opinion on hazard tree assessment

[nytreeman]

Heres a few more of the rot,I knew it had to be to some degree rotted,but I was really amazed the extent of it,in the trunk there still was a substantial amount holding but at about 2 ft up from the base to below ground level everything was rotted away and honeycombed by the ants,there was only 2-3 inches of wood left in spots beneath the cambium holding that 100 ft+ tree up at a 15 to 20 % lean

 

[nytreeman]

The tree has substantial lean >20% towards house, with no visible rooting problems, ie. no lifting root mat etc. From a distance the tree is correcting itself 'sweep'. The reason why I was contacted to look at the tree is because someone noticed a spiral crack (not open) which is on the windward/ tension side of the tree. Banged the tree with a mallet and it sounds like it is sound, and it appears that there is callus forming around the crack/fissure.

this could of been exact description of the tree above too !!!!

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

That "big fat buttress" right next to the sidewalk, could be a sign of reaction wood over decay. There are some horizontal cracks in the bark that often indicate fiber separation underneath.

I cannot see it well, but the upper canopy looks like it is showing signs of decline. Another indicator of possible root problems.

The maple behind it looks like it has elephants foot on the sidewalk side of it's base.

Big old trees right by sidewalks can be scary.

 

[Ekka]

There's a distinct difference in the two scenarios.

The proximity of the side walk straight away should raise alarm bells. The bellowing out of the lower trunk is the second clue and the crack stops where there's a distinct difference in the bellowing.

That would have warranted a drill test (resistograph) and root flare inspection and test.

Also there was no pruning done that I could see. Going back to what I originally stated for the thread subject tree a 30% thinning of this tree's upper 1/3 of canopy and more thinning down the trunk. Maybe Treeseer would re-evaluate his low dosage now.

So what you had here was a grossly misdiagnosed tree with no remedial works at all ... darn near negligence!

To know there's a problem is one thing, to do nothing about it is stupid.

Big Termite, for the record the tree in my pic back one page is in high traffic and target area, carpark, bus stop and university main entrance. I would say 10K+ people traffic with stationary targets in addition to that ..... 18 hours a day.

However the tree is relatively "thinned" compared to the trees shown here but what branches it does have are way longer.

 

[Bigus Termitius]

Big Termite, for the record the tree in my pic back one page is in high traffic and target area, carpark, bus stop and university main entrance. I would say 10K+ people traffic with stationary targets in addition to that ..... 18 hours a day.

However the tree is relatively "thinned" compared to the trees shown here but what branches it does have are way longer.

I would have never guessed, Sunday morning picture? There's not a soul in the pics, no sleeping children anyway.

I'll take your word for it; I was thinking that it was parked on an estate somewhere where the owner has more money than commonsense.

So this one is in whose care, Brisbane? The university?

It is a grand tree alright, it'll be a shame to lose it, but I suppose they'll manage to get along without it someday.

Since it does get so much attention, perhaps they'll be able to head disaster off at the pass. Do you suppose I'll hear about it if they don't?

Nevertheless, success, for the moment, in Brisbane doesn't speak for all leaners everywhere, obviously. I'd say most speak very loudly to the contrary.

Howbeit, hindsight is always 20/20. Even when it is simple as saying to yourself, "I knew I shouldn't have taken the bus this morning."

 

[Ekka]

Yeah, Brisbane City Council's care.

I'd be thinning it some, the top 1/2 anyway.

Eventually all trees return to earth, get a big tower next to that one to work on it.

 

[nytreeman]

Heres a few more of the rot,I knew it had to be to some degree rotted,but I was really amazed the extent of it,in the trunk there still was a substantial amount holding but at about 2 ft up from the base to below ground level everything was rotted away and honeycombed by the ants,there was only 2-3 inches of wood left in spots beneath the cambium holding that 100 ft+ tree up at a 15 to 20 % lean

pics must have been to big here they are smaller

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Still way too big

 

[nytreeman]

There's a distinct difference in the two scenarios.


The proximity of the side walk straight away should raise alarm bells. The bellowing out of the lower trunk is the second clue and the crack stops where there's a distinct difference in the bellowing.

Actually the crack was about 15 ft long and went right to the base at ground level right through the big flair,the tree had the lean for a long long time because it had a long curve where it had gradually corrected over the years,at the time we had counted the rings on the tree above the rot and it was at least 115-120 years old,no lifting of the walk showed,no surface roots,the crack was totally closed,heavily callused,I agree more investigation could have shown the extent of the rot but regardless she didn't want the tree removed.

So what you had here was a grossly misdiagnosed tree with no remedial works at all ... darn near negligence!
To know there's a problem is one thing, to do nothing about it is stupid.

Even though I had repeatedly advised her of the importance of removing this tree ,she was more concerned with the closer trees that were "more problematic" at the time so I had her sign off on it.If there is negligence involved it certainly wasnt on my part.
Her house was surrounded by tall trees,probably planted around or shortly after the time the house was built,it was originally an old farm house with hewn pegged beams the deed goes back to 1850,the town she is in is Clinton Ny a very old college town,home of Hamilton college full of 100+ yr old trees many of which are protected,even some of the sidewalk blocks have the years in them many going back into the 1800,s. There was a 125 ft 150 yr old multi leaderd Austrian pine next to her driveway that was in decline dropping limbs and pitch,and cones and had already damaged there cars,I had trimmed it several times before it was removed,several huge spruces,that also were next to the house,a huge dying ash leaning towards the neighbors,a giant hollow black cherry behind her house all dead dying or damaged trees,dead maples in the hedgline.I've removed about 15 huge trees from her 2 acres and still to this day on the other side of the driveway there are still two more Norways that lean towards her house ,right next to the sidewalk I have advised her should be thinned plus a giant dying sugar maple which needs removal.Each one has the potential to cause significant damage to her house but if they don't want the work done even after being advised what can you do??

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

Still way too big

Yep.


www.xnview.com

Free. Easy. Do it.

OR,

www.imageshack.us

Spare the poor guys on dial up! Shrink your photos!

 

[nytreeman]

Still way too big

sorry edited the post and resized them again

 

[Ekka]

Nytreeman,

So she does nothing and tell me, was it the insurance company that picked up the tab for the damage?

If so, send them the link to this thread so they can see how stupid their risk assessment is.

There's an ole saying over here, "ignore it then claim it on insurance."

 

[Greenleaf]

Was contacted today by both the homeowner and the town. Because the tree lies right on the street right of way boundary and resident property line they made a joint decision to remove the tree. We will be taking it down next week.

This has been interesting to see so many points of view when it comes hazard assessments.

 

[clearance]

Was contacted today by both the homeowner and the town. Because the tree lies right on the street right of way boundary and resident property line they made a joint decision to remove the tree. We will be taking it down next week.

This has been interesting to see so many points of view when it comes hazard assessments.

Good, be carefull, and have fun.

 

[nytreeman]

Nytreeman,

So she does nothing and tell me, was it the insurance company that picked up the tab for the damage?

If so, send them the link to this thread so they can see how stupid their risk assessment is.

There's an ole saying over here, "ignore it then claim it on insurance."

I totally agree with you Ekka it's ridiculous,you bet the insurance paid I know the estimate of the damage to the house was around $ 35,000.00 and $2,000.00 for me to take the tree off the house.If they had had it removed in the first place I would have charged them $1,600.00 including the stump but now they have a nice brand new wall, roof,siding etc.
thats why our homeowners insurance goes up and up ...............

 

[Ekka]

Yep, people here think as long as they dont get hurt their better off with them falling down, only costs them the excess (deductable).

Greenleaf, when you cut it down take some pics of the lower basal cuts, see what that crack is all about.

 

[Bigus Termitius]

Yeah, Brisbane City Council's care.

I'd be thinning it some, the top 1/2 anyway.

Eventually all trees return to earth, get a big tower next to that one to work on it.

Would that then become the Leaning Tower of Brisbane?

Why not? Worked out well for that long lost tree of Pisa.

 

[Ekka]

I meant tower as in bucket truck.

 

[Greenleaf]

Finally got around to dealing with the debated cracked spruce.

Skinned up one side of the tree on ascent to lessen the forces on the stem during top removal. Had hoped to send a fairly big top, but as I got up into it it had multiple leaders and having a new ground guy on the rope figured I'd send a couple smaller ones to get him honed in on rigging.

We blocked it down to a good size and pulled it across the road against the lean using a 5:1. From the pics you can see the extent of the crack running almost right through the full diameter. Some discoloration doesn't show up very well in the photos, but some early signs of decay setting in. Figure this crack formed about 2 years ago from talking with some of the neighbors who have noticed it. Unfortunately I blundered and didn't set down some pieces for the butt to bounce on and put a crack in the cement garden retainer

 

[clearance]

Its done. A bit curious about you stripping of one side of the branches first. Tree had to go but it seemed no problem to climb, at all. I climbed a dead Doug fir beside the powerline the other day, just strip and chunk, your tree was alive, so whats up? From the pictures you posted earlier it looked like you could have blown off the whole thing with no or very little rigging. Not dissing you, maybe there was something I missed. But then again, I am known as a risk taker to some, no guts, no glory.

Main thing is its down, good one Green.