ignore that rotted-out Cottonwood even after it falls in their yard, but if it takes out their block's electricity in the process, then all hell breaks loose in the whole neighborhood. The big boys started to make their billions by piggy-backing with the major electricity providers just as lines were being strung for telegraph use, way back. Now, I think I'll follow their lead. Punching a clock for the utility company, down here, may not be a bad scene. There is a great deal to be said for a steady check and full benefits. I can see myself driving around town, in a city car, checking out lines that need clearing and checking up on crews doing the work. I can always keep climbing, on weekends, although I know I may miss the more hands-on aspects of my present gig. Since I really like public contact and I'm good at smoothing out ruffled feathers, I actually look forward to notifying customers about their upcoming clearance work and why it needs to be done.

 

[Ekka]

A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.

Wise move considering the circumstances.

Often in the domestic market you are unable to utilize your specialist skills due to scabby attitudes, and when there's less money in the kitty I assure you that the trees matter least.

Then also you have an influx of crap competitors as they lost their jobs but gravitate toward the industries that have no regulations, heck some might even get their ISA cert online or in the next bottle floating past at the beach, either way, the steady pay check will be like a paid holiday to you after being self employed.

Good luck, and who gives a rats what people think, do what is right for you. Have a look around and smell the roses .... more hacks now than there ever was. Wise move, move on.

 

[Sunrise Guy]

A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.

Wise move considering the circumstances.

Often in the domestic market you are unable to utilize your specialist skills due to scabby attitudes, and when there's less money in the kitty I assure you that the trees matter least.

Then also you have an influx of crap competitors as they lost their jobs but gravitate toward the industries that have no regulations, heck some might even get their ISA cert online or in the next bottle floating past at the beach, either way, the steady pay check will be like a paid holiday to you after being self employed.

Good luck, and who gives a rats what people think, do what is right for you. Have a look around and smell the roses .... more hacks now than there ever was. Wise move, move on.

Thanks, Eric! Well said.

 

[mckeetree]

I am getting ready to get my utility certification and then I think I may leave the residential gig scene. While I like the challenges of different types of tree work situations at different times, the general work slow-down in my area is starting to get very old and very frustrating. I am starting to feel very negative towards homeowners who wait until their trees have rotted out and/or fallen on their homes before calling me. I do understand that many folks are now out of work or operating on a drastically reduced budget, but that doesn't put any money in my pocket. Early on, Asplundh and Davey discovered the value in utility clearance work, and I think I now have done the same: Utility wires ALWAYS need to be kept clear. The public may ignore that rotted-out Cottonwood even after it falls in their yard, but if it takes out their block's electricity in the process, then all hell breaks loose in the whole neighborhood. The big boys started to make their billions by piggy-backing with the major electricity providers just as lines were being strung for telegraph use, way back. Now, I think I'll follow their lead. Punching a clock for the utility company, down here, may not be a bad scene. There is a great deal to be said for a steady check and full benefits. I can see myself driving around town, in a city car, checking out lines that need clearing and checking up on crews doing the work. I can always keep climbing, on weekends, although I know I may miss the more hands-on aspects of my present gig. Since I really like public contact and I'm good at smoothing out ruffled feathers, I actually look forward to notifying customers about their upcoming clearance work and why it needs to be done.

Sounds O.K. I know where you are coming from.

 

[treevet]

Hard to take orders when you've had your own gig. And correct me if I am wrong but don't you have your own lab? It is gonna kill you to witness the way they treat trees.

Whatever you do good luck.

Sometimes I wish I was a 9 to fiver.

 

[Sunrise Guy]

Hard to take orders when you've had your own gig. And correct me if I am wrong but don't you have your own lab? It is gonna kill you to witness the way they treat trees.

Whatever you do good luck.

Sometimes I wish I was a 9 to fiver.

Yes, I do have my own lab. You are absolutely correct that I will have a rough time taking orders from others. I have been self-employed since I was a kid: Musician for twenty years, tattooist for twelve. I am trying to get jobs, for my company, any way I can, now, so I don't have to start punching a clock, but times are tight, these days. This is a strange time for many, I'm sure.

 

[treevet]

Lots of gypsies and weekend warriors around here but not feeling the crunch (yet). Got a little too much work but have always stayed as small as poss., just me and gm (ca) and a 40 year upper middle class clientele.

I may eat my words tho, you never know. I am still buying stuff like the hurricane was still here and looking for a much bigger place to operate out of.

Tell us a little about your biz?

 

[Rftreeman]

Don't rely 100% on the utility business, it's bid work just the same as residential and it's even more cut throat then residential plus big Orange, green & yellow as well as many others loves to watch the small companies fail, they will bid very low just to get the work, been there seen it and had them on my ass asking why we aren't making money.

 

[Greenstar]

WOW, interesting thread Sunrise! I'd be curious to find out what you do?
There are definitely ways to cut expenses and expand the different types of services you offer, however it does take some flexibility, and there's a learning curve.
Either way I'd love to hear how you are making out.

I've seen your website before and it is very impressive though!

I personall am working on clearer cut and dry job descriptions with check boxes on my invoice and estimaton sheets, to make estimating and writing up jobs easier. Easier on the clients, as well as myself and my crew!
Brochures, educational handouts, new very descriptive estimate sheets, etc..

 

[clearance]

Don't rely 100% on the utility business, it's bid work just the same as residential and it's even more cut throat then residential plus big Orange, green & yellow as well as many others loves to watch the small companies fail, they will bid very low just to get the work, been there seen it and had them on my ass asking why we aren't making money.

I have heard this as well. And the utility wants to squeeze the nickels till the beaver screams. That is they want the contractors to do as much as possible for next to nothing.

 

[Sunrise Guy]

My business has always been aimed at mainly residential. I have done too many pruning and take-down gigs to count, lots of Oak Wilt testing and treating, some installations, some consulting with lab work-ups, some red-tag remediation work.

I do not see the economy turning around, contrary to what the news folks and pundits are yapping about. As such, as Eric has said, earlier, people are cutting way back on what they are willing to pop for, and trees, unfortunately, are very low priority, fairly often.

The utility gig I may go after is not for my company and not with a tree company. Rather, I am thinking about applying for a position with the utility company, here, as a field inspector. These guys drive around town checking out possible hazard-tree situations near their lines and also keep tabs on the clearance crews that sub in from the two mega-companies down here.

I know that the situation may turn around, as it has in the past, and I will forget about working for others, as I have forgotten many times before. This time it feels a bit different, though. This time I'm not sure I have faith in our economy and the people who are messing around with it, and I do not mean that along any partisan lines.

If tighter restrictions were placed on our profession, with very heavy fines for unlicensed workers and companies, I am certain that I would not be in the situation I am now in, and have been in, before. In my last profession, as a tattooist, body piercer and owner of the first licensed tattoo shop in Texas, I saw the lack of restrictive licensing glut the field, and so I got out. Those in our business who fear such controls just don't understand that when they protest the same, they are shooting themselves in the foot, and since I've seen how such lax oversight can ruin a very nice gig, I know what I'm talking about, trust me. The tighter the controls, the more oversight, rules and regulations there are to get into a given field, the better all those who actually do get in will do. Don't believe me? Hey, just ask the AMA or any of your multi-millionaire doctors who take care of you. The more screw factors there are, the more roadblocks there are to get into a profession, the greater the chances that most will say, "Screw it!" and give up on trying to get into it. The end result is that those who tough it out and do get in enjoy a very nice income and job security.

 

[clearance]

So you are going to be nickel squeezer then! Some utility supervisors are good guys, others are culls. Seems that the azz kissers rise up the ladder. Stay in the field, be yourself, don't climb the ladder, it ain't you, seen enough of you here to know that. Good luck to you.

 

[newsawtooth]

Regulation

My business has always been aimed at mainly residential. I have done too many pruning and take-down gigs to count, lots of Oak Wilt testing and treating, some installations, some consulting with lab work-ups, some red-tag remediation work.

I do not see the economy turning around, contrary to what the news folks and pundits are yapping about. As such, as Eric has said, earlier, people are cutting way back on what they are willing to pop for, and trees, unfortunately, are very low priority, fairly often.

The utility gig I may go after is not for my company and not with a tree company. Rather, I am thinking about applying for a position with the utility company, here, as a field inspector. These guys drive around town checking out possible hazard-tree situations near their lines and also keep tabs on the clearance crews that sub in from the two mega-companies down here.

I know that the situation may turn around, as it has in the past, and I will forget about working for others, as I have forgotten many times before. This time it feels a bit different, though. This time I'm not sure I have faith in our economy and the people who are messing around with it, and I do not mean that along any partisan lines.

If tighter restrictions were placed on our profession, with very heavy fines for unlicensed workers and companies, I am certain that I would not be in the situation I am now in, and have been in, before. In my last profession, as a tattooist, body piercer and owner of the first licensed tattoo shop in Texas, I saw the lack of restrictive licensing glut the field, and so I got out. Those in our business who fear such controls just don't understand that when they protest the same, they are shooting themselves in the foot, and since I've seen how such lax oversight can ruin a very nice gig, I know what I'm talking about, trust me. The tighter the controls, the more oversight, rules and regulations there are to get into a given field, the better all those who actually do get in will do. Don't believe me? Hey, just ask the AMA or any of your multi-millionaire doctors who take care of you. The more screw factors there are, the more roadblocks there are to get into a profession, the greater the chances that most will say, "Screw it!" and give up on trying to get into it. The end result is that those who tough it out and do get in enjoy a very nice income and job security.

That's it Sunrise. Say what you will about the negatives of regulation, it does protect the interests of professionals. Quite frankly, professional arborists need help protecting their own interests. I've said it here before, but the roadblocks you mentioned are what Warren Buffett calls impediments to entering a business. The larger the impediments, the better the profit margin because more people are excluded from the business. If we had something like the AMA we would be better off. The ISA and TCIA are a start but they have no teeth.

Best of luck in your new venture.

 

[Sunrise Guy]

So you are going to be nickel squeezer then! Some utility supervisors are good guys, others are culls. Seems that the azz kissers rise up the ladder. Stay in the field, be yourself, don't climb the ladder, it ain't you, seen enough of you here to know that. Good luck to you.

Thanks, man. I sincerely appreciate it. Ultimately, economics will decide my course of action.

 

[treevet]

I'd advise to go with your heart (if at all possible). Life is too short and a work day is too long to do otherwise.

All of us consider giving it up at sometime.

 

[mckeetree]

All of us consider giving it up at sometime.

I am considering it. I was going to stick with this until the end of 2013 and then quit but I don't know if I even want to stay that long.

 

[Sunrise Guy]

I am considering it. I was going to stick with this until the end of 2013 and then quit but I don't know if I even want to stay that long.

I know both of us are pretty strong-willed guys who try our best to do what's right with our businesses. I also know, since we're neighbors, that we are both going through the same !@#$ when it comes to dealing with a certain "segment of our population base" who compete for our customers without ever paying their dues, literally or figuratively. At times, I get so angry over that to the point where I just want to drop out of the whole scene. I think the world would be the worse for either of us leaving the field of arboriculture. So, I am going to try to hang in there, and I think you should, too, provided you can make the living you feel most comfortable with. Again, economics will dictate the paths we take, I'm sure.

 

[tree MDS]

I am considering it. I was going to stick with this until the end of 2013 and then quit but I don't know if I even want to stay that long.

This is not the way its supposed to go down. we're supposed to run the hacks out of town - not the other way around.

Come on guys! What happened to the hate? mckeetree: you miserable old bastard, I know theres some fight left in ya!

 

[Sunrise Guy]

This is not the way its supposed to go down. we're supposed to run the hacks out of town - not the other way around.

Come on guys! What happened to the hate? mckeetree: you miserable old bastard, I know theres some fight left in ya!

Sounds good, doesn't work. Only tighter controls, high licensing fees, etc., will get the hacks to die down, if not out.

 

[mckeetree]

This is not the way its supposed to go down. we're supposed to run the hacks out of town - not the other way around.

Come on guys! What happened to the hate? mckeetree: you miserable old bastard, I know theres some fight left in ya!

You're right. It wasn't supposed to go down like this. The brown guys and the hacks have got pricing down to third world levels around here. I am competing with guys that live in 200 sq. ft. shacks and old trailer houses that should be condemned. I don't have much fight left in me.